On 2 Aug, 09:34, Paul Corfield wrote:
On Sat, 1 Aug 2009 17:31:29 -0700 (PDT), MIG





wrote:
On 1 Aug, 13:39, "Richard J." wrote:
Miles Bader wrote on 01 August 2009 02:53:13 *...

Paul Corfield writes:
I have never seen the inside of these trains. *I cannot understand why
they are not fitted with straps and a hanging rail after the manner of
tube trains.
They are -http://www.flickr.com/photos/24759744@N02/3769795952/
The amount of bars and straps doesn't seem all that high though; maybe
they don't expect so much overcrowding.

It looks to me as if the straps were a last-minute addition, perhaps for
the benefit of shorter passengers. *They didn't feature in earlier
photos, e.g.http://www.transportbriefing.co.uk/c...ain.php?id=765

The 376s were in service for a long time with nothing to hold on to in
the door area. *You'd think the lesson would have been learned before
the 378s were built, but apparently not.

I stood in the door area when I rode one last week and held on to the
fixed handrail. It's no different to the D78 refurbs on the District
Line.

Yes, that seems to have a similar function in the door area to the
rails that were belatedly fitted to 376s. Really I was referring to
the suggestion that the straps were a "last minute addition". You'd
think that it would have been properly thought through this time after
the 376 debacle.

I can reach the new rails in the 376s and probably the rail in the
378s, but plenty of people wouldn't be able to, so the straps are
needed.


In the seating area of the 376s, there is a yellow stripe along the
edge of the luggage rack, but I don't know if that means that people
are specifically directed to hold on to it. *There is nothing else.

On the 378s there are vertical stanchions as well as almost continuous
handrails and strap hangers to hold on to.

I note that the 378s are going to have think, chunky obstructions in
the standing area (surprise surprise) that will not be quite big
enough to act as dividing areas that people can lean on, but will be
big enough to force people away from the edges, to rattle about in the
middle.

What is the chunky obstruction you refer to? Is it the double vertical
stanchion between some of the seats? *I cannot see why you would to have
people leaning on such things as they'd be almost leaning on people
sitting down. That sort of happens on deep tube stock but then there is
not the same space profile. The 378s do, at least, have some width to
allow for plenty of standees and hopefully for people to circulate down
the train. If the design means people can get on the train they wish to
rather than waiting for the next one or the one after due to the crush
then surely that is an advantage?

Really I'd prefer that the one near the seats was a little wider (but
not so thick), so that it would provide something to lean on and
protect the heads of seated passengers. I'd prefer that the one
nearer to the door could be removed if possible to allow a greater
with for the perch. Does it serve a support function? It's not there
on other somethingStars.


What's the betting that that perch area is only wide enough for one
and a half bums, thanks to the obstructions. *So, once again, a space
that could have had two flip-up seats can now only accommodate one
perching person, with legs probably splayed out for balance, further
than those of a seated person.

I think I agree with you about the width of the perch seat - it does
look adequate only for one person. Not sure why you'd want tip up seats
given these trains are designed to carry large numbers of people over
short distances. I suspect you won't agree with this last comment so I'm
off to retire to the bunker ;-)

I was thinking of the Northern Line, where the ambience is so much
better than on the otherwise similar trains on the Jubilee. A person
leaning splays out their legs quite a long way and a person in a flip-
up seat can tuck their feet under, and there's no problem with two
side-by-side, as there is on the Jubilee.