"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message , at 21:21:35 on Tue, 10 Dec
2019, tim... remarked:


"Roland Perry" wrote in message news:IcBsO7XkW67dF
...
In message , at 12:55:29 on Tue, 10 Dec
2019, tim... remarked:


"Roland Perry" wrote in message newsVw+cX8hmp7
...
In message , at 18:45:13 on Mon, 9 Dec
2019, tim... remarked:

you seem to be arguing that trucks hauling trailers, as opposed
to flat beds with a container on top, are somehow different on
their effect to other road users

don't see that distinction myself

The distinction is whether or not they can be abstracted from the
road by sticking them on a train.

for me, the distinction was the fact that you claimed it's an urban
myth that there's a minimal number of "containers" using road

No, I said it was an urban myth that *more* than a handful of
containers were using the road.

you need to explain how that's not the same thing

Because the public apparently look at curtain sided HGVs with UK
domestic brand logos, and identify it as a container that's arrived
from the Far East at Felixstowe (and should be on a train)

I had already understood that point

but how is "(not) more than a handful" different to "minimal number"?

You've got yourself tied in a knot (again).

No

I was just asking you how your correction of my comment was any different to
that which I posted?

The urban myth is that the
A14 project exists so that:

trucks can save 10 mins on their way from Felixstowe instead of
putting the containers on trains where they should be.

Can't say that I've ever seen anybody claim this (except boltar) so it
certainly isn't a factor in my posts

I've driven that road many times. I know why it needed to be updated.

But I also know that the number of trucks on the road is far more than a
handful.

And I will confess that I would have suggested that these trucks had come
from the Essex ports, and I would have probably suggested that they were
containers.

I'm quite happy for you to correct me that they are not containers, but even
so, the trucks are there and they must have come from somewhere.


Most people won't distinguish between containers and trailers

they are both annoying vehicles to have surrounding you and they
have both come off the ferry.

Not off the container ships. And probably not off the completely
separate RORO ferries. If you look at the HGVs on the A14 they are
predominately domestic-domestic.

even if they are, they are still using that route as a proxy for
M25/A1 that they used to use

What has that got to do with moving containers onto rail?

nothing

the point is that people see "trucks"

and it is the trucks that they want taken off the road (were possible)

your fixation with people wrongly calling them containers has blinkered
you into thinking that they only want the containers removed

The previous poster confirmed my view that local people (wrongly)
believe the port traffic is a crucial, or even significant, contributor
to the traffic congestion:

trucks ... on their way from Felixstow instead of putting the
containers on trains where they should be.

would that have been boltar - you know his claims have no credibility

and there's no evidence that the post came from someone with local knowledge

It just came from someone with a "goods should be carried by rail" prejudice
(and to be fair there's nothing actually wrong with thinking that)

trying to tell people that "there aren't many containers off the
ferry" without making it clear that you aren't counting most of the
trucks because they are trailers, is daft

See above; I wasn't claiming that.

still don't see it

What's "it"? Containers on the A14, in which case I'll agree with you.

I still don't see that people only want the containers off the road,

See above.

doesn't help because you're the one who's gone done the path of not
understanding the point

so that you can say "but they are" because they have wrongly identified
trucks pulling trailers as flat bed containers

you're just scoring points in a logic exam, not adressing the actual
problem

Which problem do you have in mind: easing the congestion itself, or
identifying the causes of the congestion?

the cause, or more specifically establishing what percentage of the cause is
trucks.

You can't do the former properly, without having first done the latter.

At no time in this thread have I been discussing anything other than
counting "trucks" on the road

so any other points are irrelevant

tim