In article ,
] (Arthur Figgis) wrote:

On Fri, 17 Dec 2004 23:20:09 +0000, Tom Anderson
wrote:

On 16 Dec 2004, James wrote:

Yes, Southern has started refurbing the 455s. I was on one the other
day from Mitcham Jct to Ewell E. Very nice job. High-backed seats,
but sadly still 3+2.

Are new trains 2+2, then? Surely 3+2 is the best arrangement for
trains on inner suburban services; they seat 25% more people than 2+2s.

The snag is, within the British loading gauge(s) in reality they
don't.

AIUI, in
2+2, the width gained from liquidating the fifth seat goes into making
the four survivors wider, not providing more room the aisle, so it's
not as if you get more standing passengers in return.

You'll have to excuse my ignorance - i live in tubeland, and before
that, Hackney, manor of the 315.

The refurbed SWT 455s are 2+2 with more standing space, the Southern
ones are still 3+2. The problem with 3+2 is that the middle seat only
provides theoretical extra seating capacity. Unless one happens to be
on a train full of children or under-fed midgets the middle seat is
all but unusable. Many people would rather have decent standing room
than cramped standing space and a view of half a seat just visible
between the two seated passengers!

When I've been on 455s or 317s at busy times most of the 3 seat benches
have been filled without problems.

--
Colin Rosenstiel