Liverpool street bay platform
 

Many years ago when passing through Liverpool Street on the circle I
noticed that there was a bay platform which was out of use. At the
time there was major works going on so I assumed that it would be
reinstated when the works were completed.

Passing through the other day it was still behind hoardings and out of
use. Is their any plan to bring it back into use. I would have
though it would have been useful in times of disruption / engineering
works to turn trains back.

Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

wrote in message
...
Many years ago when passing through Liverpool Street on the circle I
noticed that there was a bay platform which was out of use. At the
time there was major works going on so I assumed that it would be
reinstated when the works were completed.

Passing through the other day it was still behind hoardings and out of
use. Is their any plan to bring it back into use. I would have
though it would have been useful in times of disruption / engineering
works to turn trains back.

Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

Not as far as I know. There are already two bay platforms at Moorgate so
I don't see any real need for another platform at Liverpool Street.

Peter Smyth

Liverpool street bay platform
 

On Nov 1, 5:40*pm, wrote:
Many years ago when passing through Liverpool Street on the circle I
noticed that there was a bay platform which was out of use. At the
time there was major works going on so I assumed that it would be
reinstated when the works were completed.

Passing through the other day it was still behind hoardings and out of
use. *Is their any plan to bring it back into use. *I would have
though it would have been useful in times of disruption / engineering
works to turn trains back.

Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

No plans to bring it back.

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

Liverpool street bay platform
 

On Nov 1, 6:48*pm, chunky munky wrote:
On Nov 1, 5:40*pm, wrote:

Many years ago when passing through Liverpool Street on the circle I
noticed that there was a bay platform which was out of use. At the
time there was major works going on so I assumed that it would be
reinstated when the works were completed.

Passing through the other day it was still behind hoardings and out of
use. *Is their any plan to bring it back into use. *I would have
though it would have been useful in times of disruption / engineering
works to turn trains back.

Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

No plans to bring it back.

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

It was used by eight-coach A Stock trains (generally to Amersham in
the peaks).

I thought it was pretty permanently used as offices now, but I haven't
looked recently.

Liverpool street bay platform
 

chunky munky wrote:
On Nov 1, 5:40 pm, wrote:
Many years ago when passing through Liverpool Street on the circle I
noticed that there was a bay platform which was out of use. At the
time there was major works going on so I assumed that it would be
reinstated when the works were completed.

Passing through the other day it was still behind hoardings and out
of use. Is their any plan to bring it back into use. I would have
though it would have been useful in times of disruption / engineering
works to turn trains back.

Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

No plans to bring it back.

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

Normal length A-Stock definitely used it when it was open. I often
jumped off a Circle on to the Met at Liverpool Street if there was a
train waiting in the bay... if there wasn't, Moorgate did the same job.

Liverpool street bay platform
 

On Sat, 1 Nov 2008 11:48:47 -0700 (PDT), chunky munky
wrote:


Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

No plans to bring it back.

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

Is it not? When in use, it took an 8 car "A" stock without problem.


--
Bill Hayles

http://billnot.com

Liverpool street bay platform
 

Bill Hayles wrote:

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

Is it not? When in use, it took an 8 car "A" stock without problem.

Did it run along what is now platform or behind it?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

On Sat, 1 Nov 2008 21:15:21 -0000, "Stephen O'Connell"
wrote:



Normal length A-Stock definitely used it when it was open. I often
jumped off a Circle on to the Met at Liverpool Street if there was a
train waiting in the bay... if there wasn't, Moorgate did the same job.

A few years ago when I was commuting to Uxbridge I used to catch the
first Northbound met of the day from the City, which started from the
LS bay at about 7.40. Well, usually. About once a week it only got as
far south as the Moorgate bays, but announcements were usually made in
good time.

I don't use the Met very often these days. Tell me - do you still get
the spectacular fireworks display when an eastbound A stock has its
fourth-rail shoe almost-but-not-quite touching the conductor rail ramp
by the crossover at the western end of Liverpool Street?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

"Bill Hayles" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2008 11:48:47 -0700 (PDT), chunky munky
wrote:


Does anyone know if there any plans to bring it back into use ?

No plans to bring it back.

Its nowhere near long enough for the current and future trains either.

Is it not? When in use, it took an 8 car "A" stock without problem.


--
Bill Hayles

http://billnot.com
This was taken out of use whilst I was in the LUL Signalling drawing office.

I think there were several reasons why it was taken oos - one practical one
was that the points were very "heavy" and difficult to set (and be kept set)
correctly causing regular rush hour failures. There were numerous attemmpts
to correct them and they never seemed to succeed! IIRC most of the fast
Amershams were booked to turn there in the evening peak and there were
regular problems getting from Harrow to Rickmansworth (the BR diesel service
was non-stop Ricky and most BR drivers seemed to refuse an LUL stop order!).
Another was far more controversial - at that time the area was controlled by
a signal cabin (before the computer control from Baker Street) and the
signalmen were having an industrial dispute about being regraded to
regulators (a higher & better paid job). If the remote control of LS was
removed they would remain as signalmen! We understood this was internal
politics within the Operating Department of the time!

IIRC the bay was due to be taken oos to allow space for building works
elsewhere on the station and was never reinstated. Ppermanent buildings were
placed on the trackbed which results in it not being long enough to accept
any current train length.

Peter
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

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Liverpool street bay platform
 

"Peter Corser" wrote in message
...

This was taken out of use whilst I was in the LUL Signalling drawing
office.

I think there were several reasons why it was taken oos - one practical
one was that the points were very "heavy" and difficult to set (and be
kept set) correctly causing regular rush hour failures. There were
numerous attemmpts to correct them and they never seemed to succeed! IIRC
most of the fast Amershams were booked to turn there in the evening peak
and there were regular problems getting from Harrow to Rickmansworth (the
BR diesel service was non-stop Ricky and most BR drivers seemed to refuse
an LUL stop order!).
Another was far more controversial - at that time the area was controlled
by a signal cabin (before the computer control from Baker Street) and the
signalmen were having an industrial dispute about being regraded to
regulators (a higher & better paid job). If the remote control of LS was
removed they would remain as signalmen! We understood this was internal
politics within the Operating Department of the time!

IIRC the bay was due to be taken oos to allow space for building works
elsewhere on the station and was never reinstated. Ppermanent buildings
were placed on the trackbed which results in it not being long enough to
accept any current train length.

Peter
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

When exactly was this track taken out of service?

What also is going on with the signal box at Liverpool Street? When were all
of its operations moved to Baker Street and what are its prospects? Can it
be brought back into service in emergency situations?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

wrote in message
...
"Peter Corser" wrote in message
...

This was taken out of use whilst I was in the LUL Signalling drawing
office.

I think there were several reasons why it was taken oos - one practical
one was that the points were very "heavy" and difficult to set (and be
kept set) correctly causing regular rush hour failures. There were
numerous attemmpts to correct them and they never seemed to succeed!
IIRC most of the fast Amershams were booked to turn there in the evening
peak and there were regular problems getting from Harrow to Rickmansworth
(the BR diesel service was non-stop Ricky and most BR drivers seemed to
refuse an LUL stop order!).
Another was far more controversial - at that time the area was controlled
by a signal cabin (before the computer control from Baker Street) and the
signalmen were having an industrial dispute about being regraded to
regulators (a higher & better paid job). If the remote control of LS was
removed they would remain as signalmen! We understood this was internal
politics within the Operating Department of the time!

IIRC the bay was due to be taken oos to allow space for building works
elsewhere on the station and was never reinstated. Ppermanent buildings
were placed on the trackbed which results in it not being long enough to
accept any current train length.

Peter
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

When exactly was this track taken out of service?

What also is going on with the signal box at Liverpool Street? When were
all of its operations moved to Baker Street and what are its prospects?
Can it be brought back into service in emergency situations?

The original Liverpool St box (Bishopsgate Junction) was superseded by a new
cabin with a power frame in 1954. The power frame (type unknown, but
pobably an N or N2) was converted to air working (similar, but not identical
to later interlocking machines) remote controlled form Farringdon (quite
common LUL practice) in 1956 and the cabin became an interlocking machine
room.

There was also an IMR at Barbican. Farringdon Box had two push button
control desks - one for Farringdon and Barbican, one for Moorgate ( inc CWL)
and Liverpool Street. The old electromechanical signal cabin at Farrindon
was stripped out in late 1956 and converted to this push button arrangement.
Barbican was a "true" IMR with a V type interlocking machine. Algate had its
own box.

The CWL control was transferred to temporary cabin for eventual control by
BR in 1965 and various layout simplifications occurred during 60s & 70s.
The logic usewd was that decommissioning the bay and associated pointwork
and then classing the remaining east to west crossover as am emergency
crossover (not normally used for timetabled passenger routes. The remaining
siding and connection between the Circle & CWL were abolished and Farringdon
became an automatic site.

This allowed the number of controlled routes at Farringdon to be reduced
below the number required for higher grading of the signallers!

Barbican was abolished on 20th October 1979, Liverpool Street IMR remained
open. The LS bay was taken oos with this changeover, but I have no details
of when the building work started. I was one of the DO team who did the
design work for the signalling changes, but had always (as a railway
enthusiast) expected that it would be recommissioned one day and was most
surprised to find one one of my later forays through the station that the
bay was being used for building works!

Politics and Senior Operating staff moved on and Farringdon was given
control of the new Aldgate IMR on 25th Jan 1988. Transfer to Baker Street
SCC was 25th March 2001

As others have stated the building works now mean that it is impossible to
reinstate the bay to accomadate any useful train length and it would,
obviously, be uneconomic to even envisage the works required to make it
usable!

Peter
PS Details of all LUL signal cabins can be found at
www.metadyne.co.uk/LTSB.pdf (a very useful site all round! - not my site)
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

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Liverpool street bay platform
 

"Peter Corser" wrote in message
...

The original Liverpool St box (Bishopsgate Junction) was superseded by a
new cabin with a power frame in 1954. The power frame (type unknown, but
pobably an N or N2) was converted to air working (similar, but not
identical to later interlocking machines) remote controlled form
Farringdon (quite common LUL practice) in 1956 and the cabin became an
interlocking machine room.

There was also an IMR at Barbican. Farringdon Box had two push button
control desks - one for Farringdon and Barbican, one for Moorgate ( inc
CWL) and Liverpool Street. The old electromechanical signal cabin at
Farrindon was stripped out in late 1956 and converted to this push button
arrangement. Barbican was a "true" IMR with a V type interlocking machine.
Algate had its own box.

The CWL control was transferred to temporary cabin for eventual control by
BR in 1965 and various layout simplifications occurred during 60s & 70s.
The logic usewd was that decommissioning the bay and associated pointwork
and then classing the remaining east to west crossover as am emergency
crossover (not normally used for timetabled passenger routes. The
remaining siding and connection between the Circle & CWL were abolished
and Farringdon became an automatic site.

This allowed the number of controlled routes at Farringdon to be reduced
below the number required for higher grading of the signallers!

Barbican was abolished on 20th October 1979, Liverpool Street IMR remained
open. The LS bay was taken oos with this changeover, but I have no
details of when the building work started. I was one of the DO team who
did the design work for the signalling changes, but had always (as a
railway enthusiast) expected that it would be recommissioned one day and
was most surprised to find one one of my later forays through the station
that the bay was being used for building works!

Politics and Senior Operating staff moved on and Farringdon was given
control of the new Aldgate IMR on 25th Jan 1988. Transfer to Baker Street
SCC was 25th March 2001

As others have stated the building works now mean that it is impossible to
reinstate the bay to accomadate any useful train length and it would,
obviously, be uneconomic to even envisage the works required to make it
usable!

Peter
PS Details of all LUL signal cabins can be found at
www.metadyne.co.uk/LTSB.pdf (a very useful site all round! - not my site)
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

Very interesting, indeed, but I was just asking about the Bishopsgate box
itself. Are they going to keep it at its current place or will they
eventually remove it? Does it have any particular use at the moment?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

wrote in message
...
"Peter Corser" wrote in message
...

The original Liverpool St box (Bishopsgate Junction) was superseded by a
new cabin with a power frame in 1954. The power frame (type unknown, but
pobably an N or N2) was converted to air working (similar, but not
identical to later interlocking machines) remote controlled form
Farringdon (quite common LUL practice) in 1956 and the cabin became an
interlocking machine room.

There was also an IMR at Barbican. Farringdon Box had two push button
control desks - one for Farringdon and Barbican, one for Moorgate ( inc
CWL) and Liverpool Street. The old electromechanical signal cabin at
Farrindon was stripped out in late 1956 and converted to this push button
arrangement. Barbican was a "true" IMR with a V type interlocking
machine. Algate had its own box.

The CWL control was transferred to temporary cabin for eventual control
by BR in 1965 and various layout simplifications occurred during 60s &
70s. The logic usewd was that decommissioning the bay and associated
pointwork and then classing the remaining east to west crossover as am
emergency crossover (not normally used for timetabled passenger routes.
The remaining siding and connection between the Circle & CWL were
abolished and Farringdon became an automatic site.

This allowed the number of controlled routes at Farringdon to be reduced
below the number required for higher grading of the signallers!

Barbican was abolished on 20th October 1979, Liverpool Street IMR
remained open. The LS bay was taken oos with this changeover, but I have
no details of when the building work started. I was one of the DO team
who did the design work for the signalling changes, but had always (as a
railway enthusiast) expected that it would be recommissioned one day and
was most surprised to find one one of my later forays through the station
that the bay was being used for building works!

Politics and Senior Operating staff moved on and Farringdon was given
control of the new Aldgate IMR on 25th Jan 1988. Transfer to Baker
Street SCC was 25th March 2001

As others have stated the building works now mean that it is impossible
to reinstate the bay to accomadate any useful train length and it would,
obviously, be uneconomic to even envisage the works required to make it
usable!

Peter
PS Details of all LUL signal cabins can be found at
www.metadyne.co.uk/LTSB.pdf (a very useful site all round! - not my site)
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

Very interesting, indeed, but I was just asking about the Bishopsgate box
itself. Are they going to keep it at its current place or will they
eventually remove it? Does it have any particular use at the moment?


Since Bishopsgate was superseded in 1954 I'm not sure whether it is still
pysically standing (I left LUL in 1995 so cannot easily check any current
plans). If it was still standing it would probably have found another use,
but I suspect that it would have had limited (or no) access apart from
trackside which would have restricted usefulness except as a storeroom. The
IMR is part of the current signalling.

Peter
--
Peter & Elizabeth Corser
Leighton Buzzard, UK

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Liverpool street bay platform
 

"Peter Corser" wrote in message
...

Since Bishopsgate was superseded in 1954 I'm not sure whether it is still
pysically standing (I left LUL in 1995 so cannot easily check any current
plans). If it was still standing it would probably have found another
use, but I suspect that it would have had limited (or no) access apart
from trackside which would have restricted usefulness except as a
storeroom. The IMR is part of the current signalling.

Just north of the station, right?

It's still there.

AIUI, the bay platform was taken oos in 1979, right?

Liverpool street bay platform
 

I don't use the Met very often these days. Tell me - do you still get
the spectacular fireworks display when an eastbound A stock has its
fourth-rail shoe almost-but-not-quite touching the conductor rail ramp
by the crossover at the western end of Liverpool Street?

YEP