717s skipping stops
For the 2nd time I've now been on 717 out of Moorgate and for the 2nd time
it skipped Old Street and Essex road. Anyone know if this is to do with the sighting issues that have been mentioned or there some other problem at these stations wrt these trains? |
717s skipping stops
wrote:
For the 2nd time I've now been on 717 out of Moorgate and for the 2nd time it skipped Old Street and Essex road. Anyone know if this is to do with the sighting issues that have been mentioned or there some other problem at these stations wrt these trains? I know they currently need a second driver in the cab at some stations till the signals are relocated. Perhaps, in the absence of said second pair of eyes, they have to skip such stations? |
717s skipping stops
On Fri, 24 May 2019 20:30:04 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: wrote: For the 2nd time I've now been on 717 out of Moorgate and for the 2nd time it skipped Old Street and Essex road. Anyone know if this is to do with the sighting issues that have been mentioned or there some other problem at these stations wrt these trains? I know they currently need a second driver in the cab at some stations till the signals are relocated. Perhaps, in the absence of said second pair of eyes, they have to skip such stations? Sounds plausible. Suits me though - saves 5 mins on the journey! |
717s skipping stops
wrote:
On Fri, 24 May 2019 20:30:04 -0000 (UTC) Recliner wrote: wrote: For the 2nd time I've now been on 717 out of Moorgate and for the 2nd time it skipped Old Street and Essex road. Anyone know if this is to do with the sighting issues that have been mentioned or there some other problem at these stations wrt these trains? I know they currently need a second driver in the cab at some stations till the signals are relocated. Perhaps, in the absence of said second pair of eyes, they have to skip such stations? Sounds plausible. Suits me though - saves 5 mins on the journey! Do they warn in advance that the stops will be skipped? That might confirm the theory. |
717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 10:33:40 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: wrote: On Fri, 24 May 2019 20:30:04 -0000 (UTC) Recliner wrote: wrote: For the 2nd time I've now been on 717 out of Moorgate and for the 2nd time it skipped Old Street and Essex road. Anyone know if this is to do with the sighting issues that have been mentioned or there some other problem at these stations wrt these trains? I know they currently need a second driver in the cab at some stations till the signals are relocated. Perhaps, in the absence of said second pair of eyes, they have to skip such stations? Sounds plausible. Suits me though - saves 5 mins on the journey! Do they warn in advance that the stops will be skipped? That might confirm the theory. They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. |
717s skipping stops
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717s skipping stops
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717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 12:38:47 +0100
Recliner wrote: On Sat, 25 May 2019 10:54:26 +0000 (UTC), wrote: They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. Yes, that seems to confirm it. I suppose that the other possibility is that they're some sort of express skip-stop service, that would suit travellers such as you, but I guess that they'd then be branded and promoted as such. That would probably be a first on that section of line. This story provides a bit more info, but doesn't actually answer the question: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...n-cab-drivers- window-passengers-danger.html Looking at the cab photos it does look rather overcrowded and its fairly obvious why the drivers view is restricted. But they really should have thought of this during the design. I wonder if a mirror at a suitable angle on the left of the drivers window that could be folded away when above ground would help them see the signals? |
717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 15:26:41 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 11:54, wrote: They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. Are these scheduled trains, or are they untimetabled extras going to Gordon Hill? If I showed up at Old Street for an infrequent service to The train was going to gordon hill but whether it was timetabled or not I couldn't say. |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 15:26:41 on Sat, 25 May
2019, Basil Jet remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
On 25/05/2019 16:34, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 15:26:41 on Sat, 25 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? I meant Letchworth. but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. The track to sit around reversing at Stevenage is not available, but the track to reverse at Letchworth was available a few years ago so I'm not sure what's changed that justifies bustituting a branch for a year. -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Pere Ubu - 1991 - Worlds In Collision |
717s skipping stops
On 25/05/2019 15:57, wrote:
On Sat, 25 May 2019 15:26:41 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 11:54, wrote: They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. Are these scheduled trains, or are they untimetabled extras going to Gordon Hill? If I showed up at Old Street for an infrequent service to The train was going to gordon hill but whether it was timetabled or not I couldn't say. Roughly what time did they leave Moorgate, and was it Sat/Sun/Other? -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Pere Ubu - 1991 - Worlds In Collision |
717s skipping stops
What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Pere Ubu - 1991 - Worlds In Collision |
717s skipping stops
Basil Jet wrote:
What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. |
717s skipping stops
On 25/05/2019 21:44, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote: What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. Thanks, I didn't see that story. So can't they just stop a bit further back, or do these new trains not have selective door opening? Or would that leave them hanging into the previous block and killing the line capacity? -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Pere Ubu - 1991 - Worlds In Collision |
717s skipping stops
Basil Jet wrote:
On 25/05/2019 21:44, Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. Thanks, I didn't see that story. So can't they just stop a bit further back, or do these new trains not have selective door opening? Or would that leave them hanging into the previous block and killing the line capacity? Neither: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-6790547/200million-train-cab-drivers-window-passengers-danger.html |
717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 18:28:31 +0100
Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 15:57, wrote: On Sat, 25 May 2019 15:26:41 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 11:54, wrote: They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. Are these scheduled trains, or are they untimetabled extras going to Gordon Hill? If I showed up at Old Street for an infrequent service to The train was going to gordon hill but whether it was timetabled or not I couldn't say. Roughly what time did they leave Moorgate, and was it Sat/Sun/Other? Around 2.30 on friday afternoon. |
717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 20:44:31 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. Are they fitting all the lines out of KX? If its just the tunnel section to moorgate it seems a bit overkill given AFAIK the max speed is only 30mph. |
717s skipping stops
On Sat, 25 May 2019 21:59:38 -0000 (UTC)
Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 21:44, Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. Thanks, I didn't see that story. So can't they just stop a bit further back, or do these new trains not have selective door opening? Or would that leave them hanging into the previous block and killing the line capacity? Neither: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...n-cab-drivers- window-passengers-danger.html Looking at the cab pictures again, I wonder why they didn't put the drivers equipment at shoulder or lower height as in most locomotives so he could see to the right, and then put a window in the emergency door. That would probably solve a lot of the visibility issues. |
717s skipping stops
On Sun, 26 May 2019 14:35:08 +0000 (UTC),
wrote: On Sat, 25 May 2019 21:59:38 -0000 (UTC) Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 21:44, Recliner wrote: Basil Jet wrote: What baffles me is why why poor signal views in a tunnel would prevent stopping at a station but would allow whizzing through. It sounds more like the new trains are longer than the old ones and the driver's cab of a stopped new train is the wrong side of the starter, and the in-cab tech solution isn't working yet. They're not longer, but have to stop further back for the driver, sitting further back in the narrow cab, to be able to see the signal, as indicated in the newspaper report I linked. The trains are fully fitted for ERTMS, but it's not yet installed on the line. I'm not sure when it'll go live. When it is, the lineside signals will be removed. Thanks, I didn't see that story. So can't they just stop a bit further back, or do these new trains not have selective door opening? Or would that leave them hanging into the previous block and killing the line capacity? Neither: https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...n-cab-drivers- window-passengers-danger.html Looking at the cab pictures again, I wonder why they didn't put the drivers equipment at shoulder or lower height as in most locomotives so he could see to the right, and then put a window in the emergency door. That would probably solve a lot of the visibility issues. I think the emergency ramp folds against the inside of the door. |
717s skipping stops
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717s skipping stops
On 26/05/2019 15:28, wrote:
On Sat, 25 May 2019 18:28:31 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 15:57, wrote: On Sat, 25 May 2019 15:26:41 +0100 Basil Jet wrote: On 25/05/2019 11:54, wrote: They do. Followed shortly after by people rushing off the train. Are these scheduled trains, or are they untimetabled extras going to Gordon Hill? If I showed up at Old Street for an infrequent service to The train was going to gordon hill but whether it was timetabled or not I couldn't say. Roughly what time did they leave Moorgate, and was it Sat/Sun/Other? Around 2.30 on friday afternoon. There are no scheduled Gordon Hill terminators leaving Moorgate between 0825 and 1625, so it's an extra and can stop and skip where it likes. -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Robert Forster - 2019 - Inferno |
717s skipping stops
On Sun, 26 May 2019 16:01:09 +0100
Recliner wrote: On Sun, 26 May 2019 14:35:08 +0000 (UTC), wrote: Looking at the cab pictures again, I wonder why they didn't put the drivers equipment at shoulder or lower height as in most locomotives so he could see to the right, and then put a window in the emergency door. That would probably solve a lot of the visibility issues. I think the emergency ramp folds against the inside of the door. Ah. A simple solution but probably not the smartest it turns out. |
717s skipping stops
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 15:26:41 on Sat, 25 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. Google suggests there are three trains after midnight, which suggests that the track is present and correct. Anna Noyd-Dryver |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 19:33:58 on Thu, 30 May
2019, Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. Google suggests there are three trains after midnight, which suggests that the track is present and correct. Enough to run a full service, during the day? -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
On 31/05/2019 06:54, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 19:33:58 on Thu, 30 May 2019, Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. Google suggests there are three trains after midnight, which suggests that the track is present and correct. Enough to run a full service, during the day? Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Simple Kid - 2003 - SK1 |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 12:31:35 on Fri, 31 May
2019, Basil Jet remarked: Incidentally, Watton-At-Stone now has practically no trains to Stevenage on Monday to Fridays. The GBNRTT gives no hint of replacement bus times. There's long term engineering works near Stevenage, and I think the replacement buses run "on demand". There are no shortage of electric trains sitting around unused that could run an hourly shuttle from Watton to Knebworth, Wouldn't that involve a reversal at Stevenage? but they can't be arsed. Or the track's not available. Google suggests there are three trains after midnight, which suggests that the track is present and correct. Enough to run a full service, during the day? Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote:
Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Simple Kid - 2003 - SK1 |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May
2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Watton-at-Stone. This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Watton-at-Stone. This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform next year." |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 16:14:27 on Fri, 31 May
2019, Certes remarked: On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Watton-at-Stone. This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform next year." Which involves closing the branch for engineering work. Chicken, meet egg. -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
On 31/05/2019 16:41, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:14:27 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Certes remarked: On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Â* Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. Â*If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* Watton-at-Stone. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Â*Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform Â*Â*Â*Â*Â* next year." Which involves closing the branch for engineering work. Chicken, meet egg. Except that the extra platform was supposed to be in use when the extra trains started. They delayed the extra platform but chose not to delay the extra trains. -- Basil Jet recently enjoyed listening to Simple Kid - 2003 - SK1 |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 20:32:07 on Fri, 31 May
2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 16:41, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 16:14:27 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Certes remarked: On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? * Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. *If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: ********* "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network ******** Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track ******** that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations ******** further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves ******** construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, ******** signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to ******** Watton-at-Stone. ********* This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more ******** trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." *Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: ***** "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. ***** You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform ***** next year." Which involves closing the branch for engineering work. Chicken, meet egg. Except that the extra platform was supposed to be in use when the extra trains started. They delayed the extra platform but chose not to delay the extra trains. Could they have built the platform and connecting tracks, without causing disruption to the service to Watton-on-Stone earlier (genuine question). In other news I see that GN are claiming credit for their team having built the new carriage berthing facility at Cambridge. Not Network Rail? https://twitter.com/GNRailUK/status/1129452376216231937 -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:14:27 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Certes remarked: On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Watton-at-Stone. This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform next year." Which involves closing the branch for engineering work. Chicken, meet egg. Does it, though? Presumably if it was closed for engineering works they wouldn’t reopen it for three trains after midnight and four trains before 0630 every day, and an hourly service at weekends. The service appears to run single line from a crossover between Watton-at-stone and Langley Junction, passing under the mainline to the down side and terminating in the down slow platform at Stevenage, from where it reverses and runs along the down slow in the up direction to Langley Jn and back under the mainline, continuing wrong line as far as the crossover mentioned earlier (which incidentally appears to be where the Watton-at-stone terminators run to, to reverse. The new platform at Stevenage will be on the down side, and it appears that the new line will be adjacent to the down slow from Langley Jn to Stevenage station. The current working arrangements will otherwise unchanged, I think (ie running single line from the crossover). Clearly installing the connection between the branch and the new line will involve a possession, but not every weekday daytime for 18 months, no matter how slow you work. It’s only one set of points. The work must be being done without closing the down slow as that’s in use throughout. Anna Noyd-Dryver |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 06:36:50 on Sat, 1 Jun 2019,
Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 16:14:27 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Certes remarked: On 31/05/2019 15:38, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 15:14:12 on Fri, 31 May 2019, Basil Jet remarked: On 31/05/2019 14:45, Roland Perry wrote: Is bustituting an entire line on weekdays just so they can run more trains on a different one a year before the paths to run both were available unprecedented? Not sure what element of that is the core of you question. Doing engineering works ahead of time, or works on a main line needing an adjacent branch line to be closed to facilitate it. They're not closing the branch for engineering work. They're closing it because they've stolen its weekday paths to strengthen services on the main line. If that's the case, I've misconstrued the following reason posted by GN: "We are providing rail replacement bus services while Network Rail complete a major upgrade to Stevenage station and the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone and destinations further south on the Hertford Loop. This upgrade involves the construction of a new fifth platform at Stevenage and the track, signalling and other infrastructure required to connect it to Watton-at-Stone. This major upgrade will mean that Great Northern can run more trains per hour between Stevenage and Watton-at-Stone." Is it possible that closing the branch line connection for the reasons they give has *incidentally* released some main line paths which are useful to LNER ahead of re-timing the whole line for IEP running and KGX throat upgrade from 2020 (when the branch line reopens for normal business)? What that may mean is: "We have reallocated your platform to more important customers. You can have your trains back when we build an extra platform next year." Which involves closing the branch for engineering work. Chicken, meet egg. Does it, though? Presumably if it was closed for engineering works they wouldn’t reopen it for three trains after midnight and four trains before 0630 every day, and an hourly service at weekends. The service appears to run single line from a crossover between Watton-at-stone and Langley Junction, passing under the mainline to the down side and terminating in the down slow platform at Stevenage, from where it reverses and runs along the down slow in the up direction to Langley Jn and back under the mainline, continuing wrong line as far as the crossover mentioned earlier (which incidentally appears to be where the Watton-at-stone terminators run to, to reverse. The new platform at Stevenage will be on the down side, and it appears that the new line will be adjacent to the down slow from Langley Jn to Stevenage station. The current working arrangements will otherwise unchanged, I think (ie running single line from the crossover). Clearly installing the connection between the branch and the new line will involve a possession, but not every weekday daytime for 18 months, no matter how slow you work. It’s only one set of points. The work must be being done without closing the down slow as that’s in use throughout. In other words - yes I have misconstrued GN's spin in their announcement above. -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 06:36:50 on Sat, 1 Jun 2019,
Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: if it was closed for engineering works they wouldn’t reopen it for three trains after midnight and four trains before 0630 every day, Those sound like stock positioning moves, which they also schedule for passenger service. -- Roland Perry |
717s skipping stops
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 06:36:50 on Sat, 1 Jun 2019, Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: if it was closed for engineering works they wouldn’t reopen it for three trains after midnight and four trains before 0630 every day, Those sound like stock positioning moves, which they also schedule for passenger service. However it means the line is open and available during those hours. If it wasn’t, they’d have to go the long way round. Anna Noyd-Dryver |
717s skipping stops
In message , at 09:37:28 on Sat, 1 Jun 2019,
Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked: if it was closed for engineering works they wouldn’t reopen it for three trains after midnight and four trains before 0630 every day, Those sound like stock positioning moves, which they also schedule for passenger service. However it means the line is open and available during those hours. If it wasn’t, they’d have to go the long way round. It's the GA announcement which gave the impression the line was closed (for engineering) during the periods buses were being supplied. "[because of] a major upgrade to ... the track that connects Stevenage with Watton-at-Stone" -- Roland Perry |
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