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I doNt know if anyone caught the Tv show on Itv1 London @ 1930 last
night, about buses in London.
They came up with a figure like £56million is being lost thanks to fare
dodgers on Bendi-buses. Well why not keep conductors on these services,
surely the cost of employing them would be well less than £56million,
and they could also do other tasks, like keeping the bus clean & tidy &
preventing vandalism/Helping people with luggage.
--
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For railway information, news and photos see http://www.railwaysonline.co.uk

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"Joe" wrote in message
...
I doNt know if anyone caught the Tv show on Itv1 London @ 1930 last
night, about buses in London.
They came up with a figure like £56million is being lost thanks to fare
dodgers on Bendi-buses. Well why not keep conductors on these services,
surely the cost of employing them would be well less than £56million,

Add a lot more when the 207/427 gets bent in a couple of weeks time. From
observation, a lot of people still pay cash on the route(s). Will they
still bother in a few weeks? Will they?

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Ian Harper wrote to uk.transport.london on Wed, 30 Mar 2005:

Add a lot more when the 207/427 gets bent in a couple of weeks time. From
observation, a lot of people still pay cash on the route(s). Will they
still bother in a few weeks? Will they?


They can't - it's not allowed on bendies!

If people have a reasonable chance of not getting caught, they won't
pay. I first saw this in Paris in the 1970s when the "tricoteuses" who
used to punch your ticket when you went into the system were phased out,
and the magnetic card readers hadn't been brought in. The interim
system punched your ticket and then let you in through the turnstile,
but there was nothing to show whether your ticket had been punched once
or 100 times. Many people appeared to think it worth the risk of a fine
if you were caught by an inspector.....

When I was in Poland, we were warned that if you were caught on the
buses without a valid ticket, you would be given an on-the-spot fine;
actually, although I was there for a week and used the buses every day,
I never saw an inspector. Unlike in Vienna, where we were for 24 hours
some years ago, and our tickets were checked at least once in that time,
if not twice.

If London Buses want bendies to be a success, they really do need to
employ a team of inspectors to go round on the bendy buses and check
people's tickets. Not every journey, but so that you can reliably
expect to be checked at least once per day.
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 20 March 2005

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On Thu, 31 Mar 2005 16:55:51 +0100, Mrs Redboots
wrote:

Ian Harper wrote to uk.transport.london on Wed, 30 Mar 2005:

Add a lot more when the 207/427 gets bent in a couple of weeks time. From
observation, a lot of people still pay cash on the route(s). Will they
still bother in a few weeks? Will they?


They can't - it's not allowed on bendies!

If people have a reasonable chance of not getting caught, they won't
pay. I first saw this in Paris in the 1970s when the "tricoteuses" who
used to punch your ticket when you went into the system were phased out,
and the magnetic card readers hadn't been brought in. The interim
system punched your ticket and then let you in through the turnstile,
but there was nothing to show whether your ticket had been punched once
or 100 times. Many people appeared to think it worth the risk of a fine
if you were caught by an inspector.....

When I was in Poland, we were warned that if you were caught on the
buses without a valid ticket, you would be given an on-the-spot fine;
actually, although I was there for a week and used the buses every day,
I never saw an inspector. Unlike in Vienna, where we were for 24 hours
some years ago, and our tickets were checked at least once in that time,
if not twice.

If London Buses want bendies to be a success, they really do need to
employ a team of inspectors to go round on the bendy buses and check
people's tickets. Not every journey, but so that you can reliably
expect to be checked at least once per day.

Saw an interesting sight WRT bendies the other day. In the Euston Road
they were being held at a stop by a team of Inspectors backed up by
Police who were all busy hooking off the non-payers and generating
satisfactory (to them - not the non-payers) wedges of notes,
presumably to keep various magistrates in employment.

Keith J Chesworth
www.unseenlondon.co.uk
www.blackpooltram.co.uk
www.happysnapper.com
www.boilerbill.com - main site
www.amerseyferry.co.uk

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On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:33:32 +0100, Joe wrote:

I doNt know if anyone caught the Tv show on Itv1 London @ 1930 last
night, about buses in London.
They came up with a figure like £56million is being lost thanks to fare
dodgers on Bendi-buses. Well why not keep conductors on these services,
surely the cost of employing them would be well less than £56million,
and they could also do other tasks, like keeping the bus clean & tidy &
preventing vandalism/Helping people with luggage.

The figure was £56m for the *whole* bus network and was based on a
ludicrously simplistic piece of extrapolation. There are endless
examples of conductor operated buses where it is a miracle if the
conductor moves upstairs and actually checks tickets.

There are many issues about the relative merits of bendy buses, one
person buses and Routemasters and I have yet to see a television
programme that has got within 10 miles of discussing such issues in a
cogent manner.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

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Paul Corfield wrote:
On Wed, 30 Mar 2005 17:33:32 +0100, Joe wrote:


I doNt know if anyone caught the Tv show on Itv1 London @ 1930 last
night, about buses in London.
They came up with a figure like £56million is being lost thanks to fare
dodgers on Bendi-buses. Well why not keep conductors on these services,
surely the cost of employing them would be well less than £56million,
and they could also do other tasks, like keeping the bus clean & tidy &
preventing vandalism/Helping people with luggage.


The figure was £56m for the *whole* bus network and was based on a
ludicrously simplistic piece of extrapolation. There are endless
examples of conductor operated buses where it is a miracle if the
conductor moves upstairs and actually checks tickets.

There are many issues about the relative merits of bendy buses, one
person buses and Routemasters and I have yet to see a television
programme that has got within 10 miles of discussing such issues in a
cogent manner.

And of course on a Routemaster, if the conductor doesn't check your
ticket and you use prepay, then you travel for free.

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

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In message , Paul Corfield
writes
There are endless examples of conductor operated buses where it is a
miracle if the conductor moves upstairs and actually checks tickets.
I commented to this effect a few weeks ago.

Interestingly, though, in some pretty intensive riding on the 19
yesterday, tickets were checked diligently on every journey.

SHMBO and I moved seats at one point (top be near the front, well you
have to do it, don't you?!) and the conductress arrived shortly and
tried to charge us again. (SHMBO had a One Day Travelcard and I had
Oyster Pre Pay; If she'd insisted on scanning my Oyster again, would
the system have "thrown up that I'd "paid" already?)

--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

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Ian Jelf wrote:
In message , Paul
Corfield writes
There are endless examples of conductor operated buses where it is
a miracle if the conductor moves upstairs and actually checks
tickets.
I commented to this effect a few weeks ago.

Interestingly, though, in some pretty intensive riding on the 19
yesterday, tickets were checked diligently on every journey.

SHMBO and I moved seats at one point

Do you mean SWMBO?
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

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In message , Richard J.
writes
Ian Jelf wrote:
In message , Paul
Corfield writes
There are endless examples of conductor operated buses where it is
a miracle if the conductor moves upstairs and actually checks
tickets.
I commented to this effect a few weeks ago.

Interestingly, though, in some pretty intensive riding on the 19
yesterday, tickets were checked diligently on every journey.

SHMBO and I moved seats at one point

Do you mean SWMBO?

Oh dear. Yes! (It's late.)

Maybe I ought to just write "Louise" and not try to be too clever, eh?
(She'll be Mrs. Jelf in a few weeks, though, which will perhaps simplify
matters!)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

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In article ,
Ian Jelf wrote:
Do you mean SWMBO?

Oh dear. Yes! (It's late.)

I tend to refer to her as She-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named (I don't think she
knows yet, but I suspect she will shortly).

--
Mike Bristow - really a very good driver

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In message , Mike Bristow
writes
In article ,
Ian Jelf wrote:
Do you mean SWMBO?

Oh dear. Yes! (It's late.)

I tend to refer to her as She-Who-Must-Not-Be-Named (I don't think she
knows yet, but I suspect she will shortly).

Yes, Louise doesn't want to be named either.

Oh bugger..... ;-)
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk