Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying to me
TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route planner showing
the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so will
not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you want to see
all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a certain route is
not available (like the Waterloo and City line currently), then my
utility will help (and the visual aspect should be a bonus too).

You will be shown each route as a list of stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed lines, with
the source and destination stations marked by map pins. If you hover
over each green dot, the name of the station will be displayed.

I am trying to add some points of interest along each route, but it is
an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail me).

David

David Tran wrote:
Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying to me
TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route planner showing
the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so will
not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you want to see
all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a certain route is
not available (like the Waterloo and City line currently), then my
utility will help (and the visual aspect should be a bonus too).

You will be shown each route as a list of stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed lines, with
the source and destination stations marked by map pins. If you hover
over each green dot, the name of the station will be displayed.

I am trying to add some points of interest along each route, but it is
an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail me).

David

Hi

I just like to leave a message for Richard J, who made a comment about
the route from Marylebone to Turnham Green. I understand you are not
happy with the accuracy of this particular route, but it was contributed
by an anonymous user, and it would be wrong of me to remove it as you
suggested. I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how
accurate a route is, so if you know that this route is not correct, you
could always force it down the popularity list.

I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be responsible
for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.

David

David Tran wrote:
David Tran wrote:
Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying
to me TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route
planner showing the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so
will not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you
want to see all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a
certain route is not available (like the Waterloo and City line
currently), then my utility will help (and the visual aspect
should be a bonus too). You will be shown each route as a list of
stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed
lines, with the source and destination stations marked by map
pins. If you hover over each green dot, the name of the station
will be displayed. I am trying to add some points of interest along
each route, but
it is an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail
me). David

Hi

I just like to leave a message for Richard J, who made a comment
about the route from Marylebone to Turnham Green. I understand you
are not happy with the accuracy of this particular route, but it
was contributed by an anonymous user, and it would be wrong of me
to remove it as you suggested.

The route suggests Bakerloo Marylebone-Edgware Road, then walk to the
other Edgware Road and catch a District Line train to Ealing Broadway.
Ignoring the issue of whether the walk between the two Edgware Road
stations is preferable to a change at Paddington, the FACT is that
except possibly for a few workings, there are generally no direct trains
from Edgware Road to Ealing Broadway. Therefore, suggesting a route
which involves waiting at Edgware Road for an Ealing Broadway train is
WRONG. You can check this yourself on the TfL Journey Planner by asking
for a route from ER to EB and seeing how many direct trains it manages
to offer. Relying on voting to establish that this route as described
is "unpopular" (rather than downright wrong) is in my view a misuse of
democracy.

I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how accurate
a route is, so if you know that this route is not correct,
you could always force it down the popularity list.

You mean I can continually vote against it so that it collects hundreds
of negative votes? So it's not even democratic! But it's already at
the bottom of the popularity list of 3 routes, assuming that the routes
are listed in that order, and there are no voting numbers as far as I
can see. So just how am I supposed to know that it's not just 3rd out
of 3, but highly misleading?

I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be
responsible for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.

In that case the site is anarchic and has no value IMHO. I am tempted
to propose Marylebone-Oxford Circus, then the Central Line to Turnham
Green. Well, it was a proposed extension in 1928! And you wouldn't
remove it in the name of democracy? Daft!
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

Richard J. wrote:
David Tran wrote:

David Tran wrote:

Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying
to me TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route
planner showing the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so
will not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you
want to see all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a
certain route is not available (like the Waterloo and City line
currently), then my utility will help (and the visual aspect
should be a bonus too). You will be shown each route as a list of
stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed
lines, with the source and destination stations marked by map
pins. If you hover over each green dot, the name of the station
will be displayed. I am trying to add some points of interest along
each route, but
it is an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail
me). David


Hi

I just like to leave a message for Richard J, who made a comment
about the route from Marylebone to Turnham Green. I understand you
are not happy with the accuracy of this particular route, but it
was contributed by an anonymous user, and it would be wrong of me
to remove it as you suggested.


The route suggests Bakerloo Marylebone-Edgware Road, then walk to the
other Edgware Road and catch a District Line train to Ealing Broadway.
Ignoring the issue of whether the walk between the two Edgware Road
stations is preferable to a change at Paddington, the FACT is that
except possibly for a few workings, there are generally no direct trains
from Edgware Road to Ealing Broadway. Therefore, suggesting a route
which involves waiting at Edgware Road for an Ealing Broadway train is
WRONG. You can check this yourself on the TfL Journey Planner by asking
for a route from ER to EB and seeing how many direct trains it manages
to offer. Relying on voting to establish that this route as described
is "unpopular" (rather than downright wrong) is in my view a misuse of
democracy.

I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how accurate
a route is, so if you know that this route is not correct,
you could always force it down the popularity list.


You mean I can continually vote against it so that it collects hundreds
of negative votes? So it's not even democratic! But it's already at
the bottom of the popularity list of 3 routes, assuming that the routes
are listed in that order, and there are no voting numbers as far as I
can see. So just how am I supposed to know that it's not just 3rd out
of 3, but highly misleading?

I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be
responsible for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.


In that case the site is anarchic and has no value IMHO. I am tempted
to propose Marylebone-Oxford Circus, then the Central Line to Turnham
Green. Well, it was a proposed extension in 1928! And you wouldn't
remove it in the name of democracy? Daft!

Well OK I will need to take this offline in the next message, but just
like to say here that to point out a problem without a proposed solution
is only half useful.

How do you suggest I should solve this problem of providing useful info
to everybody ? the calculated routes sometimes get it wrong because they
do not know about certain stations which are quicker to walk. I provide
people with a facility to suggest route, but this only works if people
makes sensible suggestions. To go in and zap every route I do not like
is simply not the solution either. Please be constructive in your next
message.

By the way, there is spamguard in place, so if you keep clicking on a
vote for or against, only the first will register :-)

David

David Tran wrote:
Richard J. wrote:
David Tran wrote:

David Tran wrote:

Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying
to me TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route
planner showing the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so
will not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you
want to see all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a
certain route is not available (like the Waterloo and City line
currently), then my utility will help (and the visual aspect
should be a bonus too). You will be shown each route as a list of
stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed
lines, with the source and destination stations marked by map
pins. If you hover over each green dot, the name of the station
will be displayed. I am trying to add some points of interest along
each route, but
it is an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail
me). David


Hi

I just like to leave a message for Richard J, who made a comment
about the route from Marylebone to Turnham Green. I understand you
are not happy with the accuracy of this particular route, but it
was contributed by an anonymous user, and it would be wrong of me
to remove it as you suggested.


The route suggests Bakerloo Marylebone-Edgware Road, then walk to the
other Edgware Road and catch a District Line train to Ealing
Broadway. Ignoring the issue of whether the walk between the two
Edgware Road stations is preferable to a change at Paddington, the
FACT is that except possibly for a few workings, there are generally
no direct trains from Edgware Road to Ealing Broadway. Therefore,
suggesting a route which involves waiting at Edgware Road for an
Ealing Broadway train is WRONG. You can check this yourself on the
TfL Journey Planner by asking for a route from ER to EB and seeing
how many direct trains it manages to offer. Relying on voting to
establish that this route as described is "unpopular" (rather than
downright wrong) is in my view a misuse of democracy.

I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how
accurate a route is, so if you know that this route is not correct,
you could always force it down the popularity list.


You mean I can continually vote against it so that it collects
hundreds of negative votes? So it's not even democratic! But it's
already at the bottom of the popularity list of 3 routes, assuming
that the routes are listed in that order, and there are no voting
numbers as far as I can see. So just how am I supposed to know that
it's not just 3rd out of 3, but highly misleading?

I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be
responsible for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.


In that case the site is anarchic and has no value IMHO. I am
tempted to propose Marylebone-Oxford Circus, then the Central Line
to Turnham Green. Well, it was a proposed extension in 1928! And
you wouldn't remove it in the name of democracy? Daft!

Well OK I will need to take this offline in the next message, but just
like to say here that to point out a problem without a proposed
solution is only half useful.

How do you suggest I should solve this problem of providing useful
info to everybody ? the calculated routes sometimes get it wrong
because they do not know about certain stations which are quicker to
walk. I provide people with a facility to suggest route, but this
only works if people makes sensible suggestions. To go in and zap
every route I do not like is simply not the solution either. Please
be constructive in your next message.

By the way, there is spamguard in place, so if you keep clicking on a
vote for or against, only the first will register :-)

I can see you point of view, but I have got to say that I think Richard
is correct. (And I don't think you should take off-forum a discussion
that has been started here when there is a chance that others might want
to join in.

I think think the idea of being able to submit alternative routes is a
very good one, but clearly if somebody adds a 'crazy route' there has
got to be soem mechanism for removing it. To simply leave it, even at
the bottom of a list, suggests that it is a viable alternative when in
fact it is nothing of the sort.


--
Bob

David Tran wrote:
Richard J. wrote:
David Tran wrote:

I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how
accurate a route is, so if you know that this route is not
correct, you could always force it down the popularity list.

Since you allow each user only one negative vote, that is not a
practical way of dealing effectively with an incorrect route.

[...]
I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be
responsible for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.

In that case the site is anarchic and has no value IMHO. I am
tempted to propose Marylebone-Oxford Circus, then the Central Line
to Turnham Green. Well, it was a proposed extension in 1928! And
you wouldn't remove it in the name of democracy? Daft!

Well OK I will need to take this offline in the next message, but
just like to say here that to point out a problem without a
proposed solution is only half useful.

OK, I'll refund half of what you paid me for the advice. :-)

How do you suggest I should solve this problem of providing useful
info to everybody ? the calculated routes sometimes get it wrong
because they do not know about certain stations which are quicker
to walk. I provide people with a facility to suggest route, but
this only works if people makes sensible suggestions. To go in and
zap every route I do not like is simply not the solution either.

You could provide a feedback facility linked to each suggested route, a
sort of "Click here if you think this route is incorrect/stupid"
facility that produces a message form. If you get 3 or more saying that
a route is wrong, remove it. It's crude, but better than the current
system.

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

David Tran wrote:
Hi all

I have incorporated a London Tube Map into my website for plotting
routes around London's underground network, as people keep saying to me
TfL can do it better. Well, I don't see the TfL route planner showing
the routes on a map :-)

Seriously though, I do not have access to the timetable etc., so will
not be able to tell you the best times to travel, but if you want to see
all the alternatives to get from A to B, so in case a certain route is
not available (like the Waterloo and City line currently), then my
utility will help (and the visual aspect should be a bonus too).

You will be shown each route as a list of stations on the left hand
side, and also as a series of green dots along the traversed lines, with
the source and destination stations marked by map pins. If you hover
over each green dot, the name of the station will be displayed.

I am trying to add some points of interest along each route, but it is
an ongoing project. If you know of any, do let me know.

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all
feedbacks welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail me).

David

Have they reopened Shoreditch station, and the line from Whitechaple?

HTH Phil

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all feedbacks
welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail me).

David

If I ask for a route from King's Cross St. Pancras to Paddington,
it suggests that I change at Euston Square, *and* this is the most popular
route.

???

--
Peter

John B wrote:
Peter Goodland wrote:

The URL is http://public.ok2life.com/tube/routes. As usual, all feedbacks
welcome (please use the MessageBoard provided, or mail me).

David

If I ask for a route from King's Cross St. Pancras to Paddington,
it suggests that I change at Euston Square, *and* this is the most popular
route.



This seems to be because the website has decided only to display one of
the many possible six-stops-along-the-SSL-with-n-changes routes to
Paddington (a good thing), but the one that it's decided to display is
H&C from KXSP to Euston Square and then Circle from Euston Square to
Paddington (a bad thing).

Since the direct Circle to Paddington route is not shown, everyone has
voted for the displayed route because it's the least bad on offer (and
hopefully anyone taking it will notice that they don't in fact need to
change at Euston Square...).

Perhaps the routing engine ought to prioritise direct journeys as well
as prioritising fewer stops...?


Hi all

Currently the engine automatically bubbles up the route with least
interchanges and least stops to the top, but this is because it does not
have access to information like shorcuts or time of the day etc.
Hopefully I will be able to improve it as I go along. Thanks for all
your valuable feedbacks.

David

Richard J. wrote:
David Tran wrote:

Richard J. wrote:

David Tran wrote:

I am not the editor, and I am not in a position to judge how
accurate a route is, so if you know that this route is not
correct, you could always force it down the popularity list.


Since you allow each user only one negative vote, that is not a
practical way of dealing effectively with an incorrect route.

[...]

I am trying to be just a provider of a service, and not be
responsible for the contents, unless they are offensive to others.


In that case the site is anarchic and has no value IMHO. I am
tempted to propose Marylebone-Oxford Circus, then the Central Line
to Turnham Green. Well, it was a proposed extension in 1928! And
you wouldn't remove it in the name of democracy? Daft!


Well OK I will need to take this offline in the next message, but
just like to say here that to point out a problem without a
proposed solution is only half useful.


OK, I'll refund half of what you paid me for the advice. :-)

How do you suggest I should solve this problem of providing useful
info to everybody ? the calculated routes sometimes get it wrong
because they do not know about certain stations which are quicker
to walk. I provide people with a facility to suggest route, but
this only works if people makes sensible suggestions. To go in and
zap every route I do not like is simply not the solution either.


You could provide a feedback facility linked to each suggested route, a
sort of "Click here if you think this route is incorrect/stupid"
facility that produces a message form. If you get 3 or more saying that
a route is wrong, remove it. It's crude, but better than the current
system.


OK, just to show the democracy works, I will remove this route if a few
more people verify for me that the route from Marylebone to Turnham
Green is rubbish. Not that I do not trust Richard, as he has proved to
be very knowledgeable. It is simply because I have not been along this
route myself and hesitate to touch it until I get at least a second opinion.

I will take on board Richard's suggestion and will add a facility for
people to indicate that a route is simply not viable, as it seems like a
straight yes/no vote does not work well here.

Thanks all for taking the time to provide the feedbacks.

David