On May 22, 12:12*am, "Richard J." wrote:

Dave Plowman wrote on 21 May 2009 23:16:59 ...

In article ,
* *Recliner wrote:
*The demand is simply absurd. In any case, with a line
entirely in tunnel, the risk to pax is less than on any line with
surface or double-track tunnel running. Of all the bizarre Crow-****,
this must be the worst.

You *really* should look at details of the dispute. Not just take The
Mail's word for it.

Ideally, yes. *Perhaps you can tell us where to find such details, as
they are not even on the RMT site. *Do you disagree with the TfL press
release on the subject?

I'm sure Mr Plowman would say that the TfL press release only tells
part of the story. Indeed, as reasonable as it sounds, I imagine
there's more to this dispute than that (i.e. a more general breakdown
in relations between management and some staff etc - note that I'm not
saying the management's at fault, nor am I saying they're perfect, I'm
just saying that a TfL press release cannot possibly explore all of
this).


For your education it's very difficult to find out the true facts behind
any industrial dispute. The press, as with everything else, tell the
'facts' the public want to hear.

No, they tell the facts that are available to them. *If the RMT did a
better job of explaining what really happened, instead of going on
strike ostensibly because LU haven't fitted a safety feature to
42-year-old trains that are about to be replaced, then we would have a
better chance of understanding the "true facts". *But then the RMT
aren't really interested in us.

The problem for the RMT is that it wouldn't look too good for them to
go big on what (I think) this dispute is really about - which is that
they are objecting to heavier disciplinary procedures for train
operators if they do something wrong. If this is what the RMT told the
public, the public might well just turn back and ask the RMT what
exactly is wrong with their members being disciplined for doing
something that could affect safety.

And, to be fair it's easy for members of the public to say "well train
operators should be capable of concentrating and opening the doors on
the right side" without taking into account the quasi-hypnotic nature
of watching tube tunnels for hours on end.

In essence the RMT is somewhat stymied from publicly making its
argument for fear of a public backlash.

Of course the information from LU suggests that the RMT are also
trying to have a driver who was somewhat less than truthful during a
disciplinary reinstated. LU are suggesting this is the root cause,
though I can imagine there might be other things causing tension too -
but it's also easy to come to the conclusion that this is the RMT
pitching in for a battle of willpower against LU, trying to get this
driver reinstated so as to prove that they are the ever mighty union.

What I would be curious to know is how many wrong-side door openings
there have been on the Victoria line in recent years. Could that be an
FOI request?


[crosspost to uk.rec.driving removed, since off-topic for them]

Who x-posted to them in the first place!