Fares changes for 2007
 

I'm sure this was splashed and hyped all over the Standard/free whatever
as usual, but the devil (or not) is in the detail...

http://www.london.gov.uk/view_press_...releaseid=9169

The key points:

Almost all Oyster fares remain the same except:
-- off-peak bus journeys (from £0.80 to £1.00)
-- daily caps (still £0.50 below paper travelcards, but travelcards are
up by an average of RPI+2%)

Cash fares go up significantly:
-- via Zone 1 singles from £3 to £4 (!)
-- bus singles from £1.50 to £2
-- but paper daily bus passes are frozen, as are non-Z1 travelcards

Season tickets go up by 50p to £14 for weekly bus passes, and around RPI
+ 2% for Travelcards (as mentioned above).

New:
- Under-16s get a 50p Tube single or £1 daily cap on Oyster
- £4 penalty charge to be introduced on Oyster PAYG for those who do not
touch in and out (from November this year)
- TOCs will introduce zonal fares in January 2007, thus paving the way
for an easy PAYG rollout

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

Fares changes for 2007
 

WoW...Those are quite some increases....Particularly the 33% Bus Cash
Fare.....
Its all well and good to talk of it as an incentive to promote Off Bus
Ticketing BUT when the Travelcard increases by RPI PLUS 2% one starts to
think....Hmmmmmm who will be gaining most from this....and the Travelling
Public aint among them.

Perhaps its to underline Peter Hendy`s dire warnings to other UK Cities
interested in emulating Londons supposed success at driving Public Transport
Usage upwards...Mr H DID say "If U aint prepared to Fund it,then don`t do
it" (or words to that effect).

Oh well...the Retail Motor Industry obviously has better lobbyists.... : )

Fares changes for 2007
 

Dave Arquati wrote:

-- via Zone 1 singles from £3 to £4 (!)
-- bus singles from £1.50 to £2

Now that really is taking the ****. Why don't they just abolish cash
fares if that's what they want to do? It's nothing but an underhand
and dishonest tourist tax.

(Yes, I do have an Oyster card. And a Strippenkaart (that I'm using a
bit more often of late :) ), and (somewhere) a Singapore EZ-Link; I
won't be paying these rip-off fares. Regardless of this, it doesn't
stop me believing that they are inappropriate, and that Ken/TfL need a
kick over them).

- Under-16s get a 50p Tube single or £1 daily cap on Oyster

I'm not convinced by this, nor by the free bus fares. Why shouldn't
teenagers pay (or have paid) their own way? In most of mainland Europe
they'd be paying full adult fare by age 12.

- £4 penalty charge to be introduced on Oyster PAYG for those who do not
touch in and out (from November this year)
- TOCs will introduce zonal fares in January 2007, thus paving the way
for an easy PAYG rollout

Both not surprising, and probably necessary[1], though for the former
they will *have* to get their machine network and staff up to scratch
and have a way to "back out" of an Oyster transaction more easily, e.g.
if you go through the barriers then find there's no service. The
latter happened to me at Richmond, where there was no LUL due to
lightning damage so SWT were (so said the staff) passing pax including
Oyster Pre-Pay.

[1] Maybe a better option would be to charge the maximum fare that
could have been incurred by passing through the barriers at which you
touched in; that would be fairer, IMO, and it's what Singapore does.

Neil

Fares changes for 2007
 

Dave Arquati wrote:
Almost all Oyster fares remain the same except:
-- off-peak bus journeys (from £0.80 to £1.00)

OK, so that's an extra £1 a week for me then. I can't help wondering,
what's the reasoning behind abolishing off-peak fares on the busses?
--
Rob

Fares changes for 2007
 

Neil Williams wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote:

-- via Zone 1 singles from £3 to £4 (!)
-- bus singles from £1.50 to £2

Now that really is taking the ****. Why don't they just abolish cash
fares if that's what they want to do? It's nothing but an underhand
and dishonest tourist tax.

(Yes, I do have an Oyster card. And a Strippenkaart (that I'm using a
bit more often of late :) ), and (somewhere) a Singapore EZ-Link; I
won't be paying these rip-off fares. Regardless of this, it doesn't
stop me believing that they are inappropriate, and that Ken/TfL need a
kick over them).

- Under-16s get a 50p Tube single or £1 daily cap on Oyster

I'm not convinced by this, nor by the free bus fares. Why shouldn't
teenagers pay (or have paid) their own way? In most of mainland Europe
they'd be paying full adult fare by age 12.

- £4 penalty charge to be introduced on Oyster PAYG for those who do not
touch in and out (from November this year)
- TOCs will introduce zonal fares in January 2007, thus paving the way
for an easy PAYG rollout

Both not surprising, and probably necessary[1], though for the former
they will *have* to get their machine network and staff up to scratch
and have a way to "back out" of an Oyster transaction more easily, e.g.
if you go through the barriers then find there's no service. The
latter happened to me at Richmond, where there was no LUL due to
lightning damage so SWT were (so said the staff) passing pax including
Oyster Pre-Pay.

[1] Maybe a better option would be to charge the maximum fare that
could have been incurred by passing through the barriers at which you
touched in; that would be fairer, IMO, and it's what Singapore does.

Neil

I am absolutely staggered by this increase. Last year it double from
£1.40 to £3, now it is going to £4. A 167% increase in a little over
a year. A little over 10 years ago it was £1, so 400% in just over 10
years.
Yes, great if you have Oyster. Why don't they just put signs up at
Heathrow and on the boundary of London saying **** off if you are a low
life visitor we don't want you in London.

Kevin

Fares changes for 2007
 

Kev wrote:

Yes, great if you have Oyster. Why don't they just put signs up at
Heathrow and on the boundary of London saying **** off if you are a low
life visitor we don't want you in London.

Quite.

If Ken wants to implement a tourist tax, that's what he should do.
Such a thing would be added to hotel bills and fully transparent, just
like it is here in the Hague where I'm staying at the moment (it's
about EUR 2 a night).

If, OTOH, he wants to encourage Oyster use, he could do so in other,
better ways. Here's a suggestion.

1. Develop and deploy an Oyster vending machine, that could sell
unregistered Oyster cards for gbp5 with 2 quid credit (for a couple of
singles) or gbp10 with 7 quid credit. These should also accept cards
back to return the deposit, but in the interim a standard vending
machine to issue would be a start. These should be everywhere, all
over London; in hotels, in railway stations, in buses (maybe), in tube
stations etc. The same packs should be available for sale in every
shop. Make it easy, and make it obvious. The same thing is done with
the Dutch Strippenkaart. Make it that easy, and people won't *want* to
pay on the bus/train.

2. If (1) is a success, remove paper ticketing completely. There would
be no need for it.

The proposals, as they are, are confused, will cause confusion and are
a blatent rip-off and tourist tax.

Neil

Fares changes for 2007
 

Kev wrote:
I am absolutely staggered by this increase. Last year it double from
£1.40 to £3, now it is going to £4. A 167% increase in a little over
a year. A little over 10 years ago it was £1, so 400% in just over 10
years.
Yes, great if you have Oyster. Why don't they just put signs up at
Heathrow and on the boundary of London saying **** off if you are a low
life visitor we don't want you in London.

Kevin

Well you should simply get an Oyster, even as a tourist. They're three
pounds apparently, but when I arrived in London with some friends we
all asked for weekly 1-2's and all got Oyster automatically, without
paying the extra charge.

Fares changes for 2007
 

Rob Hamadi wrote:

OK, so that's an extra £1 a week for me then. I can't help wondering,
what's the reasoning behind abolishing off-peak fares on the busses?

I thought a peak fare was higher on Oyster (1.50?)

Neil

Fares changes for 2007
 

sweek wrote:

Well you should simply get an Oyster, even as a tourist.

It's all very well to say that, but walking into a Tube station or
joining a bus it is *not* obvious. It is therefore a dishonest tourist
tax.

Why can't I buy a pre-credited Oyster from a machine, for example?
Ticket office queues are usually long, and most people won't find it
natural to buy a single ticket from a ticket office anyway - most
European metros don't even *have* ticket offices.

Neil

Fares changes for 2007
 

Neil Williams wrote:
Rob Hamadi wrote:

OK, so that's an extra £1 a week for me then. I can't help wondering,
what's the reasoning behind abolishing off-peak fares on the busses?

I thought a peak fare was higher on Oyster (1.50?)

Nope. ATM it's £1 peak, 80p off peak. So my travel to work comes to
£1.80 a day, cheaper than a period travelcard. This'll presumably take
it to £2.00, assuming no change in the peak fare. Probably still
cheaper than a travelcard.
--
Rob