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Old June 24th 19, 02:43 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 14:15:06 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:00:18 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:

At High street Ken the position of the steam loco meant it was in the open


But even the under-the-canopy engine in their shot of Ealing Broadway is
completely devoid of any smoke or steam.


At Ealing Broadway platform 9 as you know having used it was set side for
travellers on the special


Curiously, it didn't stop the PIS displaying fictional District Line
train to places like Plaistow.

and a few others in connection with it,


By day 2 they weren't making much effort at keeping normals off either
the footbridge or the steps down. People would only be challenged once
on platform 9, and approaching the first roped-off boarding area.
even then, if you claimed to booked on a carriage further down the
platform, they'd simply let you past.

the normal passengers were not deposited alongside down a stairway on
to the platform or off a service train on the other face of an Island
Platform and even at Ealing the canopy is nice and high ,same with
Earls Court. That’s why I used the term poorly vented ones rather
than completely open,but further East along the District main line
how far do you have to go to reach such a station able to turn around
a steam special. Barking maybe and that may have been too far to run
more then one or possibly two round trips.


They used Moorgate on the previous occasion. Which while having some
handy bay platforms, is not even vaguely open-air (I went on the C-stock
last trip from there in 2014). That was different because it travelled
at normal speed. Still took much of the day to go from Moorgate to
Barking to Hammersmith.

The engine crew did keep the smoke emission to a minimum but on the trip I
did there was definitely some while doing the turnaround at High Street Ken
and a little at Ealing Broadway.
Perhaps there was not as much need to build up the fire at Ealing as Sarah
Siddons would be hauling the train out leaving plenty of time to put coal
on once clear of the canopy.

That you didn’t have any just means that conditions for your trip were
different than mine.

Anyhow , did you enjoy your outing?


It was OK, but I didn't ultimately feel it was value for money. Given
the number of opportunities to get close-up afforded to the general
public, it would have been almost as good to just go and look. See that
Youtube video I found and posted.

Not compared to a railtour brochure that arrived here today for a trip
from Ely to Bristol, via Leicester (and back), at £80. Only diesel
hauled though, but similar prices available for steam tours.
--
Roland Perry

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Old June 24th 19, 04:33 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 08:49:38 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
Anyone going on the trips tomorrow?


The Times report:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/m...e-to-the-past-
n3fflhnjj?shareToken=ba4a2bbcd9ed7c9d0229bb423dde6 8bd

I'm curious why it didn't go on the original District line, through South
Ken and on to Whitechapel? The route they did use was largely overground
(indeed, on viaduct), and some near High St Ken was only covered long after
the original opening.


I'm sure it was a result of wanting to make as many trips per day as
possible. According to the steward in our carriage, there's a 10mph
speed limit approaching every station for this sort of train and the 2hr
return trip diagram (to include boarding and detraining) was plenty long
enough.

A longer trip would also have interrupted the normal service too much
(given the slow progress of the steam train).

We brushed shoulders with all three of the character-actors in that
photo, and there were a few more, including a Policeman, and of course
the band.

As for smoke-amd-smells, there was none, and one could be forgiven for
thinking they weren't burning coal at all (they didn't say). Plenty of
steam, and chuff-chuff noises, though.

The only part that wasn't in daylight was from Earl Court station to
outside South Ken. On the first half of the trip we stopped numerous
times in that darkness.


South Ken? Or High St Ken?

During the steam era, that was all in the open (it was only built over in
the 1950s, for the West London Air Terminal). That covered section past
Triangle Sidings is very short indeed, so it seems unlikely you'd have
stopped numerous times.

You would also have gone through a different covered section between Earls
Court and Barons Court, under the former exhibition hall. That too would
have been open in the steam era, and for some decades thereafter (the
exhibition hall was built over the tracks in 1935-7).

So in steam days, that route would have been entirely in the open. And the
sections that are covered now aren't real tunnels, just roofed-over former
open sections.

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Old June 24th 19, 04:33 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 14:15:06 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:00:18 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:

At High street Ken the position of the steam loco meant it was in the open

But even the under-the-canopy engine in their shot of Ealing Broadway is
completely devoid of any smoke or steam.


At Ealing Broadway platform 9 as you know having used it was set side for
travellers on the special


Curiously, it didn't stop the PIS displaying fictional District Line
train to places like Plaistow.

and a few others in connection with it,


By day 2 they weren't making much effort at keeping normals off either
the footbridge or the steps down. People would only be challenged once
on platform 9, and approaching the first roped-off boarding area.
even then, if you claimed to booked on a carriage further down the
platform, they'd simply let you past.

the normal passengers were not deposited alongside down a stairway on
to the platform or off a service train on the other face of an Island
Platform and even at Ealing the canopy is nice and high ,same with
Earls Court. That’s why I used the term poorly vented ones rather
than completely open,but further East along the District main line
how far do you have to go to reach such a station able to turn around
a steam special. Barking maybe and that may have been too far to run
more then one or possibly two round trips.


They used Moorgate on the previous occasion. Which while having some
handy bay platforms, is not even vaguely open-air (I went on the C-stock
last trip from there in 2014). That was different because it travelled
at normal speed. Still took much of the day to go from Moorgate to
Barking to Hammersmith.

The engine crew did keep the smoke emission to a minimum but on the trip I
did there was definitely some while doing the turnaround at High Street Ken
and a little at Ealing Broadway.
Perhaps there was not as much need to build up the fire at Ealing as Sarah
Siddons would be hauling the train out leaving plenty of time to put coal
on once clear of the canopy.

That you didn’t have any just means that conditions for your trip were
different than mine.

Anyhow , did you enjoy your outing?


It was OK, but I didn't ultimately feel it was value for money. Given
the number of opportunities to get close-up afforded to the general
public, it would have been almost as good to just go and look. See that
Youtube video I found and posted.


Yes, that's the trouble with steam specials: the paying passengers don't
get nearly as good a view as the spectators.


Not compared to a railtour brochure that arrived here today for a trip
from Ely to Bristol, via Leicester (and back), at £80. Only diesel
hauled though, but similar prices available for steam tours.


Steam hauled is usually a lot more expensive, I thought? But I don't do
very much main line steam in the UK.


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Old June 24th 19, 08:12 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 16:33:58 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 08:49:38 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
Anyone going on the trips tomorrow?

The Times report:
https://www.thetimes.co.uk/article/m...e-to-the-past-
n3fflhnjj?shareToken=ba4a2bbcd9ed7c9d0229bb423dde6 8bd

I'm curious why it didn't go on the original District line, through South
Ken and on to Whitechapel? The route they did use was largely overground
(indeed, on viaduct), and some near High St Ken was only covered long after
the original opening.


I'm sure it was a result of wanting to make as many trips per day as
possible. According to the steward in our carriage, there's a 10mph
speed limit approaching every station for this sort of train and the 2hr
return trip diagram (to include boarding and detraining) was plenty long
enough.

A longer trip would also have interrupted the normal service too much
(given the slow progress of the steam train).

We brushed shoulders with all three of the character-actors in that
photo, and there were a few more, including a Policeman, and of course
the band.

As for smoke-amd-smells, there was none, and one could be forgiven for
thinking they weren't burning coal at all (they didn't say). Plenty of
steam, and chuff-chuff noises, though.

The only part that wasn't in daylight was from Earl Court station to
outside South Ken. On the first half of the trip we stopped numerous
times in that darkness.


South Ken? Or High St Ken?


The latter. (Too many Kensingtons!)

During the steam era, that was all in the open (it was only built over in
the 1950s, for the West London Air Terminal). That covered section past
Triangle Sidings is very short indeed, so it seems unlikely you'd have
stopped numerous times.


I have it on video. We stopped several times.

You would also have gone through a different covered section between Earls
Court and Barons Court, under the former exhibition hall. That too would
have been open in the steam era, and for some decades thereafter (the
exhibition hall was built over the tracks in 1935-7).

So in steam days, that route would have been entirely in the open. And the
sections that are covered now aren't real tunnels, just roofed-over former
open sections.


--
Roland Perry
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Old June 24th 19, 08:20 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 16:33:59 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:

It was OK, but I didn't ultimately feel it was value for money. Given
the number of opportunities to get close-up afforded to the general
public, it would have been almost as good to just go and look. See that
Youtube video I found and posted.


Yes, that's the trouble with steam specials: the paying passengers don't
get nearly as good a view as the spectators.


This trip was a bit different, especially for spectators. Going
backwards and forwards over a short route and with numerous station
platforms. But it was also notable how many people in houses and their
gardens, and open spaces, that we passed were also filming and waving.

I've also videoed several mainline steam tours as a spectator, and it's
unusual to get more than a few seconds from a nearby field, road, or
whatever.

Not compared to a railtour brochure that arrived here today for a trip
from Ely to Bristol, via Leicester (and back), at 80. Only diesel
hauled though, but similar prices available for steam tours.


Steam hauled is usually a lot more expensive, I thought? But I don't do
very much main line steam in the UK.


They all seem to start at 80. That's the cheap seats in the other half
of the buffet car, usually.
--
Roland Perry


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Old June 24th 19, 09:34 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:33:59 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:

It was OK, but I didn't ultimately feel it was value for money. Given
the number of opportunities to get close-up afforded to the general
public, it would have been almost as good to just go and look. See that
Youtube video I found and posted.


Yes, that's the trouble with steam specials: the paying passengers don't
get nearly as good a view as the spectators.


This trip was a bit different, especially for spectators. Going
backwards and forwards over a short route and with numerous station
platforms. But it was also notable how many people in houses and their
gardens, and open spaces, that we passed were also filming and waving.

The series of Trains had received mention on the various news outlets
aimed at Londoners so many would have been aware of them, in contrast
unless it is the Flying Scotsman most Steam tours pass unnoticed nowdays as
they are no longer that rare compared with the situation a couple of
decades ago when a local newspaper would consider a steam train passing
worth a mention.
Ironically a good example of that occurred at Ealing Broadway on Saturday
Morning, as people assembled for the 1st departure of the District line
tour a class 33 passed through on the main line with some MK1s and a Steam
Loco on the back presumably ECS heading somewhere for a tour.
It was hardly noticed,

GH

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Old June 24th 19, 11:35 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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Marland wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:33:59 on Mon, 24 Jun
2019, Recliner remarked:

It was OK, but I didn't ultimately feel it was value for money. Given
the number of opportunities to get close-up afforded to the general
public, it would have been almost as good to just go and look. See that
Youtube video I found and posted.

Yes, that's the trouble with steam specials: the paying passengers don't
get nearly as good a view as the spectators.


This trip was a bit different, especially for spectators. Going
backwards and forwards over a short route and with numerous station
platforms. But it was also notable how many people in houses and their
gardens, and open spaces, that we passed were also filming and waving.

The series of Trains had received mention on the various news outlets
aimed at Londoners so many would have been aware of them, in contrast
unless it is the Flying Scotsman most Steam tours pass unnoticed nowdays as
they are no longer that rare compared with the situation a couple of
decades ago when a local newspaper would consider a steam train passing
worth a mention.
Ironically a good example of that occurred at Ealing Broadway on Saturday
Morning, as people assembled for the 1st departure of the District line
tour a class 33 passed through on the main line with some MK1s and a Steam
Loco on the back presumably ECS heading somewhere for a tour.
It was hardly noticed,


Yes, steam charters are now quite routine at Paddington, Kings Cross and
Victoria. Most summer Saturdays probably seem them passing Ealing Broadway.
They're probably now more common there than HSTs. The same will be true
next year at Kings Cross. Indeed, Gresley Pacifics will probably be seen
more often than Deltics, HSTs or Class 91s at Kings Cross from next summer!

Away from London, Carlisle, Exeter, Fort William, Lincoln, Scarborough and
York also see plenty of steam.

Despite the new signalling, it would be nice if LU somehow manages to run a
steam train from Paddington to Farringdon (and on to Moorgate) on some
future anniversary of 1863.



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Old June 25th 19, 06:55 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 21:34:32 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:

as people assembled for the 1st departure of the District line
tour a class 33 passed through on the main line with some MK1s and a Steam
Loco on the back presumably ECS heading somewhere for a tour.


http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/trai...06/22/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/trai...06/22/advanced

most Steam tours pass unnoticed nowdays as they are no longer that rare
compared with the situation a couple of decades ago when a local
newspaper would consider a steam train passing worth a mention.


https://www.eastbourneherald.co.uk/n...train-to-come-
through-sussex-this-weekend-full-list-of-times-for-each-station-
1-8971673
--
Roland Perry
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Old June 25th 19, 11:26 AM posted to uk.transport.london
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Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 21:34:32 on Mon, 24
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:

as people assembled for the 1st departure of the District line
tour a class 33 passed through on the main line with some MK1s and a Steam
Loco on the back presumably ECS heading somewhere for a tour.


http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/trai...06/22/advanced
http://www.realtimetrains.co.uk/trai...06/22/advanced

Thanks, I had not got around to checking where it was heading apart from a
cursory glance at the steam tours site which as mentioned elsewhere isn’t
fully active at the moment.

most Steam tours pass unnoticed nowdays as they are no longer that rare
compared with the situation a couple of decades ago when a local
newspaper would consider a steam train passing worth a mention.


https://www.eastbourneherald.co.uk/n...train-to-come-
through-sussex-this-weekend-full-list-of-times-for-each-station-
1-8971673



I did say most not none, that report is unusually detailed compared to
many.

At locations like Salisbury they come through so regularly that nobody
bats an eyelid, you do sometimes get a few photographers hanging around as
it is often a water stop .
In contrast when steam was rare hundreds would turn out, I recall it was
Clan line back in Spring 1974
that was one of the first around here to break the the so called steam ban.
So many people turned out that the SR got the jitters about allowing any to
enter 3rd rail territory for many a year,eventually that got eased
initially by timing them to run late so the lack of light put off
photographers.
One was the infamous quadruple header from Eastleigh to Clapham after an
event at Eastleigh,initially it was going to be a steam double header but
the powers that be decided the two class 50’s in attendance should be
attached as well. At least one person because I watched him do it ripped
up his ticket in disgust.
Others like myself travelled as planned and were treated to a very lively
trip up the line.

Soon after a trip was allowed to Bournemouth and 1000’s turned out at that
town as the return of steam had been well publicised, that just doesn’t
happen any more unless it’s the Scotsman.
It happened for a while with Tornado but that new loco is now old news.


GH

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Old June 25th 19, 12:40 PM posted to uk.transport.london
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In message , at 11:26:03 on Tue, 25
Jun 2019, Marland remarked:

most Steam tours pass unnoticed nowdays as they are no longer that rare
compared with the situation a couple of decades ago when a local
newspaper would consider a steam train passing worth a mention.


https://www.eastbourneherald.co.uk/n...train-to-come-
through-sussex-this-weekend-full-list-of-times-for-each-station-
1-8971673


I did say most not none, that report is unusually detailed compared to
many.


It's typical of the reports I've seen in East Anglia, where if anything
we get fewer steam tours at the moment than say 5-10yrs ago.

But Tornado/FlyingScotsman have been sufficiently prolific recently that
perhaps some of the novelty has worn off.

I did go to Shippea Hill to view Tornado, but it wasn't that
spectacular. A bit like Metro#1, virtually no smoke or steam, and
could just as well have been electric.

Here's the local paper announcing a FS trip

https://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/new...ying-scotsman-
trains-cambridge-ely-13877335

--
Roland Perry


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