On 6 Feb, 15:32, Roland Perry wrote:

In message
, at
07:28:13 on Fri, 6 Feb 2009, Mizter T remarked:

I hardly think the lack of the NTH being open on day one would prove a
killer blow to the Kent high-speed service - it might attract a few
comments,

It's just another drip-drip-drip bit of un-joined-up planning.

It is a bit daft, but it's far preferable to there not being a new NTH
in the first place, or to the NTH not being finished until years after
the Kent domestics arrive (being done in a rush before the Olympics,
for example).

This RailwayPeople article from April '05 has a little bit more
information about why work on the NTH was suspended by the DfT:
http://tinyurl.com/da43nv

---quote---
The government has recently announced that work on the northern ticket
hall at King’s Cross/St. Pancras underground station will go ahead.
[...]
The decision has been a long time coming. The northern ticket hall,
part of the works currently in hand, was suspended back in April 2003
when the estimated cost rose to £250 million. Subsequently, early last
year, the then Transport Minister Kim Howells ordered a cost review of
the proposal, which was undertaken by consultants Mott Parsons Gibb.
---/quote---


I dare say there was rather more that lay behind all that - e.g.
bickering with the Treasury over the growing DfT budget, or perhaps a
spending squeeze across all departments (it was the same time as the
Iraq 'adventure', for example). Perhaps the DfT simply saw it as a
good candidate for a project that could be postponed until such a time
as the departmental budget could handle it - in other words, boot it
down a couple of years.


but of course the potential bad publicity would be far worse
if a promise was made that the NTH would be open and that promise was
then broken.

Which is why I query it, when I read postings here saying "it will open
in December".

But no one here has made an official announcement from TfL that "it
will be open in December", and Paul's comment was merely a quick
confirmation what the latest plan was (cue pedantic discussion as to
what constitutes a "plan" and whether that counts as being "official"
or not) - I dare say that if he expects to get this level of
inquisition each time he posts a one-sentence comment and feels that
he needs to couch everything in qualifications he might well not
bother doing so in the future, which would be rather a shame.

If you want to take the comments here as stating that the NTH *will*
open in December just so you can reserve the opportunity of being
disappointed if it doesn't then by all means do so, just know that
you'll be on your own if that happens.

"Mr Thant" wrote in message
...
On 6 Feb, 15:32, Roland Perry wrote:
Which is why I query it, when I read postings here saying "it will open
in December".

With transport projects there's an inherent "(or whenever they
actually finish it)" inherent to any date prediction. If the thread
was specifically about the precise opening date, obviously I'd have
put in the qualifications about the different possible dates. But
otherwise, no, "December" is good enough as the approximate opening
date at this point.


TBH I don't think the average passenger is too concerned about delays to
something he hasn't used before, and besides, the cynics here say no one is
going to use Kent domestic HS services anyway...

Failure of a short term planned closure, (such as a week of WCML engineering
works), to reopen on time seems to wind people up far more...

Paul

In message
, at
08:22:46 on Fri, 6 Feb 2009, Mizter T remarked:
But no one here has made an official announcement from TfL that "it
will be open in December", and Paul's comment was merely a quick
confirmation what the latest plan was (cue pedantic discussion as to
what constitutes a "plan" and whether that counts as being "official"
or not) - I dare say that if he expects to get this level of
inquisition each time he posts a one-sentence comment and feels that
he needs to couch everything in qualifications he might well not
bother doing so in the future, which would be rather a shame.

If you want to take the comments here as stating that the NTH *will*
open in December just so you can reserve the opportunity of being
disappointed if it doesn't then by all means do so, just know that
you'll be on your own if that happens.

My main interest is why the newsletters feel unable to make equally
"hey, we'll try to get open in December, but don't blame us if it's
Easter" type remarks. It wasn't a criticism of Paul.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 16:50:44 on
Fri, 6 Feb 2009, Paul Corfield remarked:
The only thing that is really important is when all the work is
actually finished at Kings Cross / St Pancras and we can look forward
to having a much better set of facilities with more capacity to handle
the hoardes of passengers.

OK, I'm happy to drop the issue about the exact timing of the NTH; but
when the whole thing is finished many passengers (especially those
arriving on the Midland Mainline) will be getting a much worse deal than
they used to before the works started.

Indeed, the plans don't even anticipate those passengers using the NTH
(the escalators down from the platforms are in the wrong place, anyway)
so it's a long trudge via the shops and the front of StPancras to the
original ticket hall - which as far as I can see has been refurbished
back to exactly where they started (bar the somewhat small lift.

Never mind, I shall enjoy exploring all the new passageways from the NTH
to the Victoria Line and so on, when they open.
--
Roland Perry

In message , Paul Corfield
writes
Never mind, I shall enjoy exploring all the new passageways from the NTH
to the Victoria Line and so on, when they open.

As, I am sure, will many other utlers. In fact I shall have to have a
little explore of the tube station to see just what is going on - I
only see the Vic Line platforms on a regular basis and they look an
utter mess because of the refurb works.

The Picc platforms aren't much better - Rustic I think the style is
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

In message , at 20:35:46 on
Wed, 11 Feb 2009, Paul Corfield remarked:
My main interest is why the newsletters feel unable to make equally
"hey, we'll try to get open in December, but don't blame us if it's
Easter" type remarks. It wasn't a criticism of Paul.

You may or may not wish to look at page 5 of the investment report (or
page 38 of the full pdf) to see the entry for Kings Cross Station
Redevelopment and the forecast completion date of 1/12/09 vs the plan
date of 28/2/10.

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...-Programme.pdf

Maybe in the next newsletter then?
--
Roland Perry

On 11 Feb, 20:52, Roland Perry wrote:

In message , at 20:35:46 on
Wed, 11 Feb 2009, Paul Corfield remarked:

My main interest is why the newsletters feel unable to make equally
"hey, we'll try to get open in December, but don't blame us if it's
Easter" type remarks. It wasn't a criticism of Paul.

You may or may not wish to look at page 5 of the investment report (or
page 38 of the full pdf) to see the entry for Kings Cross Station
Redevelopment and the forecast completion date of 1/12/09 vs the plan
date of 28/2/10.

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/assets/downloa...ps-and-Finance...

Maybe in the next newsletter then?

Not if the comms team have been reading this thread, no!