From my recent First Class journeys in the South East, I have found
that demand for it is practically non-existent on suburban routes
outside of peak hours - this is particularly my experience on the FCC
Bedford-East Croydon service.

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?
Is there a general assumption that First Class is far too expensive?

Andrea wrote:

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?
Is there a general assumption that First Class is far too expensive?

It often is, for what you actually get. The quality varies dramatically
between operators, though. For example, on Southern Electrostars the First
Class consists of nothing more than an antimacasseur on your seat back. The
seats are EXACTLY the same as in standard class, at the same pitch and
spacing and many of the ones in Standard are arranged 2+2, the same as in
First Class. Off-peak you might be lucky enough not to get someone sitting
next to you but, from the number of people that I see on Southern, that
blatantly ignore the FC markings, it isn't worth even considering.

On 15 Mar, 13:19, "Jack Taylor" wrote:
Andrea wrote:

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?
Is there a general assumption that First Class is far too expensive?

It often is, for what you actually get. The quality varies dramatically
between operators, though. For example, on Southern Electrostars the First
Class consists of nothing more than an antimacasseur on your seat back. The
seats are EXACTLY the same as in standard class, at the same pitch and
spacing and many of the ones in Standard are arranged 2+2, the same as in
First Class. Off-peak you might be lucky enough not to get someone sitting
next to you but, from the number of people that I see on Southern, that
blatantly ignore the FC markings, it isn't worth even considering.


Off-peak, South West Trains still seems able to attract a number of
people into first class. I don't remember the seats being comfier in
any significant way, though they do have a 2x2 layout as opposed to a
2x3 so there's more space - but this benefit will be most appreciated
by peak commuters.

"Mizter T" wrote in message
ups.com...
On 15 Mar, 13:19, "Jack Taylor" wrote:

It often is, for what you actually get. The quality varies dramatically
between operators, though. For example, on Southern Electrostars the
First
Class consists of nothing more than an antimacasseur on your seat back.
The
seats are EXACTLY the same as in standard class, at the same pitch and
spacing and many of the ones in Standard are arranged 2+2, the same as in
First Class. Off-peak you might be lucky enough not to get someone
sitting
next to you but, from the number of people that I see on Southern, that
blatantly ignore the FC markings, it isn't worth even considering.


Off-peak, South West Trains still seems able to attract a number of
people into first class. I don't remember the seats being comfier in
any significant way, though they do have a 2x2 layout as opposed to a
2x3 so there's more space - but this benefit will be most appreciated
by peak commuters.


There's still a fair number of trains (444s and 159s) with 2+1 first class
on the longer distance routes, with a sprinkling of passengers during the
interpeaks...

Paul

On 15 Mar, 11:47, "Andrea" wrote:
From my recent First Class journeys in the South East, I have found

that demand for it is practically non-existent on suburban routes
outside of peak hours - this is particularly my experience on the FCC
Bedford-East Croydon service.

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?
Is there a general assumption that First Class is far too expensive?


Because I don't mind sitting with the real people.

"Andrea" wrote:

From my recent First Class journeys in the South East, I have found
that demand for it is practically non-existent on suburban routes
outside of peak hours - this is particularly my experience on the FCC
Bedford-East Croydon service.

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?

Because First Class is rarely enforced in the south east - SWT are an
exception - and is therefore frequently invaded by kids/yobs/druggies,
making it less pleasant than travelling with the great unwashed in steerage.

Chris

On 15 Mar 2007 04:47:54 -0700, "Andrea" wrote:

Is there a general assumption that First Class is far too expensive?

Nationally, probably, though if a First Class Saver existed on all
long-distance routes with the same restrictions as the normal Saver
with the fare at 150% of the Standard Saver, I'd likely buy a few.

I think it's two things. Firstly, first class isn't seen as being
worth it for short journeys. Secondly, and perhaps most importantly,
first class on commuter services isn't a particularly high standard of
accommodation, as the benefit in the peaks is just that you get a
seat. The West Coast Desiros are a good example - you get more
legroom in Standard.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

On Thu, Mar 15, 2007 at 04:47:54AM -0700, Andrea wrote:

From my recent First Class journeys in the South East ...

However, I have found that these operators now have an off-peak 'First
Cheap Day Return'. FCC have this, as does FGW. Why do very few
people take up these offers, which seem to be good value for money?

Partly because no-one knows they exist, partly because the benefits of
travelling first class on Thameslink and elsewhere in the south east (
which doesn't include GWR!) are practically non-existent.

--
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