In message , at 22:20:54 on
Sat, 6 Jul 2013, Paul Corfield remarked:
They don't need to provide a ramp up the steps, just allow people to
*enter* on the other side, on the level, through the most southerly
gate, which is wide and somewhat disjoint from the rest of that
gateline.

sigh

Thereby instanly creating a crossflow and potential congestion behind
the gates. They actually need to keep flows apart as far as possible
given the tiny amount of space in the ticket hall. Camden Town was
one of the most difficult places to put in a gateline.

In fact, the gate I'm talking about, being at the apex of the triangular
space, would not crate a crossflow at all. The flow would be all-inward
(up the steps and past the ticket machines, plus that one gate at the
Apex). And all-outward on the remaining stepless gates.

The problem is that if you allow it at quiet times people will demand
it when the place is heaving full with people trying to exit.

People "demanding to use" the down escalators yesterday weren't getting
very far.

I'd probably agree with you at a quiet location but Camden Town is
just far too busy.

Today, I see that it's gone completely mad. The only way to the
platforms is down the 116-step spiral staircase!

Happens every weekend because at certain times the exit flow far
exceeds the entry flow. Camden Town station is simply inadequate for
the demand. The only answer is to rebuild the place but there is not
the land or planning permission that can do this without harming the
market. Camden Council appear to place retention of the market above
the provision of a safe accessible tube station that would allow more
people to reach Camden by tube.

I don't understand that at all. It's on a massive road junction - they
could put a ticket concourse underneath (like at Oxford Circus).

My understanding is that that is not feasible given the need to add
extra escalator and lift capacity but within the broad envelope of
where the platforms are. The plan has always been to reconstruct on
the site north of the main road junction.

There appears to be no viable solution to expanding Camden Town
station which would also include step free access from platform to
street.

The current site of the booking office could be the accessible entrance.

So where do you put the booking office?

In the large space you dig below the road surface. And that's also where
you put the top of any extra escalators.

And that's after a neat trick from the Northern Line - all trains from
Kings Cross were going to Hampstead, but I was going to Archway. I can't
see a stepless way of doing the change (there's two flights of stairs at
Camden Town) without going via whatever the first remaining
island-platform station is in the Clapham area. Unless there's a
same-level interchange at Euston, of course, but they were telling
people to change at Camden.

That will be because there is engineering work associated with testing
of the new signalling on the Edgware branch.

I can understand that stopping the trains from going north of Hampstead,
by why does it stop Bank-branch trains going via Archway?

I assume that they adopted a fixed service pattern given constraints
on the number of trains as I expect Golders Green depot and Edgware
sidings were inaccessible.

They had enough trains to run a regular service on both branches.

I don't really understand your overall comment though. Today you're
moaning about a lack of step free routes and the other day you were
saying provision of lifts and ramps was a "box ticking" exercise and
that the assets were then left to rot because no one used them. Make
your mind up!

My comments are about how dedicated TfL seems to be when it comes to
providing step-free access. Where there's the slightest problem - forget
it. If it's easy, grab the money and tick some boxes! (Even if it's
somewhere with little demand)

You do seem to be very selective in where you expect the authorities
to do things - usually where it benefits you!

I'm usually looking at the benefits for a wider community. I'm certainly
not the only person in London wanting step-free access, or shorter
queues at ticket offices, for example.

You also seem to be very unwilling to see that there might be other
reasons as to why things are done the way they are.

Things are normally "done the way the are", because that's the easiest.
I'm always looking for ways to improve, even if it means a bit more
effort (so much could be done by better management, rather than more
civil engineering).
--
Roland Perry