On Jul 9, 12:18*pm, wrote:

On Thu, 9 Jul 2009 04:05:29 -0700 (PDT)
Mizter T wrote:
Which is the standard moronic response when someone encounters an
issue with Oyster. There will be an explanation for this - likely to

And yours is the stand Tfl Apologists moronic response. Or course theres
an explanation for it - money.

I'm sorry, you're absolutely right - the system was designed from day
one to scam passengers. There can be no other explanation for it,
because Boltar has spoken.


And there's a very simple explanation for this - it stops people
working the system. If the gates were configured so as to charge
nothing when this happened (more precisely, refund the entry charge in
its entirety), then people would touch-in to enter through a gate,
then touch-out on an exit gate but instead of exiting they'd continue
on and catch a train - voila, they've got into the system for nothing.
The same could happen on the way out, though they'd need to reach over
and touch-in on an entry gate before touching-out on an exit gate.

So the ordinary passenger gets screwed on the off chance of a scam. Figures.
In that case it wouldn't have killed them to make the gates flash up a
message or beep loudly so at least the person was made aware of the fact
that they just been stiffed. But no, they'd collect less money that way
in the same way they NEVER advertise the refund service on posters or on
tannoy because they don't want anyone to know about it.

The fact that refunds are available for erroneous Oyster charges is no
secret at all, it is mentioned in plenty of TfL publicity and LU staff
will readily refer you to Oyster customer services if you have
concerns about overcharging.


Don't think that this wouldn't happen - especially when one bears in
mind *that one or the other end of their journey might not be gated at
all (e.g. a National Rail station on a line that offers in-station
interchange with the Underground).

Well in that case its already happening since people will touch in and out and
pay 1.10 instead of whatever the full fare would be.

At a guess I'd say it's a compromise arrangement that takes into
account different concerns, e.g. that of deterring misuse of the
system and that of maintaining free flowing movement through gatelines
at stations. The system will be able to note if there are particular
locations where there are lots of entries rapidly followed by exits,
or whether a particular card is found to be entering and then
immediately exiting stations on a regular basis, and then station
staff can be alerted to watch more carefully for this and RPIs can be
deployed to try and catch people in the act (including plain clothes
RPIs).


And if it was configured as you suggest, and you saw people scamming
it, you'd be the first to come on here and rant about 'the idiots at
TfL who couldn't see this coming' (you just know you would be!).

Unlikely.

Why "unlikely"? That's your style after all.


It's perhaps worth comparing this situation to that if you were using
a paper Tube ticket, which you would have had to buy before you

The difference is that no one would be dumb enough to put a single fare
paper ticket into the gate to get out again because they'd know it would
be swallowed. They'd ask the guy at the window and explain the situation.

Yes, but you wouldn't get your money back - and you wouldn't be able
to go off and use that ticket at another station.