Marc Brett wrote the following in:


On 16 Oct 2004 15:09:56 GMT, Robin May
wrote:

If I remember correctly, the A13 from between Canning Town and
Barking and beyond used to have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it
that after extensive improvements to the road this has gone down
to 40?

To improve conditions for local residents? The quieter road
surface may be a clue. It's not so you can hear the "Today"
program in your already-soundproofed car on your way to work.

I don't drive to work, I take the tube to university. I use the A13
occasionally for getting to Sainsbury's, the A406 or a friend's house
in Barking. I'm not saying this from the point of view of an angry
commuter but simply as someone who doesn't understand the purpose of
this seemingly unnecessarily slow speed limit.

It's so people who LIVE near the A13 (they exist, you know) can
hear themselves think.

But aren't there hardly any of them (people who LIVE near the A13)?
Most of the houses between Canning Town and Prince Regent lane were
either demolished during the improvements or are unoccupied. There are
some houses between Beckton and Prince Regent lane, and they're behind
a noise reducing fence. There's a housing estate a distance off to the
side of the A13 there as well but it's very recently built so they knew
what to expect when they moved in, and anyway the distance is probably
enough that the noise isn't too terrible.

The lower speed limit also helps buses
when they need to pull out into traffic, and makes cycling safer.

No one cycles on the A13 itself (they would be mad to, even with a
limit of 40!) and buses don't stop on it. There is a cycle path along
the side of the A13 but there was a cycle path there before when the
limit was 50.

--
message by the incredible Robin May.
"The British don't like successful people" - said by British failures

Who is Abi Titmuss? What is she? Why is she famous?
http://robinmay.fotopic.net

"umpston" wrote the following in:


"Mikael Armstrong" wrote in message
...

Most of the nearby residents directly affected by the road have
probably already been paid a share of our taxes to have double
glazing installed,
if
they don't already have it. Perhaps the limit should be 70mph as
the road designed for. That would mean motorists could save
nearly a quarter of an hour using your figures.

What on earthe makes you think it was designed for 70mph? It is
effectively a new road, so I expect it was in fact designed for
the new speed limit.

It seems very much to me like a road designed for at least 50mph. It's
very similar to 50mph sections of the A406. In fact I would even say
it's better suited to 50mph than some of those sections of the A406.
I'd also say it's better suited to speeds of 50mph than it used to be
when the speed limit was 50! Compare this to some 40mph roads like the
A1020 going down from the junction with the A13 and A406 past the Royal
Docks and I think it's clear that the A13 is suited to and designed for
speeds much higher than 40mph.

--
message by the incredible Robin May.
"The British don't like successful people" - said by British failures

Who is Abi Titmuss? What is she? Why is she famous?
http://robinmay.fotopic.net

On Sun, 17 Oct 2004 14:39:00 GMT, "Mikael Armstrong"
wrote:

"Marc Brett" wrote in message
.. .

The difference between 50mph and 40mph across the whole 14-mile stretch of
the
A13 improvements is the difference between a 17-minute journey and a 21
minute
journey (assuming you treat the speed limit as a target and hit it
perfectly).
That's an extra FOUR MINUTES on your commute.

Perhaps the limit should be 70mph as the road
designed for. That would mean motorists could save nearly a quarter of an
hour using your figures.

Not sure about your maths, there. At 70mph, you'd cover the 14 miles in 12
minutes. That's a 5 minute saving compared to 50mph, and a 9 minute saving
compared to 40mph. Where are you getting "nearly a quarter of an hour" from?

If you feel that strongly, reply to TfL's survey about the A13. I'm sure they'd
like to hear your views, and it has a better chance of getting acted upon than
sounding off on Usenet.

A13 Thames Gateway Road Improvements Questionnaire
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/streets/a13-questionnaire.shtml

Marc Brett wrote in message . ..
journey (assuming you treat the speed limit as a target and hit it perfectly).
That's an extra FOUR MINUTES on your commute. What's the problem in setting
your alarm clock 4 minutes earlier in the morning and just sticking to the speed
limit? You'll save wear-and tear on your car by not braking for GATSOs,

You could use that old argument to slow cars down to any speed you choose.
People seem to forget however that the whole purpose of cars is to get you
from A to B as quick as possible. If that wasn't the case you might as well
just turn the clock back 200 years and walk. IMO speed limits should be as
high as is safe on the given stretch of road. If this means 150mph on a
straight section of motorway or 20mph outside a school so be it.
Also if you are late for other reasons 4 minutes could be the difference
between having an easy day or getting a formal warning from your boss.

B2003

On 18 Oct 2004 04:06:00 -0700, (Boltar) wrote:

You could use that old argument to slow cars down to any speed you choose.
People seem to forget however that the whole purpose of cars is to get you
from A to B as quick as possible. If that wasn't the case you might as well
just turn the clock back 200 years and walk. IMO speed limits should be as
high as is safe on the given stretch of road. If this means 150mph on a
straight section of motorway or 20mph outside a school so be it.

Safety is important, but there are other considerations which must be taken in
to account. Local noise & atmospheric polution levels, and national oil
consumption rates, for a start. These things matter, even if vehicle drivers
aren't immediately affected by them.

Also if you are late for other reasons 4 minutes could be the difference
between having an easy day or getting a formal warning from your boss.

That's the case no matter how high or low the speed limits are. In other words,
it's irrelevant when choosing an appropriate speed limit for a given stretch of
road.

Robin May wrote in message ...
If I remember correctly, the A13 from between Canning Town and Barking
and beyond used to have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it that after
extensive improvements to the road this has gone down to 40?

Doesn't stop you getting from Ilford to Tower Hill in ~20 mins!

Speed limits:
Wennington - Dagenham - 70 (temporarily reduced for communications
installation)
Dagenham - Barking - 50 (despite Renwick Road lights westbound and
Gale Street access eastbound)
Barking - Canning Town - 40 (several side roads still access the
main-line)
Canning Town Flyover - 30 westbound (approach to A13 TOTSO and tunnel)
East India Dock Link - 30 (tunnel)
Aspen Way - 40 (one set of lights)
Limehouse Link - 30 (tunnel)

A13 pics:
http://groups.msn.com/TheSABRERoadsW...astlondon.msnw

"Mikael Armstrong" wrote in message ...
"Marc Brett" wrote in message
...
On 16 Oct 2004 15:09:56 GMT, Robin May
wrote:

If I remember correctly, the A13 from between Canning Town and Barking
and beyond used to have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it that after
extensive improvements to the road this has gone down to 40?

To improve conditions for local residents? The quieter road surface may
be a
clue. It's not so you can hear the "Today" program in your
already-soundproofed
car on your way to work. It's so people who LIVE near the A13 (they
exist, you
know) can hear themselves think. The lower speed limit also helps buses
when
they need to pull out into traffic, and makes cycling safer.

The difference between 50mph and 40mph across the whole 14-mile stretch of
the
A13 improvements is the difference between a 17-minute journey and a 21
minute
journey (assuming you treat the speed limit as a target and hit it
perfectly).
That's an extra FOUR MINUTES on your commute. What's the problem in
setting
your alarm clock 4 minutes earlier in the morning and just sticking to the
speed
limit? You'll save wear-and tear on your car by not braking for GATSOs,
you'll
save money by not paying speeding fines, you'll arrive less stressed at
work,
and you'll probably have fewer accidents. If EVERYBODY did it, there'd be
less
congestion caused by the GATSO-shy jackrabbits bunching up the traffic,
and the
journey times for everyone would be quicker. And, of course, the nearby
residents would be able to hear themselves think.

Most of the nearby residents directly affected by the road have probably
already been paid a share of our taxes to have double glazing installed, if
they don't already have it. Perhaps the limit should be 70mph as the road
designed for.

And the side roads? Would you turn right angles into a 70mph road?

That would mean motorists could save nearly a quarter of an
hour using your figures.

Mikael

Robin May wrote in message ...
Marc Brett wrote the following in:


On 16 Oct 2004 15:09:56 GMT, Robin May
wrote:

If I remember correctly, the A13 from between Canning Town and
Barking and beyond used to have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it
that after extensive improvements to the road this has gone down
to 40?

To improve conditions for local residents? The quieter road
surface may be a clue. It's not so you can hear the "Today"
program in your already-soundproofed car on your way to work.

I don't drive to work, I take the tube to university. I use the A13
occasionally for getting to Sainsbury's, the A406 or a friend's house
in Barking. I'm not saying this from the point of view of an angry
commuter but simply as someone who doesn't understand the purpose of
this seemingly unnecessarily slow speed limit.

It's so people who LIVE near the A13 (they exist, you know) can
hear themselves think.

But aren't there hardly any of them (people who LIVE near the A13)?

There are a number of houses DIRECTLY facing the eastbound near New Barn Street.

Most of the houses between Canning Town and Prince Regent lane were
either demolished during the improvements or are unoccupied. There are
some houses between Beckton and Prince Regent lane, and they're behind
a noise reducing fence. There's a housing estate a distance off to the
side of the A13 there as well but it's very recently built so they knew
what to expect when they moved in, and anyway the distance is probably
enough that the noise isn't too terrible.

The lower speed limit also helps buses
when they need to pull out into traffic, and makes cycling safer.

No one cycles on the A13 itself (they would be mad to, even with a
limit of 40!) and buses don't stop on it. There is a cycle path along
the side of the A13 but there was a cycle path there before when the
limit was 50.

I had the misfortune of travelling on this stretch not realising it was 50
and 40 in places. I have to say the one near the A406 is a bit suttle.


"Robin May" wrote in message
...
"John Rowland" wrote the
following in:

"John" wrote in message
...
In article , Robin May
writes

If I remember correctly, the A13 from between
Canning Town and Barking and beyond used to
have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it that after
extensive improvements to the road this has
gone down to 40?

Because it increases the camera revenue??

Correct. The only way that upgrading roads to 70mph quality can be
justified financially is if the new road has cameras busting
everyone going over 40.

Problem with this is that everyone knows where the cameras are and they
slow down accordingly! There's one between Prince Regent lane and
Beckton (eastbound), and another at the foot of the flyover just before
the exit for the A406 and Sainsbury's (eastbound). Between Sainsbury's
and Canning Town there are as far as I can tell none on the westbound
carriageway, although there may be one just before Canning Town.

Most people travel at 50-60 mph along this stretch and slow down for
the speed cameras, i.e. they act as if it's a 50mph road. I do it too
because why should I obey a speed limit which is so strangely low?

--
message by the incredible Robin May.
"The British don't like successful people" - said by British failures

Who is Abi Titmuss? What is she? Why is she famous?
http://robinmay.fotopic.net

"Dr. Sunil" wrote in message
om...
Robin May wrote in message
...
If I remember correctly, the A13 from between Canning Town and Barking
and beyond used to have a speed limit of 50mph. Why is it that after
extensive improvements to the road this has gone down to 40?

Doesn't stop you getting from Ilford to Tower Hill in ~20 mins!

Speed limits:
Wennington - Dagenham - 70 (temporarily reduced for communications
installation)
Dagenham - Barking - 50 (despite Renwick Road lights westbound and
Gale Street access eastbound)
Barking - Canning Town - 40 (several side roads still access the
main-line)
Canning Town Flyover - 30 westbound (approach to A13 TOTSO and tunnel)
East India Dock Link - 30 (tunnel)
Aspen Way - 40 (one set of lights)
Limehouse Link - 30 (tunnel)

A13 pics:
http://groups.msn.com/TheSABRERoadsW...astlondon.msnw


For some reason though the city is still signed via East India Dock
Road/Commercial Road and not Aspen Way/Limehouse Link.