On 30/05/2019 15:41, Roland Perry wrote:


JNugent remarked:

Â*The turnover for someone like Uber or TheTrainline being the
commissionÂ* element, not including the money that passes straight
through to theÂ* drivers and Train Companies respectively.

If Uber only received a commission or circuit fee from the driver,
that would be correct and I would certainly not argue with your
proposition.

But how can that correct be in the circumstance where they also turn
over the whole of the fare collected from the passenger
(account-holder) on the spot?

Do they, and send the driver an invoice for their commission later (end
of the month perhaps)?

I assume your "Do they..." was a request for confirmation of what I said.

Yes, Uber do collect the whole of the fare.

I don't know what form their subsequent internal accounting procedures
take, but if it were their practice to issue invoices to the driver, I
strongly suspect that we would have heard about that by now.

That would nudge them a bit closer to being perceived by the passenger
as a cab company, rather than a booking agent for the driver.

The passenger's view isn't important anyway, but even so, it's hard to
see how "knowing" that Uber issue invoices to drivers [if that were the
case, for which there is no evidence] would affect passengers' opinion
of Uber.

I don't think credit card companies include the total value of
thingsÂ* purchased with their cards in their turnover. But they do
collect theÂ* money from buyers, deduct a commission, they pay the
balance to
vendors. And like no doubt Uber, they don't pay the whole amount
outÂ* andÂ* then send an invoice asking for the commission back
whenever theÂ* traderÂ* feels like it.

I don't now about you, but I pay money to my credit card issuers.
Â*That's what I wrote. They collect the money you pay to them, and
channelÂ* it through to the merchants.

They don't pay money to me.

Â*I didn't suggest they did. They pay money to merchants. But that's
moneyÂ* from you to the merchant, and isn't part of the card issuer's
turnover.

Indeed. They are financial trading entities operating as registered /
recognised banks licenced by the state. They lend money (part of their
capital assets) and only the fees and charges they receive are their
turnover.

They lend money to the buyer (at zero interest rate if they pay it off
on demand). They don't lend money to the merchant.

Does that apply to Uber?

And TheTrainline, does the train company get paid for the ticket
straight away, or does TTL have 30day (or whatever) credit with them
all. Whatever the answer, their turnover in their published accounts is
just the commission/fee element.

But they are not Uber. And Uber are going to have to argue that the
money they turn over is not part of their turnover.

Just to be clear about this: if an individual self-employed taxi-driver
(or private hire driver) turned over £85,000 and were honest enough to
report the fact, they would be forced by law to register for VAT and to
charge it on top of the fare.

But turning over £1808 a week (assuming five weeks' non-activity per
annum) would be a tall order. Not so for Uber.