I haven't seen this mentioned yet on this group but I'm sure some will
have picked up on thus news from posters and leaflets now floating
around the Tube network.

From the 25 September adult 7 Day Travelcards (7DTC) will only be
available on Oyster, and not on a paper - and as a logical extension
of this (since 15 August) the £3 Oyster card deposit has been waived
*if* a passenger is buying a 7 Day Travelcard.

I think (though it's not made clear in the publicity) that this will
also apply to TfL Ticket Stops (newsagents to you and me) as well as
Underground ticket offices.

This will mean that you won't be able to buy paper adult season tickets
from any TfL outlet. If you're buying from a National Rail station then
you'll get a paper ticket (though a few NR stations do have Oyster
issuing capabilities so I guess you'll have a choice if you buy from
them [1]).

7 Day Bus Passes will still be available as a paper ticket, and if you
want to get one on Oyster then you'll still have to pay the £3
deposit. The deposit will also remain payable if you just want to get
an Oyster card for use with Pre Pay.

This move represents TfL's next big push for the Oyster card system,
and is backed up by a witty and well executed poster campaign across
the Tube and elsewhere (I've seen at least one advertising billboard
poster at an overground station), with the strapline "Faster Smarter
Easier Oyster", and with taglines such as "Blue is the new Pink", "The
correct change", and - to push Oyster's online purchasing facility -
"Why stand in line when you can buy online"

So keep hold of any old TfL season tickets you may have as they're
about to become history, the first casualty of the electronic ticketing
revolution.

For the TfL press release on this changeover go to:
http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/press-cent...t.asp?prID=479


[1] Non-exhaustive list of National Rail stations that issue Oyster
http://snipurl.com/oyster_at_NRstations

Mizter T wrote:

This move represents TfL's next big push for the Oyster card system,
and is backed up by a witty and well executed poster campaign across
the Tube and elsewhere (I've seen at least one advertising billboard
poster at an overground station), with the strapline "Faster Smarter
Easier Oyster", and with taglines such as "Blue is the new Pink", "The
correct change", and - to push Oyster's online purchasing facility -
"Why stand in line when you can buy online"


These posters have appeared at such far flung locations such as Three
Bridges and Portsmouth Harbour. Is there much point in advertising
Oyster this far away from the capital?

Richard Adamfi wrote:
Mizter T wrote:

This move represents TfL's next big push for the Oyster card system,
and is backed up by a witty and well executed poster campaign across
the Tube and elsewhere (I've seen at least one advertising billboard
poster at an overground station), with the strapline "Faster Smarter
Easier Oyster", and with taglines such as "Blue is the new Pink", "The
correct change", and - to push Oyster's online purchasing facility -
"Why stand in line when you can buy online"


These posters have appeared at such far flung locations such as Three
Bridges and Portsmouth Harbour. Is there much point in advertising
Oyster this far away from the capital?

No, there isn't much point! You can't get a Travelcard season (inc.
rail travel to & from London) from a station outside the zones on
Oyster, it would come as a printed ticket. Unless some people are that
deperate to have an Oyster card and thus have two season tickets - a
printed rail season ticket plus a Travelcard on Oyster - and I'm not an
expert but I think if you did that it'd cost more, it certainly
wouldn't be any cheaper.

The only market I guess they might be advertising to are the occasional
passengers who might be travelling to London (on a rail only ticket)
then doing one or two journeys on the tube, though I'm sure in most
cases they'd be better off getting a Day Travelcard from their starting
station.

I suspect that it's a bit of slapdash planning on either TfL or the
billboard companies part with regards to which billboard sites were to
be used.

In message .com, at
06:39:51 on Wed, 24 Aug 2005, Mizter T remarked:
I suspect that it's a bit of slapdash planning on either TfL or the
billboard companies part with regards to which billboard sites were to
be used.

I was on the tube yesterday, and saw several of the posters. I have to
say that it didn't make any sense to me, and I was oblivious to their
message until I saw this thread.

Not helped by being next to a drinks company that is running a different
"Pink" campaign at the moment - 'Anyone can be pink and cold', or
something like that.
--
Roland Perry

These posters have appeared at such far flung locations such as Three
Bridges and Portsmouth Harbour. Is there much point in advertising
Oyster this far away from the capital?

They're advertising at Wagn stations, including Hatfield, and of
course, you can't get an Oyster issued or accepted there!

At the same time that the posters appeared, Wagn has put a notice up on
their website;

----
"Please note that Oyster "Pre Pay" can only be used to pay for
journeys on Wagn services between Finsbury Park and Kings
Cross/Moorgate.
click link to get to...

Transport for London's Oyster Card can be used in two ways:

As a Travelcard Season Ticket valid for one or more Travelcard Zones.
This can be used for travel between any mainline station within the
Zones and Dates for which the Oyster Travelcard is valid.

Please note that the Travelcard Area comprises 6 Zones and the Boundary
of Zone 6 for Wagn is Hadley Wood and Crews Hill.

As pre-payment for any journey on London Underground, London Buses and
DLR, and for a limited number of main line rail journeys. Journeys on
Wagn that can be made using "pre-pay" are those between Finsbury
Park and Kings Cross/Moorgate and between intermediate stations on
these routes.

"Pre-pay" cannot be used to pay for journeys north of Finsbury Park
on Wagn services. Tickets for journeys on Wagn services to stations
north of Finsbury Park must be purchased before leaving Finsbury Park."
----

Now, as it happens this means two things;

1) It means there's a good chance people have been asking Wagn about
Oyster, and it may eventually mean they decide it's a good idea to
start accepting/issuing them.

2) It also tells people that a Zone 1-6 Oyster will work to Hadley Wood
or Crews Hill, so it's possible (and significantly cheaper) to get an
Oyster for that part of the journey, and a standard season for the
boundary to your chosen station, than buy a Wagn season for the whole
thing. End result; same Gold Card discounts on other travel and a much
cheaper ticket. The only loss; 8 complimentary first class tickets and
a 20% discount at mainline stations (which is irrelevant, as showing
ANY Gold Card still gets you 20% off!).

Jonathan

On 25 Aug 2005 16:36:33 -0700, wrote:

2) It also tells people that a Zone 1-6 Oyster will work to Hadley Wood
or Crews Hill, so it's possible (and significantly cheaper) to get an
Oyster for that part of the journey, and a standard season for the
boundary to your chosen station,

Cheaper? How did you work that one out?

If it's not significantly more expensive I'll eat my hat.

asdf wrote:
On 25 Aug 2005 16:36:33 -0700, wrote:

2) It also tells people that a Zone 1-6 Oyster will work to Hadley Wood
or Crews Hill, so it's possible (and significantly cheaper) to get an
Oyster for that part of the journey, and a standard season for the
boundary to your chosen station,

Cheaper? How did you work that one out?

If it's not significantly more expensive I'll eat my hat.

You has better get chomping you old goat!

Monthly season prices

Stevenage - Hadley Wood £142.50
Travelcard - All Zones £151.70
Total £294.20

Stevenage - R1256 £311.10

A saving of £16.90

All the above info has been taken from the WAGN ticket sales website
(you need to register first but that only takes a mo), and does not
take account of any further discounts required under the Passengers
Charter (which can be up to 10%) as these are only available to those
renewing their tickets. The All Zones Travelcard price is thus
obviously the same as if you were to buy it on an Oyster card at a TfL
outlet. With a Passengers Charter discount it would thus be even
cheaper to buy the two seperate tickets from WAGN, rather than have the
All Zones Travelcard on Oyster as Jonathan suggested.

I must say I also found it surprising that the price would work out
cheaper than if it was purchased as a single ticket. It would appear to
be counter-intuitive.

*However* I am unclear as to whether it would be valid to use two
seperate season tickets on a train that did not stop at Hadley Wood -
and I'm not sure any Stevenage London trains do actually stop there (a
quick look at a timetable suggests not). Rather than cause mass
confusion I've thus posted a query asking the ticketing experts over at
uk.railway to clear up any confusion (the thread is entitled "Allowed
to combine season tickets?"). Once I get a definitive answer on that
issue then we'll know whether Jonathan's two ticket hypothesis is
correct or not. And whether asdf needs to start masticating on a bowler
or not.

On 25 Aug 2005 18:51:54 -0700, "Mizter T" wrote:

You has better get chomping you old goat!

You're absolutely right. Can't argue with those figures.

[fx: sound of munching on headgear]

*However* I am unclear as to whether it would be valid to use two
seperate season tickets on a train that did not stop at Hadley Wood -
and I'm not sure any Stevenage London trains do actually stop there (a
quick look at a timetable suggests not).

Ah, now this is the sting in the tail. The rule you are looking for is
number 17 at http://www.nationalrail.co.uk/conditions.htm .

Unfortunately I'm not sure whether Travelcards count as "season
tickets or travel passes issued on behalf of a passenger transport
executive or local authority" which would seem to be the deciding
issue...

Incidentally, there is a similar saving to be made by buying separate
Welwyn GC - Hadley Wood and Z1-6 Travelcard seasons, and there *are*
trains from WGC that stop at Hadley Wood, so from there at least, a
saving could be made without having to change trains (though obviously
having to travel on a stopper would still increase your journey time).

I would like to have this clarified 100% as I've heard different
stories, namely that you can combine two seasons and now the messages
that say you can't. If you can't, the next best option is to get a
Travelcard up to Finsbury Park and a NR season from there - because
almost all trains stop there.

When I looked at the Z1-6 and Hadley Wood to Hatfield option, with an
annual ticket, the savings were significant - nearly £300 (a search on
uk.railway will give the exact figure, as I've lost my paperwork).
However, if I'd have to get a slow train that stops at Hadley Wood then
it's not quite so appealing.

Finally, even if it DIDN'T work out that much cheaper, the extra
convenience of having an Oyster is obvious. In fact, it might even be
worth paying a little more for (in my opinion).

Jonathan

I've thus posted a query asking the ticketing experts over at
uk.railway to clear up any confusion (the thread is entitled "Allowed
to combine season tickets?"). Once I get a definitive answer on that
issue then we'll know whether Jonathan's two ticket hypothesis is
correct or not. And whether asdf needs to start masticating on a bowler
or not.

I rather suspect you will find that you will get three answers:

1) A TfL period travelcard *is* a season ticket for the purposes of that
rule.
2) A TfL period travelcard is *not* a season ticket for ditto.
3) Despite the question coming up repeatedly in the past, there is still no
definitive answer.

Reading the thread in uk.railway, one person asserts that 1) is the case and
this has been established many times before on the group. However you will
also find if you look in the archives that one person queried WAGN directly
and was categorically told that 2) was the case and I've also seen this
asserted several times before.

It certainly seems to me that the distinction was meant to be made between
season tickets issued by the franchised rail operators and those issued by
other operators and I would have thought TfL was meant to be bundled in with
the latter. However the distinction was made poorly and hasn't been
clarified.

G.