On 1 Nov, 23:55, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Apparently (BBC teletext refers) the station closed for two hours today
because of Westfield related overcrowding.
I hadn't seen that when I asked in an earlier post about the effect on the
local stations of the centre opening, but I always suspected that of the
various options for travel the Central Line platforms would be the weakest
link...

I wonder if the fall back position will be to make the station exit or
entrance only a la Covent Garden or Camden Town, with pax directed to White
City where the platforms are relatively huge compared to Shepherds Bush?


There's a BBC News online story here about this...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7704113.stm

The story also covers the somewhat inevitable traffic jams on the
roads in the area, including a slip road that was closed to control
congestion.

FWIW here's a few stats- there are 60,000 visitors expected every day,
60% of whom are expected to come by public transport, and there are
4,500 car parking spaces (which are not free).

As well as the possibility of continuing problems of overcrowding at
Shepherd's Bush Central line station, the other public transport issue
that instantly springs to mind is how much extra strain the shopping
centre will put on passenger services down the West London Line
(bearing in mind the newly opened Shepher's Bush WLL station), in
particular at peak times when trains are already rammed full. And I
suppose there could be an issue with higher levels of traffic
congestion playing havoc with bus services in the area.

Of course it's still early days and because people are nuts they want
to go and pay homage to the gods of consumerism at the new shiny shiny
temple of shops right away. Of course it's probably best to just wait
until the initial furore surrounding the centre's opening dies down
and things become more settled before trying to identify what long-
term issues traffic heading to and from the centre might present.

On Sat, 1 Nov 2008 18:54:54 -0700 (PDT), Mizter T
wrote:


On 1 Nov, 23:55, "Paul Scott" wrote:
Apparently (BBC teletext refers) the station closed for two hours today
because of Westfield related overcrowding.
I hadn't seen that when I asked in an earlier post about the effect on the
local stations of the centre opening, but I always suspected that of the
various options for travel the Central Line platforms would be the weakest
link...

Does White City still have to handle football traffic for QPR? The
whole area might become "fun" if football fixtures coincide with peak
shopping days.

There's a BBC News online story here about this...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/england/london/7704113.stm

The story also covers the somewhat inevitable traffic jams on the
roads in the area, including a slip road that was closed to control
congestion.

As well as the possibility of continuing problems of overcrowding at
Shepherd's Bush Central line station, the other public transport issue
that instantly springs to mind is how much extra strain the shopping
centre will put on passenger services down the West London Line
(bearing in mind the newly opened Shepher's Bush WLL station), in
particular at peak times when trains are already rammed full. And I
suppose there could be an issue with higher levels of traffic
congestion playing havoc with bus services in the area.

I think the biggest challenge here will be service levels. As a nutter
(! - see below) I popped into Westfield on opening day. There were not
many people using the Overground station that I could see although I
literally just missed a train. That meant a 30 minute wait - in the
evening peak! - so I decided to go to the Central Line. I was not alone
- several people entered, looked at the display and turned round and
walked out. I appreciate we're in a slightly false state at present due
to the works and the apparent inability of Southern trains to stop.
However 30 min peak services and hourly services on Sundays (until mid
afternoon) are a nonsense for people trying to reach developments of
this scale. I expect TfL will be under pressure "to do something" about
Overground services soon rather than later even though I know an
enhanced service is planned for later. Perhaps those spare Class 508s
that South Eastern have stored could be used? Is there third rail all
the way in to Willesden Junction High Level or is dual voltage
capability absolutely essential to get there?

Of course it's still early days and because people are nuts they want
to go and pay homage to the gods of consumerism at the new shiny shiny
temple of shops right away. Of course it's probably best to just wait
until the initial furore surrounding the centre's opening dies down
and things become more settled before trying to identify what long-
term issues traffic heading to and from the centre might present.

I agree that the first weekend of any place like this will not be
typical. When I visited I went via Wood Lane - I was one of two people
who alighted from the train from hammersmith. I was a tad surprised at
this but I'd expect things will pick up in time. I opted to go home via
the Central Line and while the station wasn't packed the obvious
contrast was between the relatively spacious ticket hall and all the old
cramped facilities down below. The fact everyone spills on to the e/b
platform when heading for the trains doesn't help matters and obviously
the reverse applies for exit.

The most striking issue for me with all the Westfield sponsored
transport facilities is that they are all crammed in to confined sites
with no room to expand. The Bus Station looks too small to me, Wood Lane
is tiny and there's nothing really new at the Central Line site apart
from the ticket hall building. The woes of the Overground platform
widths are well documented. Someone is going to have a very big bill if
any of these facilities require expansion in, say, 10 years time.

--
Paul C

In article ,
(Paul Corfield) wrote:

Perhaps those spare Class 508s
that South Eastern have stored could be used? Is there third rail all
the way in to Willesden Junction High Level or is dual voltage
capability absolutely essential to get there?

The changeover is just north of Shepherd's Bush, surely?

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On 2 Nov, 04:29, Paul Corfield wrote:
Perhaps those spare Class 508s that South Eastern have stored could be used?

It's rumoured LO will be retuning their own 508s to the leasing
company shortly.

*Is there third rail all
the way in to Willesden Junction High Level or is dual voltage
capability absolutely essential to get there?

Not as far as I know. But the 378s will be entering service in a few
month's time, so if they hang on to their 313s they'll have a short
term fleet expansion. But I'm not sure what the capacity limit is on
the West London Line.

I opted to go home via
the Central Line and while the station wasn't packed the obvious
contrast was between the relatively spacious ticket hall and all the old
cramped facilities down below. *The fact everyone spills on to the e/b
platform when heading for the trains doesn't help matters and obviously
the reverse applies for exit.

This might be something you know more than me about, but AFAIK the
whole scheme was planned around TfL paying for "below ground works"
that would give you lifts and a new passageway parallel to the
platform that would take people to the other end. They decided it was
looking way too expensive, and that's why we're where we are.

U

On 2 Nov, 11:03, Mr Thant
wrote:

On 2 Nov, 04:29, Paul Corfield wrote:

(snip)

I opted to go home via
the Central Line and while the station wasn't packed the obvious
contrast was between the relatively spacious ticket hall and all the old
cramped facilities down below. *The fact everyone spills on to the e/b
platform when heading for the trains doesn't help matters and obviously
the reverse applies for exit.

This might be something you know more than me about, but AFAIK the
whole scheme was planned around TfL paying for "below ground works"
that would give you lifts and a new passageway parallel to the
platform that would take people to the other end. They decided it was
looking way too expensive, and that's why we're where we are.


Vague shades of the abandoned plan for rebuilding Holloway tube
station in connection with the new Arsenal stadium at Ashburton Grove
- though in that instance there wasn't any notion that above ground
and below ground works would be funded differently, instead Arsenal
handed over the agreed amount for transport improvements under the
section 106 agreement and TfL then decided that rebuilding Holloway
Road would be far too expensive so the money would be spent on other
local projects (I think the new entrance and redeveloped bus concourse
and stands at Finsbury Park station were funded out of this pot, as
will be the upcoming Highbury Corner improvements.)

In article ,
Paul Corfield wrote:
Perhaps those spare Class 508s that South Eastern have stored could be
used? Is there third rail all the way in to Willesden Junction High
Level or is dual voltage capability absolutely essential to get there?

There is no third rail at all in Willesden Junction.

I suppose the 508s could replace 313s on the Watford service and let 313s
work to Clapham Junction more frequently.

--
David Wild using RISC OS on broadband
www.davidhwild.me.uk
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