wrote:
On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 20:50:33 +0000
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 20:05:39 on Wed, 6 Nov
2019, remarked:
On Wed, 6 Nov 2019 09:38:02 +0000
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 22:16:22 on Sun, 3 Nov 2019,
Recliner remarked:

It's not just tourists and Heathrow workers who have to get to the airport:
plenty of British travellers and savvy foreign travellers use the airport
too. Any of them who have been HEx users will switch to Crossrail when it's
fully open, and not just because it's cheaper. That won't leave enough
premium payers on HEx to keep it viable.

It'll leave all the first-time visitors, which will probably be the

Why would it? I'm sure most of them can read a metro map and will immediately
spot the lines that go to central london and won't much care for the one
that goes to a bears home.

For the reasons I've explained why airport express services are more
attractive than the local commuter services.

I think you're underestimating them. Its not the 1990s anymore where tourists
rock up in a new place scratching their heads and clutching a Lonely Planet
book not quite sure what to do. I imagine most of them will have done their
homework online including the best way to get from the airport to their hotel
and if that involves a train no doubt Crossrail will feature.

Aside from Hex I suspect the piccadilly line will face a hefty slump in
passengers too given how slow and uncomfortable it is.

Yes, quite likely: for many pax, Crossrail will be the better option. I'm
not one of them, but will be delighted if the Tube trains are less packed.

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
It's vital to your thesis because HEx is catering for the high-end
airline passenger who has probably never visited London before, and just
wants to be spoon-fed an "airport express" service to the city centre.

If you say so, but it's hard to believe their business model assumed
that each passenger will make one trip in his lifetime. I cheerfully
agree that if your destination is near Paddington, HeX is quite handy,
particularly if you or your travel planner are able to think a few
days ahead and book a £15 fixed date return HeX ticket.

Here in the US, the normal thing at an airport is to rent a car, not
to take a taxi.

I think that's a huge stretch for the kind of travellers involved. For
example the first time I flew into Atlanta from the UK for a trade show
in the city centre, a hire car would be a huge liability. As would one
have been to a similar trade show six months later in New York.

If you're just going to downtown Atlanta or anywhere in NYC you're
right, a car is a bad idea. But they are not typical of US cities or
airports. I have visted a friend who lives on the Emory campus at the
north edge of Atlanta. You can get there on MARTA and a bus, but it's
quite slow. A taxi is quite expensive since it takes hour with
traffic, and you'll typically want a car at your destination anyway
since restaurants and such are rarely within walking distance.

--
Regards,
John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

On 08/11/2019 20:23, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 14:37:03 on Fri, 8 Nov
2019, MissRiaElaine remarked:
On 08/11/2019 06:30, John Levine wrote:

Here in the US, the normal thing at an airport is to rent a car, not
to take a taxi.

I've never done that when arriving from the UK. I'm usually too
jet-lagged to even think about driving. I mostly stay with friends, so
either they pick me up or I get a taxi. If I need a car, I'll get it
the next day.

I have picked up cars at airports on internal flights, though.

UK internal, or USA internal?

USA internal. San Francisco to San Diego usually. Although I did get a
car one time when I flew from Aberdeen to Birmingham to visit the mother
(a dirty job, but it has to be done..!)

Back in the day, I did once have a long weekend in Glasgow which
involved a flight from London and a rental car. But that was when
I had a very well paid job where being on any kind of holiday was
hugely disapproved of. So one had to flit around within strict
limits, that would not have allowed any other means of transport
(other than perhaps a private helicopter).

That would be nice, I could mess around in a Bell 206 JetRanger all day..!

--
Ria in Aberdeen

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On 07/11/2019 21:39, Recliner wrote:


Not just central London: Ealing Broadway may be more convenient for people
heading to west London, and people going to the City or Canary Wharf would
be crazy to take HEx rather than Crossrail.


We usually stay close to the Ace Cafe (good grub there) so that's what
we intend to do from now on. Piccadilly to Acton Town, District to
Ealing Broadway, then the 112 bus round to Wembley instead of going
right into Zone 1.

In article ,
Recliner wrote:
Aside from Hex I suspect the piccadilly line will face a hefty slump in
passengers too given how slow and uncomfortable it is.

Yes, quite likely: for many pax, Crossrail will be the better option. I'm
not one of them, but will be delighted if the Tube trains are less packed.

Since TfL gets the fare whether you take the Picc or Crossrail,
wouldn't that be their cunning plan to free up more underground
capacity?






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Regards,
John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

In article ,
Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
In article , Roland Perry
writes
As a result, and even as a more adventurous traveller (colleagues were
amazed I dared get a bus from Geneva to the airport, and didn't even
consider rail) I think I've only once got a train on first arrival at a
suitably equipped overseas airport.

Working backwards through my travel log.

This is all consistent with my experience.

San Francisco: always been going somewhere that needs a car, though I
have used the San Jose trams (and once acted as conductor on one).

Never took BART into the city? Works great.

Montreal: from memory, express bus to the city (Dorval train wasn't
workable) but metro in the city.

I was in Montreal yesterday. The express 747 bus runs between the
airport and downtown. There is a shuttle from the Dorval station to
the airport but only for Via Rail intercity passengers, not Exo local
passengers, snd you need to call the shuttle from your mobile to tell
it to pick you up at the airport. For arcane reasons of language
politics, the metro goes nowhere near the airport.

DFW: rented a car because it's nowhere near D or FW with no public
transport I can find.

There's now a tram that runs into Dallas, fine if you're going where
it goes. Otherwise you need a car.



--
Regards,
John Levine, , Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies",
Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly

John Levine wrote:
In article ,
Recliner wrote:
Aside from Hex I suspect the piccadilly line will face a hefty slump in
passengers too given how slow and uncomfortable it is.

Yes, quite likely: for many pax, Crossrail will be the better option. I'm
not one of them, but will be delighted if the Tube trains are less packed.

Since TfL gets the fare whether you take the Picc or Crossrail,
wouldn't that be their cunning plan to free up more underground
capacity?

I think both are cheap enough that pax will choose between them based on
convenience, not price. It really depends on whether the Piccadilly or
Crossrail routes suit you better.

Oddly enough, the only interchange stations between the Piccadilly and
Crossrail are at Heathrow, so they serve a different set of central London
stations. The Piccadilly then goes on to serve north London, and Crossrail,
the City and east London. So, if you're heading for Padd, Farringdon or
Liverpool St, choose Crossrail; for Kings Cross St Pancras, the Piccadilly.

On 08/11/2019 20:43, Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
In article , Roland Perry
writes
As a result, and even as a more adventurous traveller (colleagues were
amazed I dared get a bus from Geneva to the airport, and didn't even
consider rail) I think I've only once got a train on first arrival at a
suitably equipped overseas airport.

Working backwards through my travel log.

Vienna: caught the CAT train then the U-bahn to the hotel. No problem.
Possibly CAT is overpriced but it went to the right place and I could
buy a ticket right in the terminal.

You can buy a ticket for the S-Bahn at the terminal too. As we'd just
missed a CAT train we actually got to Mitte earlier than if we'd paid
the extra.

--
Graeme Wall
This account not read.

On Sat, 9 Nov 2019 02:18:00 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
John Levine wrote:
In article ,
Recliner wrote:
Aside from Hex I suspect the piccadilly line will face a hefty slump in
passengers too given how slow and uncomfortable it is.

Yes, quite likely: for many pax, Crossrail will be the better option. I'm
not one of them, but will be delighted if the Tube trains are less packed.

Since TfL gets the fare whether you take the Picc or Crossrail,
wouldn't that be their cunning plan to free up more underground
capacity?

I think both are cheap enough that pax will choose between them based on
convenience, not price. It really depends on whether the Piccadilly or
Crossrail routes suit you better.

Oddly enough, the only interchange stations between the Piccadilly and
Crossrail are at Heathrow, so they serve a different set of central London
stations. The Piccadilly then goes on to serve north London, and Crossrail,
the City and east London. So, if you're heading for Padd, Farringdon or
Liverpool St, choose Crossrail; for Kings Cross St Pancras, the Piccadilly.

Even if you're going somewhere in north london on the piccadilly line it
would probably still be considerably quicker to take crossrail and change
in central london twice. As for KX - Farringdon then 1 stop on the met or
thameslink, finsbury park - farringdon then 2 stops on thameslink (if they
can be bothered to run their trains on time just for once).

In message , at 00:01:49 on Sat, 9 Nov
2019, Sammi Gray-Jones remarked:
On 07/11/2019 21:39, Recliner wrote:

Not just central London: Ealing Broadway may be more convenient for
people heading to west London, and people going to the City or Canary
Wharf would be crazy to take HEx rather than Crossrail.

We usually stay close to the Ace Cafe (good grub there) so that's what
we intend to do from now on. Piccadilly to Acton Town, District to
Ealing Broadway, then the 112 bus round to Wembley instead of going
right into Zone 1.

As a regular visitor, you just ruled yourself out of HEx's target
market.

Will you be using Crossrail, rather than the tube, in future?
--
Roland Perry