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Hello from New York
In message , Knotso
writes I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. But then, I have no benchmark to judge how long a ride it really is. Can anyone provide an estimate? 45 minutes from Heathrow to Green Park 10 minutes for interchange (see below) 20 minutes from Green Park to North Greenwich -- 75 minutes total The Transport for London Journey planner gives timings: http://journeyplanner.tfl.gov.uk/index.htm But beware that it can give some rather odd routes - you are better asking here for details! I seem to remember that the interchange at Green Park involves quite a long underground walk - if you have heavy luggage it may be better to change from Piccadilly to District at Hammersmith (simple cross-platform interchange) and then pick-up the Jubilee line at Westminster (where there are lifts and escalators). However, note that the Jubilee doesn't go to "South Greenwich" - was that a typo, or can you be more specific in where you want to end up? There may be better alternatives, such as taking the mainline railway out to Greenwich from central London (SE London is well served by numerous commuter lines, and a branch of the Docklands Light Railway, but is poorly served by the underground system.) Being conditioned by New York subway maps, I have to admit the London schematic map drives me nuts. I can't get a true sense of direction of how close a station is to a landmark. Which leads to my next question ... do any geographic maps of the tube exist? Where are they? Not easy to find on the WWW, but there is a quite good one at the end of the following PDF document (820K): http://www.londontransport.co.uk/tfl.../marketone.pdf If you take a look at this you will see how the Jubilee line runs well north of the main part of Greenwich - although North Greenwich station may well be a good option if you are going to be picked-up by car. -- Paul Terry |
Hello from New York
Being conditioned by New York subway maps, I have to admit the London
schematic map drives me nuts. I can't get a true sense of direction of how close a station is to a landmark. Which leads to my next question ... do any geographic maps of the tube exist? Where are they? There are some around but I can't say I've ever felt a need for them as the stations are marked on street and bus maps and sooner or later one of those will be required unless you are being met, in which case it isn't a problem. The Jubilee Line goes to North Greenwich which is slightly off the beaten track a bit. Unless that is where your friend has suggested you go to I would suggest you ask him/her which station is the most convenient. 'Maritime Greenwich' is served by Greenwich station which is on the DLR and also an overground line and the latter are often more convenient. It might, for example, be more convenient to change from the Piccadilly to the District Line at Hammersmith or Barons Court (you just walk across an island platform there which is handy with heavy luggage) and then go to Cannon Street for a direct train to Greenwich. G. |
Hello from New York
Knotso wrote:
Hi all and have patience with a newcomer. I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. But then, I have no benchmark to judge how long a ride it really is. Can anyone provide an estimate? Allowing two minutes per station gives a reasonably accurate journey time. |
Hello from New York
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Hello from New York
(Knotso) wrote in message ...
Hi all and have patience with a newcomer. I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. But then, I have no benchmark to judge how long a ride it really is. Can anyone provide an estimate? Being conditioned by New York subway maps, I have to admit the London schematic map drives me nuts. I can't get a true sense of direction of how close a station is to a landmark. Which leads to my next question ... do any geographic maps of the tube exist? Where are they? Well, it should be an eye-opener riding the London tube for the first time after 3 years of living with New York subways. Anyone with experience commuting on both transit systems who can venture opinions about the differences between the two cities? I've probably bothered you enough, but I welcome your opinions. J Look at www.thetube.com and click on routefinder. It gives a rough idea of journey times. Regarding geographic tube maps, the best modern map of the central area is at wwww.fourthway.co.uk - click on 'The Real Underground', and have a look through the options in the popup window. HTH |
Hello from New York
In message , Knotso
writes who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. It's "North Greenwich", which is nowhere near what the locals would call Greenwich. The actual centre of Greenwich is between the Cutty Sark and Greenwich DLR stations. But don't try changing from the Jubilee to DLR at Canary Wharf because it's a long way to walk. It would be much better to get an overground train to Greenwich (probably from Charing Cross, walk from Embankment tube, having changed at Hammersmith). -- Roland Perry |
Hello from New York
In Roland Perry wrote: It's "North Greenwich", which is nowhere near what the locals would call Greenwich. The actual centre of Greenwich is between the Cutty Sark and Greenwich DLR stations. But don't try changing from the Jubilee to DLR at Canary Wharf because it's a long way to walk. It would be much better to get an overground train to Greenwich (probably from Charing Cross, walk from Embankment tube, having changed at Hammersmith). Yeah, I was thinking the overground train would be better since it brings you quickly to Greenwich (town), and also Maze Hill. Though I think most of them leave from Cannon Street, through London Bridge. So that would be the District Line from Hammersmith to Cannon Street. If you go to London Bridge then you're probably taking the Jubilee Line anyway, so you might as well stay on and take a 188 bus from North Greenwich. I expect the overground trains aren't as tourist friendly as the tube. -- kedron |
Hello from New York
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Hello from New York
In message , kedron
writes I expect the overground trains aren't as tourist friendly as the tube. The commuter trains (as they are) are equally tourist friendly. -- Roland Perry |
Hello from New York
"Huge" wrote in message ... (Knotso) writes: Hi all and have patience with a newcomer. I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. But then, I have no benchmark to judge how long a ride it really is. Can anyone provide an estimate? Get the Heathrow Express to Paddington. And from there to Greenwich? |
Hello from New York
In message , Huge
writes (Knotso) writes: I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Get the Heathrow Express to Paddington. How would that help him get to Greenwich? -- Paul Terry |
Hello from New York
In Roland Perry wrote: I expect the overground trains aren't as tourist friendly as the tube. The commuter trains (as they are) are equally tourist friendly. Well, for a start, the trains aren't nearly as frequent, they have a different ticketing system, and the route maps aren't as well publicised or as well-known as the tube. For example, it wasn't at all clear where the journey in question here starts from (mostly). -- kedron |
Hello from New York
"Huge" wrote in message
Paul Terry writes: [20 lines snipped] I seem to remember that the interchange at Green Park involves quite a long underground walk It does. And several flights of stairs. The easier route is up the Piccadilly escalator to the booking hall and then down the Victoria escalator. It's quicker and shorter. To minimise the walking, board the last car of the Picc train and take the middle escalator. |
Hello from New York
In message , kedron
writes In Roland Perry wrote: I expect the overground trains aren't as tourist friendly as the tube. The commuter trains (as they are) are equally tourist friendly. Well, for a start, the trains aren't nearly as frequent, Generally true, but does that matter very much for a tourist, rather than someone-late-for-work? (Greenwich seems to have 6 tph to London, although I accept that some are Cannon St, some Charing Cross. That's more than many parts of the Metropolitan.) they have a different ticketing system, When did they stop taking travelcards? and the route maps aren't as well publicised or as well-known as the tube. For example, it wasn't at all clear where the journey in question here starts from (mostly). I was thinking more about the *trains* than the timetabling. eg Can you get on and off them with luggage. Do the ones in that area stop at most of the stations. And so on. -- Roland Perry |
Hello from New York
Martin S. wrote:
snip Look at www.thetube.com and click on routefinder. It gives a rough idea of journey times. Regarding geographic tube maps, the best modern map of the central area is at wwww.fourthway.co.uk - click on 'The Real Underground', and have a look through the options in the popup window. HTH You'd better knock off one of the 'w's for Fourthway (3 good, 4 bad) or you get hijacked by yet another domain seller :-( When you *do* get there the Shockwave animation is good :-) -- Phil ,,,^.".^,,, --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.521 / Virus Database: 319 - Release Date: 23/09/03 |
Hello from New York
Sorry , if this sounds negative but I'm a londoner and I've ridden on many
metro systems (including the NYC subway many times) around the world and IMO the tube is one of the worst run and managed I've ever come across plus its the most expensive. B2003 Are the LU Admonistrators named Moe Larry & Curly?NYUK NYUK |
Hello from New York
In message , Huge
writes Paul Terry writes: In message , Huge writes I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Get the Heathrow Express to Paddington. How would that help him get to Greenwich? Are you *really* this dim? I have to ask you the same if you think that going via Paddington is a better option. Did you really bother to check your figures? The route I suggested takes 70-75 minutes, offers easy interchange for visitors with luggage and costs under £10. Your suggestion of using the Heathrow Express costs three times as much, involves a difficult interchange at Paddington, plus another at Baker Street, and is most unlikely to offer a shorter journey, especially given the fact that one can have to wait up to 15 minutes for the HE at Heathrow (as opposed to 5 minutes for the Piccadilly). -- Paul Terry |
Hello from New York
Well, it should be an eye-opener riding the London tube for the first time after 3 years of living with New York subways. Anyone with experience commuting on both transit systems who can venture opinions about the differences between the two cities? I've probably bothered you enough, but I welcome your opinions. J As a user of both systems, I would suggest the London network certainly provides the best signposting whilst underground to direct passengers at interchanges. Not a problem when you know when your going but as a newcomer I found the lack of signs in New York time consuming... Kilburn Kid |
Hello from New York
"Boltar" wrote in message m... (Knotso) wrote in message ... snip The MTA in new york can actually manage to run a reasonable service. LU can't. In london there are forever delays , trains being reversed before they've got to their destination because the train (ie driver) is running late (wants to get home for tea), stations being closed because of some lift or escalator not working, incorrect train arrival indicators and so on. Don't ever rely on the tube to get you to your destination on time and this especially applies when you're going to the airport on it. Sorry , if this sounds negative but I'm a londoner and I've ridden on many metro systems (including the NYC subway many times) around the world and IMO the tube is one of the worst run and managed I've ever come across plus its the most expensive. I am sorry but I disagree. I have ridden the tube every day, and I haven't experienced a serious delay since three years ago when it took 45minutes to travel 2 stops. The problem is that a minority of dissatisfied customers will always speak more loudly than the majority of satisfied ones, so come on speak up! And besides the tube is only more expensive than other systems because tube users actually pay for the real cost of the service. Which is how it should be. B2003 |
Hello from New York
Best bet really is Heathrow Express into Paddington. Circle or Bakerloo to
Baker St and change for North Greenwich which will give u a seat on the tube for that long stretch on the Jubilee. Though if you want to see some of London in the air get a Bakerloo Line train down to Charing Cross, take an overground train (South Eastern) get to see the Thames for frequent trains to Greenwich. "Knotso" wrote in message ... Hi all and have patience with a newcomer. I'm visiting London in a month -- for the first time -- and staying with a friend who lives in Greenwich. Pondering the tube map from Heathrow, it appears to be something like a 2-hour ride from the airport, to Green Park, to the Jubilee line to South Greenwich. But then, I have no benchmark to judge how long a ride it really is. Can anyone provide an estimate? Being conditioned by New York subway maps, I have to admit the London schematic map drives me nuts. I can't get a true sense of direction of how close a station is to a landmark. Which leads to my next question ... do any geographic maps of the tube exist? Where are they? Well, it should be an eye-opener riding the London tube for the first time after 3 years of living with New York subways. Anyone with experience commuting on both transit systems who can venture opinions about the differences between the two cities? I've probably bothered you enough, but I welcome your opinions. J --- Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free. Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com). Version: 6.0.522 / Virus Database: 320 - Release Date: 29/09/2003 |
Hello from New York
I am sorry but I disagree. I have ridden the tube every day, and I haven't experienced a serious delay since three years ago when it took 45minutes to travel 2 stops. The problem is that a minority of dissatisfied customers will always speak more loudly than the majority of satisfied ones, so come on speak up! And besides the tube is only more expensive than other systems because tube users actually pay for the real cost of the service. Which is how it should be. B2003 I beg to differ I was in London for 11days in june 2001 2 days the Metropolitan Line was delayed with no trains between Aldgate and Baker St from Baker St the trains were running at half the normal frequency. Another day I sat for 45 minutes on the Picadilly Line between Covent Garden & Leicester Sq because of a stalled train. In NYC (where I live) I've been on locals who have been rerouted on the express tracks and vice versa causing maybe 5 or 10 minute delays I believe except for London which has parallel trackage from Barons Court to Acton Town and from Finchley Road to Wembley Park and Chicago from Howard to Fullerton and Philadelphia Broad St Line from Olney to Spring Garden NYC has extensive parrallel trackage |
Hello from New York
In article , Paul Terry
writes I seem to remember that the interchange at Green Park involves quite a long underground walk It's a corridor that takes me (as a fairly fit person) two or three minutes to walk. At each end you have a choice of stairs or a lift (elevator to the original poster). -- Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home: Tel: +44 20 8371 1138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address |
Hello from New York
In article ,
Wanderingjew698 writes I believe except for London which has parallel trackage from Barons Court to Acton Town and from Finchley Road to Wembley Park to Moor Park, actually. -- Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home: Tel: +44 20 8371 1138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address |
Hello from New York
"Oliver Keating" wrote in message ...
I am sorry but I disagree. I have ridden the tube every day, and I haven't experienced a serious delay since three years ago when it took 45minutes to travel 2 stops. The problem is that a minority of dissatisfied customers will always speak more loudly than the majority of satisfied ones, so come on speak up! Well then you've been lucky mate, I get delayed by more than 20 mins at least once a week. Still , on the bright side at least I'm building up a nice collection of refund vouchers. And besides the tube is only more expensive than other systems because tube users actually pay for the real cost of the service. Which is how it should be. WHy should I have to pay so much for a PUBLIC service that allows me travel to work so that i can earn money to PAY TAXES THAT FUND IT!?? Using your logic we'd all have to pay £££ just to visit the doctor. Ok , not everything can be funded by taxes but public services should be IMO and that includes the tube. Since virtualy every other country does that (with some minimum fare to keep out vagrants and top up the coffers) I suspect we are the ones who need a rethink , not the rest of the world. B2003 |
Hello from New York
In message ,
Wanderingjew698 writes I am sorry but I disagree. I have ridden the tube every day, and I haven't experienced a serious delay since three years ago when it took 45minutes to travel 2 stops. The problem is that a minority of dissatisfied customers will always speak more loudly than the majority of satisfied ones, so come on speak up! And besides the tube is only more expensive than other systems because tube users actually pay for the real cost of the service. Which is how it should be. B2003 I beg to differ I was in London for 11days in june 2001 2 days the Metropolitan Line was delayed with no trains between Aldgate and Baker St from Baker St the trains were running at half the normal frequency. Another day I sat for 45 minutes on the Picadilly Line between Covent Garden & Leicester Sq because of a stalled train. In NYC (where I live) I've been on locals who have been rerouted on the express tracks and vice versa causing maybe 5 or 10 minute delays I believe except for London which has parallel trackage from Barons Court to Acton Town and from Finchley Road to Wembley Park There is also plenty of parallel track on the Met line north of Wembley Park, allowing a mixture of Fast and All-Stations services. In normal practice, the Finchley Rd - Wembley Park section is treated as two separate lines, Jubilee on the inner tracks, Met on the outer. -- Spyke Address is valid, but messages are treated as junk. The opinions I express do not necessarily reflect those of the educational institution from which I post. |
Hello from New York
In normal practice, the Finchley Rd - Wembley Park section is treated as
two separate lines, Jubilee on the inner tracks, Met on the outer. Can they reroute the Met on the Jubilee in case of breakdowns? |
Hello from New York
In message ,
Wanderingjew698 writes In normal practice, the Finchley Rd - Wembley Park section is treated as two separate lines, Jubilee on the inner tracks, Met on the outer. Can they reroute the Met on the Jubilee in case of breakdowns? Quail shows a connections at Neasden and Finchley Rd between the two lines, but looks like Met to Jubilee is easier than vice-versa. I presume the jubilee lines are able to accommodate the Met loading gauge? -- Spyke Address is valid, but messages are treated as junk. The opinions I express do not necessarily reflect those of the educational institution from which I post. |
Hello from New York
Spyke wrote:
In message , Wanderingjew698 writes In normal practice, the Finchley Rd - Wembley Park section is treated as two separate lines, Jubilee on the inner tracks, Met on the outer. Can they reroute the Met on the Jubilee in case of breakdowns? Quail shows a connections at Neasden and Finchley Rd between the two lines, but looks like Met to Jubilee is easier than vice-versa. I presume the jubilee lines are able to accommodate the Met loading gauge? Certainly not south of Finchley Road. |
Hello from New York
In article , Spyke
writes Quail shows a connections at Neasden and Finchley Rd between the two lines, but looks like Met to Jubilee is easier than vice-versa. I presume the jubilee lines are able to accommodate the Met loading gauge? Yes; it used to be that the last Met. train ran along the Jubilee tracks and called at all stations. However, I believe that preparations for ATO on the Jubilee means that A stock is no longer allowed on it. -- Clive D.W. Feather, writing for himself | Home: Tel: +44 20 8371 1138 (work) | Web: http://www.davros.org Fax: +44 870 051 9937 | Work: Written on my laptop; please observe the Reply-To address |
Hello from New York
"Knotso" wrote in message
... Hi all and have patience with a newcomer. Being conditioned by New York subway maps, I have to admit the London schematic map drives me nuts. I can't get a true sense of direction of how close a station is to a landmark. Which leads to my next question ... do any geographic maps of the tube exist? Where are they? There's a very good geographical map at: http://www.kordy.dircon.co.uk/misc/lul.gif I found this from a link on the following page: http://owen.massey.net/tubemaps.html |
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