Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.

wrote in message
ups.com...

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.


I think the OP might be driving at the fact that North East London (and West
Essex) has other lines that go to Stratford and Liverpool Street, just like
the Central Line, but they do it in less time.

If I was living in that part of the country, I doubt that the Central would
be my standard commuting option, and even if my final destination was a
central station west of Liverpool Street, I'd probably only change onto it
there.

I'd probably need to live right next door to somewhere like Roding Valley
for it to be worth using - and maybe that's why it's the lightest-used
station, because only those in the immediate vicinity find it worthwhile.

As a route into London, it's not *that* useful. If the stations in the area
were better connected to a bigger variety of destinations (e.g.
Chelsea-Hackney line taking the southern part of the loop, and Victoria line
Whipps Cross-Woodford extenstion taking the northern part) then traffic
would likely increase.

BTN

Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

I suspect this refers only to the loop of the Central Line via Chigwell. It
goes through some moderately populated areas but I suspect multiple car
ownership around Chigwell is high. The low use of the tube is probably
caused by years of low service frequency, having to change trains to reach
central London and early close-downs putting people off. It will take some
time to change attitudes to public transport.

The District Line is incredibly busy until East Ham and remains reasonably
busy until Dagenham/Elm Park.

Sir Benjamin Nunn wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.


I think the OP might be driving at the fact that North East London (and West
Essex) has other lines that go to Stratford and Liverpool Street, just like
the Central Line, but they do it in less time.

If I was living in that part of the country, I doubt that the Central would
be my standard commuting option, and even if my final destination was a
central station west of Liverpool Street, I'd probably only change onto it
there.

I'd probably need to live right next door to somewhere like Roding Valley
for it to be worth using - and maybe that's why it's the lightest-used
station, because only those in the immediate vicinity find it worthwhile.

As a route into London, it's not *that* useful. If the stations in the area
were better connected to a bigger variety of destinations (e.g.
Chelsea-Hackney line taking the southern part of the loop, and Victoria line
Whipps Cross-Woodford extenstion taking the northern part) then traffic
would likely increase.



You may have been fooled by the shape of the Underground map into
thinking that the Central Line goes very far east. It is basically a
bit east of north (about as east as the Edgware branch is west), but
the map has to fill in that top right corner. It goes in a different
direction from trains into Liverpool Street until it joins up at
Stratford. Are you suggesting driving from Woodford to Ilford or
something?

The line from Chingford to Liverpool Street is nearer, but it's not
very fast and by the time you'd driven or bussed to, say, Wood Street,
you'd probably have reached Liverpool Street on the Central Line.

If you get on at South Woodford in the morning rush, it is already
standing room only.

Sir Benjamin Nunn wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.


I think the OP might be driving at the fact that North East London (and West
Essex) has other lines that go to Stratford and Liverpool Street, just like
the Central Line, but they do it in less time.

If I was living in that part of the country, I doubt that the Central would
be my standard commuting option, and even if my final destination was a
central station west of Liverpool Street, I'd probably only change onto it
there.

I'd probably need to live right next door to somewhere like Roding Valley
for it to be worth using - and maybe that's why it's the lightest-used
station, because only those in the immediate vicinity find it worthwhile.

As a route into London, it's not *that* useful. If the stations in the area
were better connected to a bigger variety of destinations (e.g.
Chelsea-Hackney line taking the southern part of the loop, and Victoria line
Whipps Cross-Woodford extenstion taking the northern part) then traffic
would likely increase.

Roding Valley is a special case - it's on a badly served branchline, so
of course demand will be low. But usage on the Epping and Hainult via
NP branches is fairly strong. Which alternative routes to Liverpool
Street did you have in mind? The Chingford line is a fair way west of
the Central.

What's more, on the Shenfield line, most commuters going west of
Liverpool Street change at Stratford to cross over the platform to the
tube because it's easier than trapsing all the way across the concourse
at the end of the line.

Jonn

Sir Benjamin Nunn wrote:
wrote in message
ups.com...

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.


I think the OP might be driving at the fact that North East London (and West
Essex) has other lines that go to Stratford and Liverpool Street, just like
the Central Line, but they do it in less time.

If I was living in that part of the country, I doubt that the Central would
be my standard commuting option, and even if my final destination was a
central station west of Liverpool Street, I'd probably only change onto it
there.

I'd probably need to live right next door to somewhere like Roding Valley
for it to be worth using - and maybe that's why it's the lightest-used
station, because only those in the immediate vicinity find it worthwhile.

As a route into London, it's not *that* useful. If the stations in the area
were better connected to a bigger variety of destinations (e.g.
Chelsea-Hackney line taking the southern part of the loop, and Victoria line
Whipps Cross-Woodford extenstion taking the northern part) then traffic
would likely increase.

Roding Valley is a special case - it's on a badly served branchline, so
of course demand will be low. But usage on the Epping and Hainult via
NP branches is fairly strong. Which alternative routes to Liverpool
Street did you have in mind? The Chingford line is a fair way west of
the Central.

What's more, on the Shenfield line, most commuters going west of
Liverpool Street change at Stratford to cross over the platform to the
tube because it's easier than trapsing all the way across the concourse
at the end of the line.

Jonn

On Tue, 16 Jan 2007 14:39:15 -0000, "Sir Benjamin Nunn"
wrote:


wrote in message
oups.com...

wrote:
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW,
SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

Both central and district lines are still reasonably well used until at
least zone 4. And south east London is barely served at all. So I'm not
exactly clear on what you could mean.


I think the OP might be driving at the fact that North East London (and West
Essex) has other lines that go to Stratford and Liverpool Street, just like
the Central Line, but they do it in less time.

Well yes they do it in less time if you have a semi fast option. I
understand a lot of people railhead at Epping from the surrounding area
(including Harlow) so the direct but slower and cheaper option must have
some attraction to Essex residents.

If I was living in that part of the country, I doubt that the Central would
be my standard commuting option, and even if my final destination was a
central station west of Liverpool Street, I'd probably only change onto it
there.

As already mentioned an awful lot of people change at Stratford onto the
Central and the volumes changing off "One" services at Walthamstow,
Tottenham Hale and Seven Sisters are not small either. The onward direct
link via the Victoria Line has its attractions relative to a
theoretically faster trip to Liverpool St and then a change to bus or
tube.

If I worked in the City close to Liverpool St then I would certainly use
the Overground from Walthamstow. However almost every other journey I
make involves a bus and then the tube network. The interchange at
Liverpool St between main line and LU is utterly awful at busy times and
not that great off peak.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

"tkd" wrote in message
...
Why does the north east corner suffer from a lack of customers yet the
NW, SW and SE do fine for numbers? Any ideas? Could it mean the lack of
passenger numbers further closes in the North East corner?

I suspect this refers only to the loop of the Central Line via Chigwell.
It goes through some moderately populated areas but I suspect multiple car
ownership around Chigwell is high. The low use of the tube is probably
caused by years of low service frequency, having to change trains to reach
central London and early close-downs putting people off. It will take some
time to change attitudes to public transport.

The District Line is incredibly busy until East Ham and remains reasonably
busy until Dagenham/Elm Park.




Interesting comments. Not being able to get a through train past 8pm on a
weekday is not very good for London I would say.

wrote:

Interesting comments. Not being able to get a through train past 8pm
on a weekday is not very good for London I would say.

But with one change you can get to a dozen Central London stations, so the
service at Chigwell is comparable to the service provided at most NR
stations in London (which only have a direct service to one Central London
station).