HS2 are proposing an interchange between High Speed 2, Crossrail, and
all services out of Paddington (including the Heathrow express), at
Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of

(a) the West London Line
(b) the North London Line
and (c) the Central Line

serving the new station. Old Oak Common could become more important
than Stratford or Clapham Junction.

HS2 don't seem to have investigated (a)-(c) yet, but they are shown as
possibilities in the government command paper.

What are people's views on how plausible these extra interchanges are?
I don't know the area well myself.

The West London Line would be particularly useful for the link with
Clapham Junction. But I imagine there would be dangerous overcrowding
with the current level of service. How much scope is there to upgrade/
get the freight off the route if it became a priority for investment?

It would also only be one stop from Old Oak interchange to Willesden
Junction, for the Bakerloo and West Coast Main Line.

Layout of proposed station (page 83):

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/pi/hi.../chapter3a.pdf

(The top platforms are HS2, bottom ones are Crossrail/Great Western.
The Central Line is shown in red in the bottom left, the NLL is shown
in orange on the left and the WLL is shown in orange on the right.)

Satellite view of the site:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?hl=en&...-8&sa=N&tab=wl

Diagram of the possible interchanges on p107 of the DfT white paper:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/pi/hi...pdf/cmdpap.pdf

(cross posted to uk.railway and uk.transport.london)

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 09:25:07 -0700 (PDT), kev
wrote:

HS2 are proposing an interchange between High Speed 2, Crossrail, and
all services out of Paddington (including the Heathrow express), at
Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of

(a) the West London Line
(b) the North London Line
and (c) the Central Line

serving the new station. Old Oak Common could become more important
than Stratford or Clapham Junction.

HS2 don't seem to have investigated (a)-(c) yet, but they are shown as
possibilities in the government command paper.

What are people's views on how plausible these extra interchanges are?
I don't know the area well myself.

snip


I think it's an excellent idea. In fact it is such a good idea that
Old Oak Common (OOC) should be the terminus of High Speed 2.

If OOC is going to include interchanges with all those lines, there's
precious little point going on to Euston where interchange
opportunities will be far fewer. That will also save the not
inconsiderable cost of rebuilding Euston.

On 18 Mrz., 19:36, Bruce wrote:
2. *

If OOC is going to include interchanges with all those lines, there's
precious little point going on to Euston where interchange
opportunities will be far fewer. *That will also save the not
inconsiderable cost of rebuilding Euston.- Zitierten Text ausblenden -


Can't do that. The propylaeum would look entirely out of place at Old
Oak Common :-)

On 18 Mar, 18:36, Bruce wrote:
On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 09:25:07 -0700 (PDT), kev



wrote:
HS2 are proposing an interchange between High Speed 2, Crossrail, and
all services out of Paddington (including the Heathrow express), at
Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of

(a) the West London Line
(b) the North London Line
and (c) the Central Line

serving the new station. Old Oak Common could become more important
than Stratford or Clapham Junction.

HS2 don't seem to have investigated (a)-(c) yet, but they are shown as
possibilities in the government command paper.

What are people's views on how plausible these extra interchanges are?
I don't know the area well myself.

snip

I think it's an excellent idea. *In fact it is such a good idea that
Old Oak Common (OOC) should be the terminus of High Speed 2. *

If OOC is going to include interchanges with all those lines, there's
precious little point going on to Euston where interchange
opportunities will be far fewer. *That will also save the not
inconsiderable cost of rebuilding Euston.

High Speed 2 considered this. Their conclusion:

"Old Oak Common: Further demand analysis continued to suggest that the
journey time penalty for central London passengers using these
stations as the only London terminal was likely to severely reduce the
benefits of HS2. A Crossrail connection at Old Oak Common or Willesden
Junction would allow some passengers a quicker journey time to the
East or West of London, but the bulk of the demand for HS2 would come
from the central, north and south of London which would be best served
by a central London station."

See p59:

http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/rail/pi/hi...f/chapter3.pdf

On Mar 18, 6:36*pm, Bruce wrote:

Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of

and (c) the Central Line

serving the new station.

I think it's an excellent idea. *In fact it is such a good idea that
Old Oak Common (OOC) should be the terminus of High Speed 2. *


Not the Central Line no.

We are already at capacity, more or less.

The last thing we need on the Central is a major new flow form a
source like that. We already run 30 TPH with the biggest tube size
tube trains on the network. Crossrail will offer relief to the Central
but I suspect by the time that opens grwoth will be such that both
will actually be relieving each other.

--
Nick

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010, D7666 wrote:

On Mar 18, 6:36*pm, Bruce wrote:

Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of and (c) the Central Line serving
the new station.

Not the Central Line no.

We are already at capacity, more or less.

The last thing we need on the Central is a major new flow form a source
like that. We already run 30 TPH with the biggest tube size tube trains
on the network. Crossrail will offer relief to the Central but I suspect
by the time that opens grwoth will be such that both will actually be
relieving each other.

I am trying to picture two tube lines relieving each other. There are
probably very, very specialist magazines for that.

tom

--
1 pWN 3v3Ry+h1n G!!!1

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010 11:39:30 -0700 (PDT), amogles
wrote:
On 18 Mrz., 19:36, Bruce wrote:
2. *

If OOC is going to include interchanges with all those lines, there's
precious little point going on to Euston where interchange
opportunities will be far fewer. *That will also save the not
inconsiderable cost of rebuilding Euston.- Zitierten Text ausblenden -


Can't do that. The propylaeum would look entirely out of place at Old
Oak Common :-)


Perhaps a scale model?

On Mar 18, 10:01*pm, Tom Anderson wrote:

On Thu, 18 Mar 2010, D7666 wrote:

On Mar 18, 6:36*pm, Bruce wrote:

Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of and (c) the Central Line serving
the new station.

Not the Central Line no.

We are already at capacity, more or less.

The last thing we need on the Central is a major new flow form a source
like that. We already run 30 TPH with the biggest tube size tube trains
on the network. Crossrail will offer relief to the Central but I suspect
by the time that opens grwoth will be such that both will actually be
relieving each other.

I am trying to picture two tube lines relieving each other. There are
probably very, very specialist magazines for that.

What can I say... I'm glad you got there first.

(...no, I didn't mean it like that...)

On 18 Mar, 19:53, D7666 wrote:
On Mar 18, 6:36*pm, Bruce wrote:

Old Oak Common.

But there's also the possibility of

and (c) the Central Line

serving the new station.
I think it's an excellent idea. *In fact it is such a good idea that
Old Oak Common (OOC) should be the terminus of High Speed 2. *

Not the Central Line no.

We are already at capacity, more or less.

The last thing we need on the Central is a major new flow form a
source like that. We already run 30 TPH with the biggest tube size
tube trains on the network. Crossrail will offer relief to the Central
but I suspect by the time that opens grwoth will be such that both
will actually be relieving each other.

n Nick

North Acton station will be within walking distance.

On Thu, Mar 18, 2010 at 09:25:07AM -0700, kev wrote:

The West London Line would be particularly useful for the link with
Clapham Junction. But I imagine there would be dangerous overcrowding
with the current level of service.

They'd have to use longer trains, presumably with selective door opening
because extending Imperial Wharf and West Brompton's platforms could be
tricky. Thankfully, those aren't very important stations, especially
for people going to/from HS2.

How much scope is there to upgrade/
get the freight off the route if it became a priority for investment?

It's a pretty busy freight route, outside of the passenger peaks. While
waiting for a train yesterday evening three freight trains went through
in fifteen minutes.

--
David Cantrell | Minister for Arbitrary Justice

There's no problem so complex that it can't be solved
by killing everyone even remotely associated with it