On Thu, 24 Jun 2010 07:43:08 +0100 someone who may be "Kev Lawrence"
wrote this:-

Is there not a way that a spare core or two of the cable could carry a nice
deterrent voltage to stop this?

If they steal the wrong cable they have to contend with the
signalling supply, up to 650V.

A core of the cable could carry a higher voltage, if the insulation
of all cores is suitable for the higher voltage and this is
maintained throughout the system. However, what would happen to
signalling components if exposed to a higher voltage? Vital
signalling equipment needs to be treated with care if the potential
for a crash is to remain as low as reasonably practical.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000...#pt3-pb3-l1g54

In article , Denis McMahon
scribeth thus
On 23/06/10 19:05, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Rgds

Denis McMahon

Ask anyone who has to clear up from these like BT, Arquiva the
transmission sites contractor, Any UK power distribution company, anyone
who works on church roof's they'll tell you that in no uncertain terms.!

Don't bother about a high voltage deterrent, that doesn't stop them, and
if one of them gets fried they'll just leave him and go and do it again
with someone else.....
--
Tony Sayer

tony sayer wrote:

In article , Denis McMahon
scribeth thus
On 23/06/10 19:05, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Ask anyone who has to clear up from these like BT, Arquiva the
transmission sites contractor, Any UK power distribution company, anyone
who works on church roof's they'll tell you that in no uncertain terms.!

Well if you ask me (since the lead on one of my Churches was nicked some
time back), then all I'd say is that someone nicked it. I can't see why
you'd anticipate some prejudiced speculation about their identity.


--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9632824.html
(33 008 at Salisbury, 14 May 1985)

On Jun 24, 12:40*am, Tom Barry wrote:
Denis McMahon wrote:

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Rgds

Denis McMahon

Yes, that annoys me too - what's wrong with 'criminals', 'thieves' or
'anti-social greedy selfish *******s who don't give a toss about
inconveniencing the public'?

Mind you, the latter brings them uncomfortably close to respected
pillars of society like bankers, but there you go, perhaps we need to
differentiate between thieves who look like us and thieves who are a bit
dodgy and foreign, eh?

Anyway, here's hoping the Police nick them before they're all sacked to
pay for the sins of the City, otherwise FGW will be back working on the
Time Interval system before long.

Tom

The use of cross-linked polymer insulation would put paid to this
practice - it's expensive, but I guess economies of scale would kick
in if it were used for signalling.

Kev Lawrence wrote:
"CJB" wrote in message
...
On Jun 23, 9:41 pm, "
wrote:
On 23 June, 19:45, CJB wrote:





On Jun 23, 7:05 pm, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

Is there not a way that a spare core or two of the cable could carry a nice
deterrent voltage to stop this?

(probably banned cos of elf n safety!)

Kev


A better way might be to have one core with an 'active' TDR ping.

Time Domain Reflectometry sends a pulse down a wire, and recieves a
reflection from any defect, be it conductor or insulator.

This way ('cos of speed of light..) you can tell instantly exactly here
a cable is being damaged, and signal control center could arrange for
police to arrive on site..

It wouldn't work just for theft, but for any location, say where water
was getting into insulators.

Jim Chisholm

In article , Chris Tolley
scribeth thus
tony sayer wrote:

In article , Denis McMahon
scribeth thus
On 23/06/10 19:05, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Ask anyone who has to clear up from these like BT, Arquiva the
transmission sites contractor, Any UK power distribution company, anyone
who works on church roof's they'll tell you that in no uncertain terms.!

Well if you ask me (since the lead on one of my Churches was nicked some
time back), then all I'd say is that someone nicked it. I can't see why
you'd anticipate some prejudiced speculation about their identity.



Your too forgiving Chris. Perhaps if you worked for the organisations
mentioned you'd se it differently;!..

Mind you if you want to be smacked on both cheeks then don't let me stop
U....
--
Tony Sayer

In article , J. Chisholm
scribeth thus
Kev Lawrence wrote:
"CJB" wrote in message
...
On Jun 23, 9:41 pm, "
wrote:
On 23 June, 19:45, CJB wrote:





On Jun 23, 7:05 pm, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

Is there not a way that a spare core or two of the cable could carry a nice
deterrent voltage to stop this?

(probably banned cos of elf n safety!)

Kev


A better way might be to have one core with an 'active' TDR ping.

Time Domain Reflectometry sends a pulse down a wire, and recieves a
reflection from any defect, be it conductor or insulator.

This way ('cos of speed of light..) you can tell instantly exactly here
a cable is being damaged, and signal control center could arrange for
police to arrive on site..

Err .. right.. Ever tried to get old bill to turn up with any urgency in
recent times?...

It wouldn't work just for theft, but for any location, say where water
was getting into insulators.

It wouldn't necessarily work for that either..

Think about it..

Jim Chisholm

--
Tony Sayer

tony sayer wrote:

In article , Chris Tolley
scribeth thus
tony sayer wrote:

In article , Denis McMahon
scribeth thus
On 23/06/10 19:05, SB wrote:
Trains cancelled to Worcester. Trains cancelled to Wales and West
Country. Trains cancelled to Oxford and Bourne End and also to Henley.
All other trains subject to huge delays. Reason = 'signalling
problems' in the West Drayton area from last night = 'vandalism' in
the Iver area = Pikeys cut the signal cables to burn off the plastic
and sell the copper. SB

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Ask anyone who has to clear up from these like BT, Arquiva the
transmission sites contractor, Any UK power distribution company, anyone
who works on church roof's they'll tell you that in no uncertain terms.!

Well if you ask me (since the lead on one of my Churches was nicked some
time back), then all I'd say is that someone nicked it. I can't see why
you'd anticipate some prejudiced speculation about their identity.

Your too forgiving Chris. Perhaps if you worked for the organisations
mentioned you'd se it differently;!..

I don't understand the comment. It doesn't have anything to do with
forgiveness. You've got to know who it is before you can consider the
forgiveness aspect. My previous comment is only indicating a belief that
it's silly to just pick some random target out of the air to attack when
something happens.

Mind you if you want to be smacked on both cheeks then don't let me stop
U....

Well, what happened was we replaced the lead, and it was promptly nicked
again. Then we got involved with a long debate about whether we had to
replace it with lead or could use some other material (Church has listed
building status). The debate rumbles on. There isn't really time or
energy to waste worrying over who did it, or whether the second theft
was connected to the first. Too many other things to do.


--
http://gallery120232.fotopic.net/p9632899.html
(33 119 at Eastleigh, 15 May 1985)

On 24/06/2010 10:56, Geoffrey wrote:
On Jun 24, 12:40 am, Tom wrote:
Denis McMahon wrote:

And you know it was "Pikeys" (whatever they are) how exactly?

Rgds

Denis McMahon

Yes, that annoys me too - what's wrong with 'criminals', 'thieves' or
'anti-social greedy selfish *******s who don't give a toss about
inconveniencing the public'?

Mind you, the latter brings them uncomfortably close to respected
pillars of society like bankers, but there you go, perhaps we need to
differentiate between thieves who look like us and thieves who are a bit
dodgy and foreign, eh?

Anyway, here's hoping the Police nick them before they're all sacked to
pay for the sins of the City, otherwise FGW will be back working on the
Time Interval system before long.

The use of cross-linked polymer insulation would put paid to this
practice - it's expensive, but I guess economies of scale would kick
in if it were used for signalling.

I don't understand.

On 24 June, 08:23, Graeme wrote:

Wouldn't stop them trying. *There was a case recently of someone electrocuted
in a sub-station trying to steal the main feeder!

Indeed, whilst not sure whats in the sub stations worth recovering - I
assume it's copper? - a quick look at many sub stations in 3rd rail
territory (there are so many) reveals palisade fencing and now even
Gatso style cameras.

I don't think I will be giving away state secrets to advise that these
cameras are very real and monitored very well indeed. This additional
security over the last few years certainly seems to be more related to
copper fairies than to stupid yoofs having a lark about.


Richard