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Old July 12th 07, 10:12 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On 12 Jul, 21:44, D7666 wrote:
On Jul 12, 12:11 pm, sweek wrote:
Which is what the old Victoria Line stock will be used for.


Where have you got that gen from ?


I'd imagine Always Touch Out, same as the rest of us. I'm not aware of
it appearing in any official documents though.

If the Bakerloo Line is extended to Watford Junction (which is
official policy), it will need extra stock, and the Victoria Line
stock is the logical choice (same design, available the right time).
So there's a fair chance of happenning.

U

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Old July 12th 07, 10:12 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

D7666 wrote:

For the 1988 Docklands concert of Jean Michel Jarre the NLL ran 4 car
trains of both 2x2EPB and 4EPB.

Unable to resist posting that.


I didn't ride the EPBs but I was at the gig! It peed down for most of the
evening and it required a mega-move after the gig, by coach back to Reading,
up to Harrogate for a few hours kip (aquaplaning up the M1) and then across
to York for my god-daughter's christening the following morning. Then back
down south that night.


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Old July 12th 07, 10:19 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On 12 Jul, 21:44, D7666 wrote:
On Jul 12, 12:11 pm, sweek wrote:

Which is what the old Victoria Line stock will be used for.


Where have you got that gen from ?

--
Nick


Can't find that exact information right now, but page 85 here mentions
the Bakerloo re-extension and the "reconfiguration and refushbishment
of existing stock". I've read and heard it in other places, too,
though, but can't seem to find the information right now. It does make
perfect sense to me.

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Old July 12th 07, 10:21 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

Ah, from http://www.alwaystouchout.com/project/43

Initially, TfL may substitute the current trains running the Euston -
Watford service (aged Class 313 and Class 508 trains) with some
(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains. The Victoria line stock is similar to the
Bakerloo line fleet, and the two could be merged fairly easily later
on (see below).

Services would continue to operate as now (6tph Bakerloo and 3tph
Watford DC) but Watford DC trains would be longer (six or seven cars).

Bakerloo Line (re-)extension
TfL eventually plan to re-extend the Bakerloo line from Harrow &
Wealdstone to Watford Junction, replacing the Watford DC services
between Watford Junction and Euston. Bakerloo line services would run
every 10 minutes to Watford, an improvement on the current 20-minute
frequency to Euston. [TfL: T2025 report]

Kilburn High Road and South Hampstead would cease to be served by
direct trains to central London, but would gain services to Camden and
Stratford as part of the proposed Queen\'s Park to Stratford service,
which would run every 15 minutes.

The cost savings from cutting the Silverlink service to Euston would
be used to fund capacity improvements for the North London Line.

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Old July 12th 07, 10:32 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011


"sweek" wrote

Initially, TfL may substitute the current trains running the Euston -
Watford service (aged Class 313 and Class 508 trains) with some
(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains.


i.e. substituting aged (30-year-old) Class 313 and 508 trains with modern
(40-year old) Victoria line stock.

Peter




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Old July 12th 07, 10:33 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011


"sweek" wrote in message
ups.com...
Ah, from http://www.alwaystouchout.com/project/43

Initially, TfL may substitute the current trains running the Euston -
Watford service (aged Class 313 and Class 508 trains) with some
(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains. The Victoria line stock is similar to the
Bakerloo line fleet, and the two could be merged fairly easily later
on (see below).


Yes, but haven't TfL ordered part of the Electrostar fleet for use on the DC
lines out of Euston? There are 24 sets on order for the North London routes,
to replace, IIRC, 26 Class 313/508 sets. With the benefits of higher
availability of new EMUs that looks like a straight replacement - or is
there to be an increase in frequency on the North London part of the
Overground?


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Old July 12th 07, 11:39 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On Jul 12, 3:12 pm, "Jack Taylor" wrote:

I didn't ride the EPBs but I was at the gig!


Ditto.

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Old July 12th 07, 11:44 PM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On Jul 12, 3:21 pm, sweek wrote:
(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains. The Victoria line stock is similar to the
Bakerloo line fleet, and the two could be merged fairly easily later
on (see below).



I'm not sure this is the current plan.

I can't at the moment find out why I think this but I am under the
impression the Bakerloo changes come in with new Bakerloo line trains
(that have yet to be ordered).

I don't think shifting c.45 year old - as they will be by the time
they are released - Victoria line ATO stock to a non ATO line is
really a runner is it ?

--
Nick

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Old July 13th 07, 02:37 AM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 23:33:04 +0100, John Tattersall wrote:

Initially, TfL may substitute the current trains running the Euston -
Watford service (aged Class 313 and Class 508 trains) with some
(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains. The Victoria line stock is similar to the
Bakerloo line fleet, and the two could be merged fairly easily later
on (see below).


Yes, but haven't TfL ordered part of the Electrostar fleet for use on the DC
lines out of Euston?


I think so, but I don't think they've explicitly said so.

There are 24 sets on order for the North London routes,
to replace, IIRC, 26 Class 313/508 sets. With the benefits of higher
availability of new EMUs that looks like a straight replacement - or is
there to be an increase in frequency on the North London part of the
Overground?


You're right about 26 units being replaced by 24. However it's
difficult to make a direct comparison as AFAIK the plans are still
being finalised (the order for the 4th cars only recently went in) and
TfL and Network Rail have slightly different sets of aspirations, and
the number of units required could vary depending on things like the
increase in frequency on the WLL, the introduction and frequency of
the Queens Park - Stratford service, the possible switch to diesel
stock for the WLL (with through running to Barking), whether London
Overground stock is used for the Abbey Flyer, etc.
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Old July 13th 07, 02:44 AM posted to uk.transport.london,uk.railway
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Default North London Line goes 4-car in early 2011

On Thu, 12 Jul 2007 16:44:09 -0700, D7666 wrote:

(modified) stock cascaded from the Victoria line after that line
receives its new trains. The Victoria line stock is similar to the
Bakerloo line fleet, and the two could be merged fairly easily later
on (see below).


I'm not sure this is the current plan.

I can't at the moment find out why I think this but I am under the
impression the Bakerloo changes come in with new Bakerloo line trains
(that have yet to be ordered).

I don't think shifting c.45 year old - as they will be by the time
they are released - Victoria line ATO stock to a non ATO line is
really a runner is it ?


I don't think the ATO thing is an issue - Victoria Line trains are
already capable of being driven manually, and can be equipped with
tripcocks for when they need to travel over other lines (e.g. to reach
the works at Acton). Presumably they would just need to be equipped
with conventional power/brake handles, and have a trailer removed to
reduce them to 7 cars.


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