As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

https://www.globalrailnews.com/2017/...railway-fleet/

On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.

--
Spud

wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.


I don't know if there are any maintenance issues with the current stock,
but having the new stock built as single articulated units increases
capacity and flexibility, allowing the attendant to access the entire
length of the train at any time.

The old DLR stock may have second-value if they're in good nick, just as
the original stock did. For example, I wonder if the T&W Metro could use
them? The current Metro stock is much older, and is due to be replaced in
a few years, just when the DLR trains could be available.

On Thu, 18 May 2017 20:02:59 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.


I don't know if there are any maintenance issues with the current stock,
but having the new stock built as single articulated units increases
capacity and flexibility, allowing the attendant to access the entire
length of the train at any time.

The old DLR stock may have second-value if they're in good nick, just as
the original stock did. For example, I wonder if the T&W Metro could use
them? The current Metro stock is much older, and is due to be replaced in
a few years, just when the DLR trains could be available.


An interesting thought.
One of the 1st batch, (car no. 11?) was fitted with a pantograph for
"Metrolink publicity trails" in Manchester many years ago.

T&W 's 1.5kV operating voltage might be a problem though?

DC

---
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David C wrote:
On Thu, 18 May 2017 20:02:59 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.


I don't know if there are any maintenance issues with the current stock,
but having the new stock built as single articulated units increases
capacity and flexibility, allowing the attendant to access the entire
length of the train at any time.

The old DLR stock may have second-value if they're in good nick, just as
the original stock did. For example, I wonder if the T&W Metro could use
them? The current Metro stock is much older, and is due to be replaced in
a few years, just when the DLR trains could be available.


An interesting thought.
One of the 1st batch, (car no. 11?) was fitted with a pantograph for
"Metrolink publicity trails" in Manchester many years ago.

The original P86 and P89 DLR trains were later fitted with pans and cabs:
https://youtu.be/hr_PtAIuD90


T&W 's 1.5kV operating voltage might be a problem though?

I'd have thought that would be easily dealt with.

On Fri, 19 May 2017 07:26:37 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
David C wrote:
The old DLR stock may have second-value if they're in good nick, just as
the original stock did. For example, I wonder if the T&W Metro could use
them? The current Metro stock is much older, and is due to be replaced in
a few years, just when the DLR trains could be available.

They're the right size, but whether the geordies would want 2nd hand cast offs
from London is another matter entirely.

T&W 's 1.5kV operating voltage might be a problem though?

I'd have thought that would be easily dealt with.

If it was AC yes - you change or re-tap the transformer, job done. DC I
suspect is not so simple. I imagine a lot of the front end power electronics
would have to be replaced.

--
Spud

On 19.05.17 8:26, Recliner wrote:
David C wrote:
On Thu, 18 May 2017 20:02:59 -0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.


I don't know if there are any maintenance issues with the current stock,
but having the new stock built as single articulated units increases
capacity and flexibility, allowing the attendant to access the entire
length of the train at any time.

The old DLR stock may have second-value if they're in good nick, just as
the original stock did. For example, I wonder if the T&W Metro could use
them? The current Metro stock is much older, and is due to be replaced in
a few years, just when the DLR trains could be available.


An interesting thought.
One of the 1st batch, (car no. 11?) was fitted with a pantograph for
"Metrolink publicity trails" in Manchester many years ago.

The original P86 and P89 DLR trains were later fitted with pans and cabs:
https://youtu.be/hr_PtAIuD90


T&W 's 1.5kV operating voltage might be a problem though?

I'd have thought that would be easily dealt with.

Do you think that Vivarail might be interested in them? Or do we need to
see how the 230s first work out before they can consider that?

On 18/05/2017 21:02, Recliner wrote:
allowing the attendant to access the entire
length of the train at any time.

Uh oh - I foresee threats of industrial action shortly (before anyone
suggests I'm being unfair, this is exactly what happened when the DLR
went to three units)

wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.

More in this:
https://www.londonreconnections.com/2017/bakerloo-deja-vu-buying-new-trains-for-the-dlr/

It seems the trains only had a 25 year design life, are used very
intensively, and do now need structural work to stay in service:
http://www.plantengineer.org.uk/plant-engineer-news/refurbishment-underway-for-docklands-light-railway/154830/

On Fri, 19 May 2017 08:55:38 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote:
wrote:
On Wed, 17 May 2017 15:17:11 +0100
Recliner wrote:
As expected, TfL has started the procurement process to replace
two-thirds of the DLR fleet (the B90, B92 and B2K sets), plus extra
stock to increase services. The 43 new generation articulated trains,
entering service from 2022, will be single 87m units, equivalent to
three of the current two-section units (which is how most DLR trains
runs now).

Why do light rail and tram vehicles seem to have a much shorter shelf life
than heavy rail trains? Is it build quality? The DLR trains seem in fairly
good nick to me, I can't see any pressing need as a passenger for them to
be replaced.

It seems the trains only had a 25 year design life, are used very
intensively, and do now need structural work to stay in service:
http://www.plantengineer.org.uk/plan...t-underway-for
docklands-light-railway/154830/

As usual the buy-it-on-the-cheap approach comes back to bite them. You'd have
thought they'd have learnt their lesson with the 92 stock. The other document
mentions a strenuous life for the trains, can't see it myself. There are far
older trams ploughing up and down far steeper inclines around europe that
don't have a nice reserved right of way.

--
Spud