For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.

wrote:
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.

That's not Ken, Oyster or a scam, that's a bus driver being an
officious prat. Report him, get a refund, and argue your case next time
something like that happens and you're in the right.

--
John Band
john at johnband dot org
www.johnband.org

wrote in message
oups.com...
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.


Remember the Oyster reader is illogical as it bleeps for both success and
failure (although it's a slightly different noise for each, and the small
LED lights either green or orange)

What did the LCD display say? It's the only way to tell if you experience
what you describe.

If you attempt to touch your oyster the second time around (or more than
twice) it will say "Passback attempted". i.e. it thinks you tried to pass
your oyster back to someone behind you and it's being used twice. If it
says that, you know it actually read properly first time around.

I've never heard of anyone in your situation, as it's always clear from the
reader what the error is!

Neil Watson wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.


Remember the Oyster reader is illogical as it bleeps for both success and
failure (although it's a slightly different noise for each, and the small
LED lights either green or orange)

What did the LCD display say? It's the only way to tell if you experience
what you describe.

If you attempt to touch your oyster the second time around (or more than
twice) it will say "Passback attempted". i.e. it thinks you tried to pass
your oyster back to someone behind you and it's being used twice. If it
says that, you know it actually read properly first time around.

I've never heard of anyone in your situation, as it's always clear from the
reader what the error is!


I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)? Although, how you could
have stopped using it (ie finished your bus journey) in those few
seconds would take a bit of explaining.

"MIG" wrote in message
oups.com...

I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)? Although, how you could
have stopped using it (ie finished your bus journey) in those few
seconds would take a bit of explaining.

The reader flags up a repeat use attempt "passback" on the same journey
only. Otherwise all sorts of problems would ensue!

Neil Watson wrote:
"MIG" wrote in message
oups.com...

I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)? Although, how you could
have stopped using it (ie finished your bus journey) in those few
seconds would take a bit of explaining.

The reader flags up a repeat use attempt "passback" on the same journey
only. Otherwise all sorts of problems would ensue!


True, but on a bus you only touch the once, so there has to be some
assumption of duration.

Unlike with a travelcard, there wouldn't be much to be gained by
passback if both touches were charged.

There's the possibility of sharing the cap, but unless they've changed
the wording, you can already take your PAYG to the cap limit and then
give it to someone else to use for free for the rest of the day.

On 18 Sep 2006 03:52:32 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


Neil Watson wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.


Remember the Oyster reader is illogical as it bleeps for both success and
failure (although it's a slightly different noise for each, and the small
LED lights either green or orange)

What did the LCD display say? It's the only way to tell if you experience
what you describe.

If you attempt to touch your oyster the second time around (or more than
twice) it will say "Passback attempted". i.e. it thinks you tried to pass
your oyster back to someone behind you and it's being used twice. If it
says that, you know it actually read properly first time around.

I've never heard of anyone in your situation, as it's always clear from the
reader what the error is!


I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)?

You have the answer in your own response - "when you weren't using
it". If you just got on the bus, or just entered the tube system, you
are "using it" until you get off or exit.

You can share a prepay Oyster card with other people but not during
the same journey.

Peter Frimberley wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 03:52:32 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


Neil Watson wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.


Remember the Oyster reader is illogical as it bleeps for both success and
failure (although it's a slightly different noise for each, and the small
LED lights either green or orange)

What did the LCD display say? It's the only way to tell if you experience
what you describe.

If you attempt to touch your oyster the second time around (or more than
twice) it will say "Passback attempted". i.e. it thinks you tried to pass
your oyster back to someone behind you and it's being used twice. If it
says that, you know it actually read properly first time around.

I've never heard of anyone in your situation, as it's always clear from the
reader what the error is!


I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)?

You have the answer in your own response - "when you weren't using
it". If you just got on the bus, or just entered the tube system, you
are "using it" until you get off or exit.

You can share a prepay Oyster card with other people but not during
the same journey.


And the system should have some assumption built in about the minimum
duration of a bus journey, but you you don't touch off a bus, so there
is no definite time when you stop using it (and can pass it to someone
else).

On 18 Sep 2006 04:41:42 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


Peter Frimberley wrote:
On 18 Sep 2006 03:52:32 -0700, "MIG"
wrote:


Neil Watson wrote:
wrote in message
oups.com...
For the second time now I've had a problem with Oyster PAYG on T4L
buses. Today I 'touched in' and the 'touch' registered with the usual
beep. But then the bus driver said that it hadn't registered and that I
had to 'touch' again - I did and it beeped a longer beep and he said
that the card was invalid. He then made me pay £1.50 for a ticket.
When I checked at Paddington Underground Oyster top-up machine the
'touch in' HAD`registered. So I got charged TWICE for the same journey.
Nice scam for T4L. Thanks Ken. Great system. CJB.


Remember the Oyster reader is illogical as it bleeps for both success and
failure (although it's a slightly different noise for each, and the small
LED lights either green or orange)

What did the LCD display say? It's the only way to tell if you experience
what you describe.

If you attempt to touch your oyster the second time around (or more than
twice) it will say "Passback attempted". i.e. it thinks you tried to pass
your oyster back to someone behind you and it's being used twice. If it
says that, you know it actually read properly first time around.

I've never heard of anyone in your situation, as it's always clear from the
reader what the error is!


I thought that someone else was allowed to use your PAYG Oyster when
you weren't using it (unlike a travelcard)?

You have the answer in your own response - "when you weren't using
it". If you just got on the bus, or just entered the tube system, you
are "using it" until you get off or exit.

You can share a prepay Oyster card with other people but not during
the same journey.


And the system should have some assumption built in about the minimum
duration of a bus journey, but you you don't touch off a bus, so there
is no definite time when you stop using it (and can pass it to someone
else).

We don't know that it doesn't have such an assumption. It may be as
little as a few minutes, just enough to prevent more than one person
travelling on the same card.

Peter Frimberley ) gurgled happily,
sounding much like they were saying :

You can share a prepay Oyster card with other people but not during
the same journey.

And the system should have some assumption built in about the minimum
duration of a bus journey, but you you don't touch off a bus, so there
is no definite time when you stop using it (and can pass it to someone
else).

We don't know that it doesn't have such an assumption. It may be as
little as a few minutes, just enough to prevent more than one person
travelling on the same card.

If it's PAYG, what's the *problem* with several people travelling on the
same card...? Isn't it absolutely the same thing as one person paying in
cash for three tickets for themselves and the two people they're travelling
with?