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Old December 6th 06, 03:41 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News


Guess which information I wanted to find out

Anyway...
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/press-cent...-releases-cont
ent.asp?prID=961

TFL COMMISSIONER REVEALS PLANS TO UPGRADE CIRCLE, DISTRICT, HAMMERSMITH
& CITY AND METROPOLITAN LINES

- Seventh carriage added to all new Circle & Hammersmith & City trains.

- Air-conditioned trains and new energy efficient features to be
delivered.

Detailed plans to upgrade a third of the Tube network over the next
decade and help tackle climate change were announced by the Transport
Commissioner Peter Hendy today.

The Circle, District, Hammersmith & City and Metropolitan lines will get
new air-conditioned trains from late 2009, together with a new
signalling system and renewed track.

The improvements will bring about faster, more frequent services along
with improved reliability, customer information, accessibility and
enhanced safety and security.

Trains on the Circle and Hammersmith & City lines will increase in size
from six to seven carriages, an overall capacity increase of 17 per
cent, as will those on the District line between Edgware Road and
Wimbledon.

Mayor of London Ken Livingstone said: "The upgrade of these lines is the
next stage of Transport for London's (TfL's)investment in the renewal
and improvement of London Underground.

"This upgrade will be felt by passengers every day, who will benefit
from air-conditioning and extra space on the trains.

"It will also deliver major energy efficiencies which will reduce energy
costs and make a positive contribution towards reducing London's CO2 use
and tackling climate change."

The improvements are part of TfL's UKP10bn Investment Programme, to meet
London's transport needs now and in future.


TACKLING CLIMATE CHANGE
The work will be undertaken by Metronet Rail SSL and is the biggest
single package of improvement works planned on the Tube under TfL's
investment plans.

London Underground (LU) announced that it is in the early stages of
investigating increasing the power supply on the sub-surface network
from 630v to 750v - the same as the National Rail network.

This would deliver even greater energy efficiencies and would also
contribute towards the reduction of heat levels on the sub-surface
network.

The new trains will also have regenerative braking which means they will
use 20-25 per cent less energy than current trains on the sub-surface
network, making a real contribution towards tackling CO2 emissions.


LONGER CARRIAGES
Regenerative braking works by recycling power production from the action
of the train braking and puts it back in the power network.

This is already a feature on Central, Northern and Jubilee line trains.

Transport Commissioner Peter Hendy said: "This is the biggest single
package of improvements for these lines since they opened in 1863,
running over the same route from Paddington to Farringdon they do today.

"Over one million people use these lines each day and they will all
benefit.


SHORTER JOURNEY TIMES
"All lines will get new trains, with the Circle, Hammersmith & City line
and part of the District line, which serve some of the busiest sections
on the Tube, getting new longer seven-carriage trains."

LU Managing Director Tim O'Toole said: "The new trains will also have
air conditioning and deliver more reliable and comfortable journeys for
passengers.

"Shorter journey times will be delivered through a combination of track
improvements, a new signalling system and reduced boarding times at
stations.

"A common train fleet for all these lines will help us deliver a better
service to passengers.

"It will provide more robust and reliable trains, with more integrated
and flexible services on all of the Circle, District, Hammersmith & City
and Metropolitan lines."
ENDS


NOTES FOR EDITORS
- TfL is investing UKP10bn over the next five years to improve and
expand London's transport network, more than half of that in the Tube

- Metronet Rail SSL is responsible for the renewal and maintenance of
Circle, District, Hammersmith & City, Metropolitan and East London lines

- Hammersmith & City and Circle lines trains (C-stock) are presently
made up of six carriages but will increase to seven carriages when the
new rolling stock is delivered. C-stock trains also operate the District
service between Wimbledon and Edgware Road

- Metropolitan line trains will remain at eight carriages while District
line trains (D-stock) will increase to seven carriages from their
present six carriages but the overall train length will remain virtually
the same

- Metronet Rail SSL has awarded the contract to build the new
sub-surface fleet to Bombardier Transportation in Derby who will deliver
a total of 190 trains

- To deliver the additional seventh carriage, LU has exercised a
Specified Right under the PPP contract with Metronet Rail SSL

- The new 190-strong train fleet, which will be common to all
sub-surface lines, will be fully air-conditioned with CCTV throughout
and walk-through gangways between carriages. The trains will be built by
Bombardier in Derby and will be delivered between late 2009 and 2015.
There will be dedicated spaces for wheelchair users and those with
luggage and prams. The biggest accessibility improvement is that access
to the train carriage will be at precisely the same height as the
platforms allowing ease of access to and from the train

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Old December 6th 06, 05:14 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

In article , Paul G
writes
Trains on the Circle and Hammersmith & City lines will increase in size
from six to seven carriages, an overall capacity increase of 17 per
cent, as will those on the District line between Edgware Road and
Wimbledon.

[...]
District line trains (D-stock) will increase to seven carriages from
their present six carriages but the overall train length will remain
virtually the same


The first part refers to S-stock, right?

Is it 7 carriages each the length of the C-stock ones, in which case how
are they going to solve the platform length issues? Or is 7S the same
length as 6C, in which case the "increase of 17%" is grossly misleading.

The second part is talking about replacing 6D by 7S, right?

--
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Old December 6th 06, 07:49 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

The 7 Car Artic S Stock will be used on the District and Circle &
Hammersmith lines. These will be longer (can't recall how much,
probably about 5ish metres) than the current C Stock. Until rebuilding
work has recieved consent through the Transport & Works Act and been
carried out at stations with shorter platforms like Bayswater and Baker
Street (5&6) some doors will remain closed.

The Metropolitan Line will use 8 Cars of S Stock and I suspect that the
seating may be a bit different than the 7 Car - to satisfy those
further north.

Clive D. W. Feather wrote:

In article , Paul G
writes
Trains on the Circle and Hammersmith & City lines will increase in size
from six to seven carriages, an overall capacity increase of 17 per
cent, as will those on the District line between Edgware Road and
Wimbledon.

[...]
District line trains (D-stock) will increase to seven carriages from
their present six carriages but the overall train length will remain
virtually the same


The first part refers to S-stock, right?

Is it 7 carriages each the length of the C-stock ones, in which case how
are they going to solve the platform length issues? Or is 7S the same
length as 6C, in which case the "increase of 17%" is grossly misleading.

The second part is talking about replacing 6D by 7S, right?

--
Clive D.W. Feather | Home:
Tel: +44 20 8495 6138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org
Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work:
Please reply to the Reply-To address, which is:


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Old December 6th 06, 10:01 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

Clive D. W. Feather wrote:
In article , Paul G
writes
Trains on the Circle and Hammersmith & City lines will increase in
size from six to seven carriages, an overall capacity increase of
17 per cent, as will those on the District line between Edgware
Road and Wimbledon.

[...]
District line trains (D-stock) will increase to seven carriages
from their present six carriages but the overall train length will
remain virtually the same


The first part refers to S-stock, right?

Is it 7 carriages each the length of the C-stock ones, in which
case how are they going to solve the platform length issues? Or is
7S the same length as 6C, in which case the "increase of 17%" is
grossly misleading.


I don't know the actual car lengths for S-stock, but my understanding is
that they will be about the same as C-stock and A-stock (roughly 15 to
16 m length). The Evening Standard today said that "station platforms
on the Circle and Hammersmith & City lines will be extended for the
longer trains. A massive hole will be dug in Marylebone Road to
increase [sic] Baker Street platforms. Work is also needed at
Paddington and Bayswater stations."

The second part is talking about replacing 6D by 7S, right?


Yes. D-stock cars are 18.1 to 18.4 m long (dimensions from the
Tubeprune site at http://www.trainweb.org/tubeprune/Dimensions.htm )

--
Richard J.
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Old December 6th 06, 10:04 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

chunky munky wrote:
The 7 Car Artic S Stock will be used on the District and Circle &
Hammersmith lines.


When you say Artic[ulated], do you mean that two cars share a bogie? I
don't remember seeing that specified anywhere in relation to S-stock.
Or did you just mean that there is passenger access between cars through
wide gangways? (The word 'articulated' seems to be used in both senses
these days.)

--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)



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Old December 6th 06, 11:21 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

In article ,
(Paul G) wrote:

LONGER CARRIAGES


That's the same (A & C replacement) or shorter (D replacement) carriages
then?

TMBSNMOTW"longer"OWIWPU.

--
Colin Rosenstiel
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Old December 7th 06, 04:07 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News


Paul G wrote:

London Underground (LU) announced that it is in the early stages of
investigating increasing the power supply on the sub-surface network
from 630v to 750v - the same as the National Rail network.


Didn't they reduce the voltage from 640 a few years back? Can't they
make their minds up?
Also won't this mean that these lines will now be strictly limited to
the new stock? What if they need to run some jubilee stock over the met
line tracks from finchley road or piccadilly stock over the distict
lines from hammersmith to acton? Not to mention the shared piccadilly
and met section to uxbridge.

B2003

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Old December 7th 06, 07:32 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

The new S stock will still run on the current set up 630V (420+ve &
210-ve) but will have optimal perfomance at 750V (or whatever they are
going to use).

LUL trains can still run over 750V lines as they currently do on the
District and Bakerloo lines.

Boltar wrote:

Paul G wrote:

London Underground (LU) announced that it is in the early stages of
investigating increasing the power supply on the sub-surface network
from 630v to 750v - the same as the National Rail network.


Didn't they reduce the voltage from 640 a few years back? Can't they
make their minds up?
Also won't this mean that these lines will now be strictly limited to
the new stock? What if they need to run some jubilee stock over the met
line tracks from finchley road or piccadilly stock over the distict
lines from hammersmith to acton? Not to mention the shared piccadilly
and met section to uxbridge.

B2003


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Old December 7th 06, 08:49 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News

"Transport Commissioner Peter Hendy said: "This is the biggest single
package of improvements for these lines since they opened in 1863"

Hmmm.....surely the changeover from steam to electric tops this?

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Old December 7th 06, 09:14 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Default New Carriage Lengths and Other Rolling Stock News


chunky munky wrote:

LUL trains can still run over 750V lines as they currently do on the
District and Bakerloo lines.


Yes , but arn't those lines set up so that 3rd rail stock gets 750V but
4 rail LU stock still only gets 630V? With this new LU stock I presume
it'll be 750V going through the 4th rail system. Wouldn't this blow any
630V tube stock?

B2003



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