DLR Tower Gateway
 

Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

Paul Corfield
via Google

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On 2 Mar, 15:40, Paul Corfield wrote:
Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

Paul Corfield
via Google

They had already said it was going to.

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk....63298098?hl=en

It would have been handy for me if it had been open on Saturday, oh
well.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

MIG wrote:
On 2 Mar, 15:40, Paul Corfield wrote:
Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

Paul Corfield
via Google

They had already said it was going to.

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk....63298098?hl=en

It would have been handy for me if it had been open on Saturday, oh
well.

To be fair, there wasn't much of the DLR opened on the western section
on Saturday, and not much Jubilee or District Line action either. I
actually took the river bus to Canary Wharf and back because there was
literally no other decent option (train to Greenwich then DLR being the
next best). I actually spent an entire day mooching around town without
ever going on a tube or bus - I managed to cope with just train, boat,
walk and finally taxi.

The river bus is good but expensive, and takes a lot of staff for the
number of passengers (just under two bendy buses, I reckon, with
something like five or six crew on board plus crew at the landing
piers). It's quick east of the Tower, though, my phone GPS had it at
50km/h+.

Tom

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Mar 2, 6:06*pm, Tom Barry wrote:
MIG wrote:
On 2 Mar, 15:40, Paul Corfield wrote:
Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

Paul Corfield
via Google

They had already said it was going to.

http://groups.google.co.uk/group/uk....g/2ceede816329...

It would have been handy for me if it had been open on Saturday, oh
well.

To be fair, there wasn't much of the DLR opened on the western section
on Saturday, and not much Jubilee or District Line action either. *I
actually took the river bus to Canary Wharf and back because there was
literally no other decent option (train to Greenwich then DLR being the
next best). *I actually spent an entire day mooching around town without
ever going on a tube or bus - I managed to cope with just train, boat,
walk and finally taxi.

The river bus is good but expensive, and takes a lot of staff for the
number of passengers (just under two bendy buses, I reckon, with
something like five or six crew on board plus crew at the landing
piers). *It's quick east of the Tower, though, my phone GPS had it at
50km/h+.

Tom-

The boat was probably a good plan on Saturday. Road users diverting
because of the Blackheath Hill situation must have been delighted by
the fact that the Rotherhithe tunnel was closed.

I was in the Tower Gateway area watching ridculous amounts of traffic
jam, including DLR replacement buses trying to get through.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Mon, 02 Mar 2009 18:06:00 +0000, Tom Barry
wrote:

To be fair, there wasn't much of the DLR opened on the western section
on Saturday, and not much Jubilee or District Line action either. I
actually took the river bus to Canary Wharf and back because there was
literally no other decent option (train to Greenwich then DLR being the
next best). I actually spent an entire day mooching around town without
ever going on a tube or bus - I managed to cope with just train, boat,
walk and finally taxi.

135 bus from Aldgate is the civilised cheap way of getting to Canary
Wharf, though it isn't quick.

The river bus is good but expensive, and takes a lot of staff for the
number of passengers (just under two bendy buses, I reckon, with
something like five or six crew on board plus crew at the landing
piers). It's quick east of the Tower, though, my phone GPS had it at
50km/h+.

It's quite fun standing on the back and leaning out (despite signs to
the effect that you're supposed to take a seat they don't care in
practice).

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Tom Barry wrote in
:

The river bus is good but expensive, and takes a lot of staff for the
number of passengers (just under two bendy buses, I reckon, with
something like five or six crew on board plus crew at the landing
piers).

It is indeed expensive to run; not just the staff costs but the boats and
piers require more maintenance than buses and bus stops. I was involved
with a project a few years ago looking at how the costs and benefits could
be reconciled sufficiently to allow the river buses to operate on the basis
of Oyster PAYG fares, but the cost to revenue gap seemed too large, even
with a hefty cross-subsidy.

This was in Ken's time and I don't know whether there has been any change
in thinking since then.

Peter

--
Peter Campbell Smith ~ London ~ pjcs00 (a) gmail.com

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Oyster on the river is currently in development.

There are various issues - not least the different fare scales with
different operators, which reflect the different styles of service.

Thames Clippers operates the fast commuter "riverbus" and 02 Express,
while City Cruises operates the leisure service which caters for
families, visitors and anyone who wants a day out. [Our boats travel at
a more leisurely speed with more open deck areas, commentary etc, so
your trip on the river is not simply a method of transport.]

Another big question is the siting and installation of the kit.
Remember that boarding piers on the River Thames are not simply afloat,
they rise and fall more than 20ft twice a day Ð and they are very
exposed to the elements. And you can't do bus-type "pay on entry" when
the boat is at the pier.

Progress is being made Ð watch this space.

And as the weather picks up and you get the cameras out, do have a day
out on London's River: 2000 years of liquid history - and if you want
to know more, just ask [end of shameless plug].


On 2009-03-03 11:17:19 +0000, Peter Campbell Smith
said:

Tom Barry wrote in
:

The river bus is good but expensive, and takes a lot of staff for the
number of passengers (just under two bendy buses, I reckon, with
something like five or six crew on board plus crew at the landing
piers).

It is indeed expensive to run; not just the staff costs but the boats and
piers require more maintenance than buses and bus stops. I was involved
with a project a few years ago looking at how the costs and benefits could
be reconciled sufficiently to allow the river buses to operate on the basis
of Oyster PAYG fares, but the cost to revenue gap seemed too large, even
with a hefty cross-subsidy.

This was in Ken's time and I don't know whether there has been any change
in thinking since then.

Peter


--
Writer / editor on London's River

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Paul Corfield wrote:
Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

I have a couple of observations (visited for the first time today).

- Nothing at all has changed externally - quite a surprise since all the
other bright blue Postmodern DLR stations have since been rebuilt, and
that opaque Perspex looks pretty grim. Also, the one working escalator
was set to Down, and those stairs are very narrow for dealing with
5.45ish crowds.

- At platform level, much improved. 3 Oyster-accepting ticket machines
of a new design (can we have some for Tramlink??) and one Queue Buster.

- The arrival/departure layout is sensible, though currently no effort
to enforce the 'right side in' rule - doors on the waiting train were
open on both sides until we left. Draughty!

- Something that puzzled me - obviously there's now a single platform
track, with what looks like a reversing siding to the north (ie in
between the station and the Southend line). This siding becomes the down
running line just outside the station, trains from the platform joining
it using a facing crossover. As we were about to leave, an inbound unit
approached and (obviously) waited just before this crossover while we
left the platform. However, although I looked carefully, I couldn't see
any trap points or any mechanical means of stopping an Up train from
entering the platform when occupied. Is this normal for a .uk light rail
system (albeit an automatic one with occasional manual driving), or does
the DLR have particularly good train protection? Presumably it wouldn't
be allowed on NR, and obviously LU has its tripcocks.

I had a fun trip out to Woolwich, and (just as at Lewisham previously)
the popularity of the extension really highlighted the imbalance in
transport investment north and south of the Thames. It may be slow and
small compared to a proper Tube, but by golly it's faster, more modern
and (Oyster-wise) more convenient than anything else we've got at the
moment.
--
Current nearest station: Lewisham

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Mar 2, 5:42*pm, (Neil Williams)
wrote:

135 bus from Aldgate is the civilised cheap way of getting to Canary
Wharf, though it isn't quick.

Does the 135 tell you where it's going yet? When I last took it all it
said on the front was 'Crossharbour Asda' in one direction and 'Old
Street' in the other. To introduce a bus linking two important
locations (the City and Canary Wharf) and then not to show these on
the destination blinds seems perverse.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Tue, 3 Mar 2009 16:45:13 -0800 (PST), brixtonite
wrote:

Does the 135 tell you where it's going yet? When I last took it all it
said on the front was 'Crossharbour Asda' in one direction and 'Old
Street' in the other. To introduce a bus linking two important
locations (the City and Canary Wharf) and then not to show these on
the destination blinds seems perverse.

That's TfL's "end destination only" nonsense, then... :) No, no
change.

Will be interesting to see if the route survives now Tower Gateway is
back, as it was in part introduced as a replacement.

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Wed, 04 Mar 2009 19:52:48 +0000, Paul Corfield
wrote:

I don't see that it wouldn't survive - there are many other routes with
lower usage. I also cannot recall there being any mention of the 135
being a part replacement for DLR - source for your comment?

I'm pretty sure TfL publicity at the time said that there had long
been an aim to introduce something but that it was prompted by the
requirement to provide for journeys from the Aldgate area to Canary
Wharf that might previously have used the DLR.

Unfortunately I don't still have a copy. But the service itself is
very welcome, and is by far the most civilised (if slow) way of
getting to Canary Wharf using a Travelcard. (The *most* civilised,
costing extra, being the boat).

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Paul Corfield wrote:
Slightly surprised no one has mentioned this but

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/corporate/medi...tre/11275.aspx

says Tower Gateway has reopened.

The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen that in
Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:39:59 -0000, "John Rowland"
wrote:

The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen that in
Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

In Hamburg they stop altogether...

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Neil Williams wrote:
On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:39:59 -0000, "John Rowland"
wrote:

The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen
that in Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

In Hamburg they stop altogether...

So how do you know which is which?

DLR Tower Gateway
 

In message , John Rowland
writes
Neil Williams wrote:
On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:39:59 -0000, "John Rowland"
wrote:

The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen
that in Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

In Hamburg they stop altogether...

So how do you know which is which?

If it's like Brussels or Cologne, there's a blue circular "Ahead Only"
traffic-type sign on one escalator and a red circular "No Entry" sign on
the other.
--
Ian Jelf, MITG
Birmingham, UK

Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England
http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk

DLR Tower Gateway
 

In message , at 10:51:30 on Thu,
5 Mar 2009, Ian Jelf remarked:
The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen
that in Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

In Hamburg they stop altogether...

So how do you know which is which?

If it's like Brussels or Cologne, there's a blue circular "Ahead Only"
traffic-type sign on one escalator and a red circular "No Entry" sign
on the other.

Many countries have escalators that work "on demand" and usage is on a
combination of signage and context. It's common to have an "up"
escalator but only "down" stairs, or there's an obvious tidal flow that
the escalator is servicing (eg 'towards' baggage claim at an airport).
--
Roland Perry

DLR Tower Gateway
 

"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
In message , at 10:51:30 on Thu, 5
Mar 2009, Ian Jelf remarked:
The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen
that in Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

In Hamburg they stop altogether...

So how do you know which is which?

If it's like Brussels or Cologne, there's a blue circular "Ahead Only"
traffic-type sign on one escalator and a red circular "No Entry" sign on
the other.

Many countries have escalators that work "on demand" and usage is on a
combination of signage and context. It's common to have an "up" escalator
but only "down" stairs, or there's an obvious tidal flow that the
escalator is servicing (eg 'towards' baggage claim at an airport).

Most (all?) of the ones on the Munich S/U-Bahn seem to work on a "who steps
on the actuator plate first" system. As you approach your stopped escalator
(with an illuminated sign showing two arrows pointing up and down) and step
onto the flat plate at the start, the escalator bursts into life, the double
arrow light at the start end changes to a single arrow pointing in the
direction of travel and the double arrow at the terminus end changes to a
"No Entry" type roundel. The escalator keeps going for as long as people
keep stepping on the actuator plate, then after it has moved sufficient
distance to transport the last person to step on the actuator to the other
end, it runs for about another 5 seconds then stops and goes back into
"first-come" mode. Of course, for the impartial observer, this provides for
some most amusing spectating of "can I get to the actuator before that
bugger coming the other way" type racing.
--
Cheers, Steve.
Change jealous to sad to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

John Rowland wrote:
The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen that in
Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

The escalators leading to the Churchill Place development from the rest
of the shopping areas also slow down when not being used.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:20:03 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote:

Many countries have escalators that work "on demand" and usage is on a
combination of signage and context.

Including Hamburg, where my old local station, Kiwittsmoor, had one
escalator which was up in the morning and down in the evening, as I
recall.

I'm pretty sure I've also encountered ones that will go either way
depending who gets there first!

Neil

--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the at to reply.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 00:39:59 -0000, "John Rowland"
wrote:

Paul Corfield wrote:
[...] Tower Gateway has reopened.

The new escalators slow down when no-one's using them... I've seen that in
Stockholm, but is this the first one in Britain?

I thought that the DLR had them at one of the Greenwich extension
stations - Cutty Sark maybe?

I dimly remember reading that they were tried on the underground
decades ago but were eventually set to run continuously, it being a
seemingly insoluble problem in the days of steam, cogs, valves and
pulleys.

Richard.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

On Mar 5, 6:24*pm, (Neil Williams)
wrote:
On Thu, 5 Mar 2009 11:20:03 +0000, Roland Perry
wrote:

Many countries have escalators that work "on demand" and usage is on a
combination of signage and context.

Including Hamburg, where my old local station, Kiwittsmoor, had one
escalator which was up in the morning and down in the evening, as I
recall.

I'm pretty sure I've also encountered ones that will go either way
depending who gets there first!

I believe it, but what possible use could that be? Unless there was
some control, you'd end up with everything going the same way and no
way either in or out depending on chance.

Why should an one person set the direction of the whole escalator by
chance? An intelligent decision about how many escalators need to go
each way at a particular time of day is far more appropriate.

DLR Tower Gateway
 

Steve Dulieu wrote:

Most (all?) of the ones on the Munich S/U-Bahn seem to work on a "who
steps on the actuator plate first" system. As you approach your
stopped escalator (with an illuminated sign showing two arrows
pointing up and down) and step onto the flat plate at the start, the
escalator bursts into life, the double arrow light at the start end
changes to a single arrow pointing in the direction of travel and the
double arrow at the terminus end changes to a "No Entry" type
roundel. The escalator keeps going for as long as people keep
stepping on the actuator plate, then after it has moved sufficient
distance to transport the last person to step on the actuator to the
other end, it runs for about another 5 seconds then stops and goes
back into "first-come" mode. Of course, for the impartial observer,
this provides for some most amusing spectating of "can I get to the
actuator before that bugger coming the other way" type racing.

So if two people approach two escalators from the top, both escalators start
running down, and then a trainfull of people arrive at the bottom with no up
escalator for them?

DLR Tower Gateway
 

"John Rowland" wrote in message
...
Steve Dulieu wrote:

Most (all?) of the ones on the Munich S/U-Bahn seem to work on a "who
steps on the actuator plate first" system. As you approach your
stopped escalator (with an illuminated sign showing two arrows
pointing up and down) and step onto the flat plate at the start, the
escalator bursts into life, the double arrow light at the start end
changes to a single arrow pointing in the direction of travel and the
double arrow at the terminus end changes to a "No Entry" type
roundel. The escalator keeps going for as long as people keep
stepping on the actuator plate, then after it has moved sufficient
distance to transport the last person to step on the actuator to the
other end, it runs for about another 5 seconds then stops and goes
back into "first-come" mode. Of course, for the impartial observer,
this provides for some most amusing spectating of "can I get to the
actuator before that bugger coming the other way" type racing.

So if two people approach two escalators from the top, both escalators
start running down, and then a trainfull of people arrive at the bottom
with no up escalator for them?
From what I can remember (most of my jaunts around Munich have involved
pub-crawls, so details are sometimes a bit hazy) if there is more than one
flight of escalators in a stairwell there is a dedicated "up" one and a
dedicated "down" one. The two way ones seem to be where there is only one
escalator in a stairwell. Most stations that I have used have multiple
entrance/exits that only get one escalator each, however the main entrances
to busy stations in the middle of town often have 4 escalators (2 up, 2
down) available. These still go to sleep when no-one is using them but the
light up signs indicating DOT remain illuminated so you know which actuator
plate to step on.
--
Cheers, Steve.
Change jealous to sad to reply.