Public internet access on the london underground
 

In the past, there has been discussion about allowing mobile phone
operators to install base stations below ground and provide some
coverage for folks on trains. This is yet to happen?

I was on a tube train today and was thinking sod that...

What we really need is internet wireless hotspots on each train,
connected to the rest of the world via the train wheels? Could the use
of Power Line Technology (as done in the home with those plug-in mains
ethernet adaptors) help here?

Be far more useful to the travelling public than a mobile phone service
that enables Sharon to witter inanely about the minimun distance she
should dance from her handbag at the disco...

--
Adrian C

Public internet access on the london underground
 

"Adrian C" wrote in message
...
In the past, there has been discussion about allowing mobile phone
operators to install base stations below ground and provide some coverage
for folks on trains. This is yet to happen?

I was on a tube train today and was thinking sod that...

What we really need is internet wireless hotspots on each train, connected
to the rest of the world via the train wheels? Could the use of Power Line
Technology (as done in the home with those plug-in mains ethernet
adaptors) help here?

The problem is that even if it did work there would be no-one to pay for it.

Whatever system is implemented it has to be one which charges for use,
otherwise no-one is going to make the investment in installing it

tim

Public internet access on the london underground
 

In message , at 08:51:44 on Sun, 11 Sep
2011, Huge remarked:

There was an announcement many months ago that mobile phone coverage
below ground would not be implemented.

Hurrah!

It's a disincentive to use the tube, and will become increasingly so as
people's lives revolve around their Smartphones and apps. Obviously the
"I'm on the train" brigade are a pain, but it's such a noisy environment
(except between trains at a station) people should really not attempt
it.
--
Roland Perry

Public internet access on the london underground
 

On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 08:52:26 +0000, Huge wrote:

On 2011-09-10, Adrian C wrote:
In the past, there has been discussion about allowing mobile phone
operators to install base stations below ground and provide some
coverage for folks on trains. This is yet to happen?

So what? Read a book, go to sleep, get a life.
I don't live in London but I know from my visits how hectic it is. I
certainly wouldn't want to live in London but it is great for a visit.
I would imagine that being cut off from communication is a welcome break
for many people. It probably makes people more efficient rather than less
so. Rather like when some people, at work might, look something up an the
Net that is non-work related. People need a mental break in order to
function at their best.

--
'Sign' the Government ePetition:
"Mobile phone data should be free to use, unhindered, in any way you
wish." http://epetitions.direct.gov.uk/petitions/6191

Public internet access on the london underground
 

On Sep 10, 11:09*pm, Adrian C wrote:
In the past, there has been discussion about allowing mobile phone
operators to install base stations below ground and provide some
coverage for folks on trains. This is yet to happen?

I was on a tube train today and was thinking sod that...

What we really need is internet wireless hotspots on each train,
connected to the rest of the world via the train wheels? Could the use
of Power Line Technology (as done in the home with those plug-in mains
ethernet adaptors) help here?

Be far more useful to the travelling public than a mobile phone service
that enables Sharon to witter inanely about the minimun distance she
should dance from her handbag at the disco...

I'd imagine there's pretty much zero chance Power Line Technology
could possibly be made to work in the way you describe - and that's
without thinking about the potential (or rather, I'd think, very real)
conflicts with signalling systems.

Public internet access on the london underground
 

In message , at 11:22:38 on Sun, 11 Sep
2011, Huge remarked:
It's a disincentive to use the tube,

Tosh.

Besides, it's not as much of a disincentive as having the crap kicked out
of you by your enraged fellow travellers.

I fail to see why looking at my smartphone to see if my train is leaving
the main line station on time, is something that would enrage fellow
travellers. They might be more enraged if I pushed them aside in a
futile dash to catch a train that had already departed.
--
Roland Perry

Public internet access on the london underground
 

In message
, at
05:39:51 on Sun, 11 Sep 2011, Mizter T remarked:
I'd imagine there's pretty much zero chance Power Line Technology
could possibly be made to work in the way you describe

But some kind of leaky feeder or beacon system would. Don't get too
distracted by the technology rather than the funding and sociology.
--
Roland Perry

Public internet access on the london underground
 

On Sep 11, 2:57*pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
, at
05:39:51 on Sun, 11 Sep 2011, Mizter T remarked:

I'd imagine there's pretty much zero chance Power Line Technology
could possibly be made to work in the way you describe

But some kind of leaky feeder or beacon system would. Don't get too
distracted by the technology rather than the funding and sociology.

I was just addressing that particular bit of the OP's question.

Agreed about the broader point - if someone wants to pay for it, then
it'll happen. Fitting equipment in deep level tunnels however isn't
that easy a proposition - there'd need to be a near enough as can be
100% guarantee that it wouldn't catch fire, nor interfere with any
safety critical LU kit such as signalling or comms, plus there'd be
the very real issue of maintenance access.

Let's see what the response is to TfL's invitation to tender for
providing wifi at "up to 120 stations" after the well received six-
month trial run at Charing Cross run in conjunction with BT - the TfL
press release says "A contract will be awarded to the chosen bidder by
the end of 2011"...
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...ive/19623.aspx

Public internet access on the london underground
 

In message
, at
07:53:32 on Sun, 11 Sep 2011, Mizter T remarked:
Fitting equipment in deep level tunnels however isn't
that easy a proposition - there'd need to be a near enough as can be
100% guarantee that it wouldn't catch fire, nor interfere with any
safety critical LU kit such as signalling or comms, plus there'd be
the very real issue of maintenance access.

They fitted mobile access into the Heathrow Express tunnels years ago.
Also the tunnel on the Oslo airport express. None of the issues you
mention would be special to the London tubes.
--
Roland Perry

Public internet access on the london underground
 

On Sep 11, 4:24*pm, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
, at
07:53:32 on Sun, 11 Sep 2011, Mizter T remarked:

Fitting equipment in deep level tunnels however isn't
that easy a proposition - there'd need to be a near enough as can be
100% guarantee that it wouldn't catch fire, nor interfere with any
safety critical LU kit such as signalling or comms, plus there'd be
the very real issue of maintenance access.

They fitted mobile access into the Heathrow Express tunnels years ago.
Also the tunnel on the Oslo airport express. None of the issues you
mention would be special to the London tubes.

And the T&W Metro has had it since the early/mid noughties. However
they are all are smaller networks / lengths of tunnels, the tunnels
themselves are all of a larger bore, and they are all of at least
relatively modern construction. I'm not suggesting it'd be impossible
on London Underground, merely that the issues are likely to be
somewhat exacerbated.

Perhaps the most pertinent point is that no telecoms company has as
yet installed any mobile access on the LU network, even just on
stations (though see my earlier comments re the wifi project) - it's
not like TfL haven't been interested either:
http://www.theregister.co.uk/2009/03...ile_cancelled/

Some pertinent comments from a TfL spokesperson in the above piece...

---quote---
A spokeswoman for TfL said: "London Underground tendered for a trial
of mobile phones on the Waterloo and City line, but the market has yet
to provide us with a credible proposal for enabling mobile phone use
on the Tube.

"While it is technically possible to deploy mobile phone and data
wireless solutions on the deep level Underground tunnels and stations,
the unique nature and environment of the Tube mean that project costs
would be prohibitively high at this time."
---/quote---