On Mon, 21 Jul 2003 18:42:01 +0100, "PeterE"
wrote:

[snip moderate and reasonable words]

The thing is, I mostly agree with you /except/ that there is
compelling evidence that speeding, at least speeding sufficient to
cause a Gatso to trigger, is in and of itself dangerous. I would
suggest that the Gatsos are a reflection of an increasing
determination to speed, rather than the other way around.

I first noticed seriously aggressive overtaking and extremes of
speeding in the mid 1980s, at a time when selfishness was being
promoted as socially desirable and arrogance was admired in the press.
The Gatso didn't start arriving until about 1991, and even now most
cameras I see are in locations where there is a clear and obvious
reason, outside schools and playing fields. I know that not al are,
and I know that many speed limits are arbitrary - but the old
objective criteria were just as bad. You couldn't get a speed limit
in a village with narrow roads and no footways until enough people had
been killed.

Is it possible to gain a substantially greater degree of genuine speed limit
compliance (rather than prosecution avoidance) mainly through persuasion? I
would suggest to a large degree it's a somewhat Quixotic quest

Maybe, maybe not. My Mum has now stopped speeding, since the "if he'd
been doing 30 he would have stopped here" campaign.

Speed cameras in the past have been deliberately concealed, giving the
impression that deterrence is not the first priority.

I don't know about you, but if I were inclined to speed the knowledge
that any tree could conceal a camera would be a much stronger
deterrent than knowing that all cameras are brightly coloured and
visible a mile off. Enforcement activity usually works best when it's
not widely advertised in advance.

they are normally found on the widest, straightest, most open
stretches of roads and rarely on shopping streets or outside schools.

Not where I live, but maybe where you are.

Also much of the pressure for lower limits and tougher enforcement has come
from organisations that are interested as much in curbing car use as in
improving safety, which in turn makes people more likely to doubt the
argument.

Ah, well, I have a degree of sympathy with their aims. Riding to work
today, first full week of the school holidays, the roads were deserted
and much more pleasant for that :-)

So it's hardly surprising that the majority of drivers play "dodge the
Gatso"

Majority? I'm not sure that most are playing that game, I think most
are simply in the habit of speeding; once the habit is broken they
would probably just drive legally and still be content.

I may be wrong, but it does seem to me as if urban speeding is in
decline at the moment. People then seem to make up for it by driving
at motorway speeds along country lanes, which is a bit hair-raising.

Guy
===
http://www.highwaycode.gov.uk: Respectable rules for responsible people