In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 26 Jan, 00:35, "John Salmon" wrote:
Surprisingly, I don't think this has been posted here yet...

Posters displayed at King's Cross indicate that the entrance to the
Underground from within the main line station concourse - the one more
or less opposite platform 7 - which seems to have been there for
ever, at least within my recollection, is to close permanently from
next Sunday, 1st February.

Intriguing. I've found this information on the TfL website:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/proj....aspx#entrance

---quote---
Entrance closure - 1 February 2009

The staircase that leads from within King's Cross mainline station to
the Underground will be closed permanently from 1 February 2009.

This closure is to enable a lift to be installed to provide step-free
access from the ticket hall to the Northern line platforms.

This staircase will not re-open, but a new route between King's Cross
mainline and the Underground will open nearby when the new Northern
ticket hall opens in 2010.

Until then, passengers should use the main entrance staircase and lift
located outside of King's Cross mainline station, to change between
rail and Underground services.
---/quote---

In time the whole focus of King's Cross station is shifting from the
present concourse over to the new western concourse, which will open
in 2011/ 2012 - in this context the closure of this staircase makes
rather more sense. I'm not really all that clued up on the
redevelopment of the station, but it seems as though the new northern
Tube ticket hall will become the primary entrance to the Underground
from the mainline station.

This Network Rail webpage provides a rough outline as to the plans,
but there's not really enough detail in it:
http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/4059.aspx

The focus shifting nonsense is a right PITA for real users because it
means considerably longer walking routes and the complete lack of a
covered route to the Underground in the meantime. Why they don't at least
put up a temporary awning on the King's Cross forecourt is beyond me but
even that route is a long way round from all the King's ross platforms to
the Victoria Line. Just encourages me always to use my bike.

I note that the footbridge in the main trainshed was scheduled to be
removed over Christmas - I haven't been into KX lately so can't say if
this happened or not. It was fun walking over it when it was still
open, it was a distinctly forgotten corner of the station. It only
gave access to platforms 1 and 8 - was this always the case? I also
note that it's being/been taken into storage - any ideas for a new
home for it?

It went alright. It's even reported in the latest Modern Railways (I
think, could be Railway Magazine).

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In message
, at
03:47:11 on Mon, 26 Jan 2009, Mizter T remarked:
The Northern Ticket Hall opens in December this year,

As soon as that? Is it timed to co-incide with the opening of the Kent
Domestics. Will all the new escalators/passageways to the tube lines be
complete as well?

It's almost as if there's a masterplan at work! I think the timing is
intended to coincide with the arrival of the Kent high-speed trains at
St. P.

Although this says 2010 (for the Northern Ticket Hall):

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/proj....aspx#entrance
--
Roland Perry

On 26 Jan, 11:57, Roland Perry wrote:
Although this says 2010 (for the Northern Ticket Hall)

The official date is "February 2010" but they were asked to get it
done three months early by the DfT, which they've agreed to. But for
whatever political reason TfL's announced date is unchanged.

(see also the ELL, which opens "June 2010" but I would bet money will
be carrying passengers by the end of this year)

U

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 26 Jan, 09:54, Allan wrote:

John Salmon wrote:
Surprisingly, I don't think this has been posted here yet...

Posters displayed at King's Cross indicate that the entrance to the
Underground from within the main line station concourse - the one
more or less opposite platform 7 - which seems to have been there
for ever, at least within my recollection, is to close
permanently from next Sunday, 1st February.

I may be missing something, but this is a great pity. *It was so easy
to get off an arriving train, and straight down the stairs into the
underground.

Fom 1 Feb, you have through the often crowded station concourse, out
of the front of the station, merge in with everyone else coming into
the station, and then down the stairs.

All this so a lift can be installed.

This seems very contrary.

Come 2011/2012 when the new western concourse at King's Cross mainline
station opens, then things would be changing anyway. I very much doubt
that this entrance would be closing now were it not for these major
forthcoming changes to the mainline station which will result in the
current concourse disappearing.

So what you're missing is the bigger picture of how things are to
develop at King's Cross - this is just a stage in those
developments.

The new ticket hall won't change the shortest route to the tube platforms!

The exit from platforms 1-8 at the Cross will still be to the area where
the concourse is now.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

In article , (Roland
Perry) wrote:

In message
,
at 02:49:10 on Mon, 26 Jan 2009, John B remarked:
Remember also, that people arriving on the main platforms at KX will
be tipped out into that open space (with very limited coverage from
the rain). This halfway house will get them used to packing an
umbrella

Eh? The new footbridge to the new western concourse will be the
primary exit route to the Tube, St Pancras, etc. The exit to the south
where the current concourse is will only be for people exiting into
the local area.

My understanding is that the bridge is only for passengers going
*to* the trains.

And a bloody inconvenient route for them too. If people were designed to
go up and down they'd have given us wings.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

wrote:

In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On 26 Jan, 00:35, "John Salmon" wrote:
Surprisingly, I don't think this has been posted here yet...

Posters displayed at King's Cross indicate that the entrance to the
Underground from within the main line station concourse - the one more
or less opposite platform 7 - which seems to have been there for
ever, at least within my recollection, is to close permanently from
next Sunday, 1st February.

Intriguing. I've found this information on the TfL website:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/proj....aspx#entrance

---quote---
Entrance closure - 1 February 2009

The staircase that leads from within King's Cross mainline station to
the Underground will be closed permanently from 1 February 2009.

This closure is to enable a lift to be installed to provide step-free
access from the ticket hall to the Northern line platforms.

This staircase will not re-open, but a new route between King's Cross
mainline and the Underground will open nearby when the new Northern
ticket hall opens in 2010.

Until then, passengers should use the main entrance staircase and lift
located outside of King's Cross mainline station, to change between
rail and Underground services.
---/quote---

In time the whole focus of King's Cross station is shifting from the
present concourse over to the new western concourse, which will open
in 2011/ 2012 - in this context the closure of this staircase makes
rather more sense. I'm not really all that clued up on the
redevelopment of the station, but it seems as though the new northern
Tube ticket hall will become the primary entrance to the Underground
from the mainline station.

This Network Rail webpage provides a rough outline as to the plans,
but there's not really enough detail in it:
http://www.networkrail.co.uk/aspx/4059.aspx

The focus shifting nonsense is a right PITA for real users because it
means considerably longer walking routes and the complete lack of a
covered route to the Underground in the meantime. Why they don't at least
put up a temporary awning on the King's Cross forecourt is beyond me but
even that route is a long way round from all the King's ross platforms to
the Victoria Line. Just encourages me always to use my bike.


"This focus shifting nonsense" is basically the bedrock of the
redevelopment plans for King's Cross mainline station, which will
entail the concourse being relocated to the western side of the
station.

By the by I was mistaken when I said the new northern Tube ticket hall
would become the primary entrance from the mainline station - there
will in fact be an entrance to the existing circular ticket hall via a
passageway from the new western concourse. This walking route will be
a bit longer, but nothing major. The motivation behind the new western
concourse is to provide a less cramped, more spacious station for
passengers.

Regarding the current arrangement - once the entrance to the Tube
station in the middle of the current concourse shuts, there won't as
you say be a completely covered route - but it's almost completely
covered. Look at this bird's eye view - the building with the 'King's
Cross' label imposed on it is actually the (fairly) new wide stairway
entrance down into the Tube station. The actual distance between that
and the existing canopy is pretty miniscule (the temporary structure
that appears in between them is no longer there).

Regarding the arrangement encouraging you to use your bike - well,
some might well say good, nothing wrong with that, in fact it should
be positively encouraged - for a start people opting to go by bike
take some pressure off the Tube network. Though you should perhaps
note that the small lack of cover from the sky between the mainline
station and the Tube entrance somewhat pales into insignificance
compared with the lack of cover provided when cycling, what with it
being out in the open and all that.


I note that the footbridge in the main trainshed was scheduled to be
removed over Christmas - I haven't been into KX lately so can't say if
this happened or not. It was fun walking over it when it was still
open, it was a distinctly forgotten corner of the station. It only
gave access to platforms 1 and 8 - was this always the case? I also
note that it's being/been taken into storage - any ideas for a new
home for it?

It went alright. It's even reported in the latest Modern Railways (I
think, could be Railway Magazine).


OK, thanks for the info,

On 26 Jan, 12:27, wrote:

In article
,

(Mizter T) wrote:
On 26 Jan, 09:54, Allan wrote:

John Salmon wrote:
Surprisingly, I don't think this has been posted here yet...

Posters displayed at King's Cross indicate that the entrance to the
Underground from within the main line station concourse - the one
more or less opposite platform 7 - which seems to have been there
for ever, at least within my recollection, is to close
permanently from next Sunday, 1st February.

I may be missing something, but this is a great pity. *It was so easy
to get off an arriving train, and straight down the stairs into the
underground.

Fom 1 Feb, you have through the often crowded station concourse, out
of the front of the station, merge in with everyone else coming into
the station, and then down the stairs.

All this so a lift can be installed.

This seems very contrary.

Come 2011/2012 when the new western concourse at King's Cross mainline
station opens, then things would be changing anyway. I very much doubt
that this entrance would be closing now were it not for these major
forthcoming changes to the mainline station which will result in the
current concourse disappearing.

So what you're missing is the bigger picture of how things are to
develop at King's Cross - this is just a stage in those
developments.

The new ticket hall won't change the shortest route to the tube platforms!

True. In some earlier comments I mistakenly said that the new northern
Tube ticket hall would become the primary entrance to the Tube from
the new western concourse - as Roland Perry has pointed out elsewhere
on this thread, there will in fact be a new passageway from the
western concourse that leads into the existing (main) circular Tube
ticket hall next to Euston Road.


The exit from platforms 1-8 at the Cross will still be to the area where
the concourse is now.

There seems to be some dispute over whether passenger will be able to
exit the mainline platforms over the footbridge into the western
ticket hall or not. If that is to be possible, then there would be a
covered route all the way into the Tube station - though yes, one that
would involve getting up and then down from the footbridge.

The other possibility is that there will be a way to walk around the
southern (buffer-end) exits from platforms 1-8 within the station
(i.e. under cover) to get round to the western concourse and hence the
entrance to the Tube station. This is surely highly likely, as I
rather doubt that the buffer-end exits would literally deposit people
straight off the train and through the doors into the street.

On 26 Jan, 12:42, Mizter T wrote:
There seems to be some dispute over whether passenger will be able to
exit the mainline platforms over the footbridge into the western
ticket hall or not.

They'll have a single down-only escalator and a lift to each platform.

The other possibility is that there will be a way to walk around the
southern (buffer-end) exits from platforms 1-8 within the station
(i.e. under cover) to get round to the western concourse and hence the
entrance to the Tube station.

There'll be a bi-directional gateline roughly where M&S currently is
giving you access to the concourse. A little further south (just
outside the building but under the canopy) there'll be a new set of
stairs down to the tube station. This is probably the same set Roland
mentioned earlier.

U

In message
, at
04:42:06 on Mon, 26 Jan 2009, Mizter T remarked:
The other possibility is that there will be a way to walk around the
southern (buffer-end) exits from platforms 1-8 within the station
(i.e. under cover) to get round to the western concourse and hence the
entrance to the Tube station. This is surely highly likely, as I
rather doubt that the buffer-end exits would literally deposit people
straight off the train and through the doors into the street.

They are currently widening the circulating area inside the "old
building" by moving all the buffers about half a carriage-length north,
and eventually covering the resulting footprint with a pedestrianised
area. This will give a "corridor" from the platform ends westwards to
the new National Rail ticket concourse.

But when they did a study of the passenger flows at the revamped
station, one of the major issues was congestion at the platform-end
exits, when it was raining. This seems to assume that most passengers
would be heading across the new open air plaza, maybe to the bus stops,
or the current "outdoor" entrance to the tube - especially if heading
for the Circle Line I think.
--
Roland Perry

In message
s.com, at 04:53:21 on Mon, 26 Jan 2009, Mr Thant maha.thray.sithu.u.th
remarked:
There'll be a bi-directional gateline roughly where M&S currently is
giving you access to the concourse.

And is there an exit-only gateline somewhere? Very close to the edge of
the building, perhaps (so that the corridor along the buffers is
"airside")?

A little further south (just outside the building but under the canopy)
there'll be a new set of stairs down to the tube station. This is
probably the same set Roland mentioned earlier.

There's just one set on the diagram I have, and it's not clear if inside
or outside the building. If it's just outside, is it perhaps inside the
greenhouse structure visible here just left of the 'clocktower':

http://www.e-architect.co.uk/london/...ion_nrail27110
7_2.jpg

--
Roland Perry