On Thu, 06 Aug 2015 13:55:25 +0100
Recliner wrote:
On Thu, 6 Aug 2015 04:46:19 -0700 (PDT), Northolt Park Gates
wrote:

It is probably not worth starting a service which will be disrupted by the
building of HS2.

Yes, I suppose so, though at least HS2 will now be in tunnel in the
Park Royal area, rather than taking over that old GWR Oxford line
alignment to Northolt.

If you mean that line the runs parallel to the Central line, why on earth
wouldn't they re-use that alignment instead of building a hugely expensive
tunnel?

--
Spud

On Thursday, 6 August 2015 13:55:28 UTC+1, Recliner wrote:
Yes, I suppose so, though at least HS2 will now be in tunnel in the
Park Royal area, rather than taking over that old GWR Oxford line
alignment to Northolt.

But once Crossrail and the OOC station are built, I wonder if a
possible route to Paddington with available capacity will remain?

Think laterally - what'll be at OOC station? Yup, Crossrail & a connection to LHR. Won't that be enough to attract Chiltern?. Quite probably, with no requirement for Paddington.

Also, someone up-thread suggested Risborough/Aylesbury - why not extend that northwards & eastwards when the new EastWest comes online & run to Milton Keynes or Bedford? That's my thinking.

Chris wrote:
On Thursday, 6 August 2015 13:55:28 UTC+1, Recliner wrote:
Yes, I suppose so, though at least HS2 will now be in tunnel in the
Park Royal area, rather than taking over that old GWR Oxford line
alignment to Northolt.

But once Crossrail and the OOC station are built, I wonder if a
possible route to Paddington with available capacity will remain?

Think laterally - what'll be at OOC station? Yup, Crossrail & a
connection to LHR. Won't that be enough to attract Chiltern?. Quite
probably, with no requirement for Paddington.

Yes, I did suggest upthread that OOC itself might be a useful Chiltern
destination, for both Crossrail and HS2, as well as probably the
Overground.


Also, someone up-thread suggested Risborough/Aylesbury - why not extend
that northwards & eastwards when the new EastWest comes online & run to
Milton Keynes or Bedford? That's my thinking.

There's only a single track connection from the joint line to Aylesbury and
the east-west line central section. In any case, there's a good chance that
the Tring stoppers will be moved from Euston to Crossrail, which would be a
very much better link to MK.

On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:
As most people here must know, Chiltern runs one service a day, M-F,
to Paddington. It's run mainly for maintaining driver route knowledge
for the occasions when Chiltern services are diverted to Paddington.

It's not quite a parly service, as it runs at a convenient time, five
days a week, but it's also not promoted and little used other than by
rail enthusiasts (the few passengers are all sole males with cameras).
And, yes, I was one of those this week, and here's the evidence:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/reclin...57654494380303

But it got me wondering if Chiltern could or should run more services
into Paddington? Chiltern's services are growing steadily, with 2 tph
Oxford services being added soon. The two-track route into Marylebone
is congested, as are Marylebone's six platforms. Would it be possible
to run, say, 2 tph into Paddington? There's obviously many
constraints, including:

I had thought the plan was to divert a couple of the existing services to
Oxford. The xx48 from Marylebone would be an obvious choice: it terminates
at Bicester, rather than the more natural Banbury, and doesn't connect with
anything. However the matching xx18 service which would be the other one to
send to Oxford does have a connection at Bicester North and is also
sometimes extended to Banbury or Stratford (even though it would be better
to extend the xx48).

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would be
particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could go to one
station only to find that the next train left from the other.

Roger

On Fri, 07 Aug 2015 22:03:13 +0100, Roger Lynn
wrote:

On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:
snip

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would be
particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could go to one
station only to find that the next train left from the other.

They've got things called timetables (printed or electronic form) to
cure that. People travelling from various SR stations will be fairly
used to trains leaving by more than one route.

On 07/08/2015 22:03, Roger Lynn wrote:
On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:
As most people here must know, Chiltern runs one service a day,
M-F, to Paddington. It's run mainly for maintaining driver route
knowledge for the occasions when Chiltern services are diverted to
Paddington.

It's not quite a parly service, as it runs at a convenient time,
five days a week, but it's also not promoted and little used other
than by rail enthusiasts (the few passengers are all sole males
with cameras). And, yes, I was one of those this week, and here's
the evidence:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/reclin...57654494380303

But it got me wondering if Chiltern could or should run more
services into Paddington? Chiltern's services are growing
steadily, with 2 tph Oxford services being added soon. The
two-track route into Marylebone is congested, as are Marylebone's
six platforms. Would it be possible to run, say, 2 tph into
Paddington? There's obviously many constraints, including:

I had thought the plan was to divert a couple of the existing
services to Oxford. The xx48 from Marylebone would be an obvious
choice: it terminates at Bicester, rather than the more natural
Banbury, and doesn't connect with anything. However the matching xx18
service which would be the other one to send to Oxford does have a
connection at Bicester North and is also sometimes extended to
Banbury or Stratford (even though it would be better to extend the
xx48).

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would
be particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could
go to one station only to find that the next train left from the
other.

Roger


Not a problem in Manchester, where trains to Liverpool depart from
Victoria, or from (Piccadilly + Oxford Road)

BevanPrice wrote:
On 07/08/2015 22:03, Roger Lynn wrote:
On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:
As most people here must know, Chiltern runs one service a day,
M-F, to Paddington. It's run mainly for maintaining driver route
knowledge for the occasions when Chiltern services are diverted to
Paddington.

It's not quite a parly service, as it runs at a convenient time,
five days a week, but it's also not promoted and little used other
than by rail enthusiasts (the few passengers are all sole males
with cameras). And, yes, I was one of those this week, and here's
the evidence:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/reclin...57654494380303

But it got me wondering if Chiltern could or should run more
services into Paddington? Chiltern's services are growing
steadily, with 2 tph Oxford services being added soon. The
two-track route into Marylebone is congested, as are Marylebone's
six platforms. Would it be possible to run, say, 2 tph into
Paddington? There's obviously many constraints, including:

I had thought the plan was to divert a couple of the existing
services to Oxford. The xx48 from Marylebone would be an obvious
choice: it terminates at Bicester, rather than the more natural
Banbury, and doesn't connect with anything. However the matching xx18
service which would be the other one to send to Oxford does have a
connection at Bicester North and is also sometimes extended to
Banbury or Stratford (even though it would be better to extend the
xx48).

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would
be particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could
go to one station only to find that the next train left from the
other.

Roger


Not a problem in Manchester, where trains to Liverpool depart from
Victoria, or from (Piccadilly + Oxford Road)

It's pretty standard in south London, as many stations are served by trains
from more than one of Waterloo, Victoria, Blackfriars and London Bridge.

On Fri, 7 Aug 2015 23:14:07 +0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

BevanPrice wrote:
On 07/08/2015 22:03, Roger Lynn wrote:
On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:
As most people here must know, Chiltern runs one service a day,
M-F, to Paddington. It's run mainly for maintaining driver route
knowledge for the occasions when Chiltern services are diverted to
Paddington.

It's not quite a parly service, as it runs at a convenient time,
five days a week, but it's also not promoted and little used other
than by rail enthusiasts (the few passengers are all sole males
with cameras). And, yes, I was one of those this week, and here's
the evidence:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/reclin...57654494380303

But it got me wondering if Chiltern could or should run more
services into Paddington? Chiltern's services are growing
steadily, with 2 tph Oxford services being added soon. The
two-track route into Marylebone is congested, as are Marylebone's
six platforms. Would it be possible to run, say, 2 tph into
Paddington? There's obviously many constraints, including:

I had thought the plan was to divert a couple of the existing
services to Oxford. The xx48 from Marylebone would be an obvious
choice: it terminates at Bicester, rather than the more natural
Banbury, and doesn't connect with anything. However the matching xx18
service which would be the other one to send to Oxford does have a
connection at Bicester North and is also sometimes extended to
Banbury or Stratford (even though it would be better to extend the
xx48).

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would
be particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could
go to one station only to find that the next train left from the
other.

Roger


Not a problem in Manchester, where trains to Liverpool depart from
Victoria, or from (Piccadilly + Oxford Road)

It's pretty standard in south London, as many stations are served by trains
from more than one of Waterloo, Victoria, Blackfriars and London Bridge.

Some of the stations are served in both directions as well (e.g.
Lewisham, Clapham Junction) by trains on loop routes although the
displayed destination tends to be changed during the journey thus
preventing unwanted journeys by the pretty route. North of the Thames,
trains leave Highbury and Islington (also Canonbury) for Clapham
Junction in opposite directions; some are at identical departure times
(so you can choose the wrong platform rather than the wrong station).

On 2015\08\08 00:49, Charles Ellson wrote:

North of the Thames,
trains leave Highbury and Islington (also Canonbury) for Clapham
Junction in opposite directions; some are at identical departure times
(so you can choose the wrong platform rather than the wrong station).

I was going to say it doesn't matter much, because journey times are
similar, but the Shoreditch route cuts through zone 1 and the Willesden
route stays in zone 2. They could fix the problem by usually terminating
the via Peckham trains at Dalston Junction... they appear to run ever
single one to or from Highbury, giving Croydon and New Cross the Dalston
terminators.

In article ,
(Charles Ellson) wrote:

On Fri, 7 Aug 2015 23:14:07 +0000 (UTC), Recliner
wrote:

BevanPrice wrote:
On 07/08/2015 22:03, Roger Lynn wrote:
On 05/08/15 13:48, Recliner wrote:

Having some trains going to Paddington and others to Marylebone would
be particularly awkward when travelling out from London as you could
go to one station only to find that the next train left from the
other.

Not a problem in Manchester, where trains to Liverpool depart from
Victoria, or from (Piccadilly + Oxford Road)

It's pretty standard in south London, as many stations are served by
trains from more than one of Waterloo, Victoria, Blackfriars and London
Bridge.

Some of the stations are served in both directions as well (e.g.
Lewisham, Clapham Junction) by trains on loop routes although the
displayed destination tends to be changed during the journey thus
preventing unwanted journeys by the pretty route. North of the Thames,
trains leave Highbury and Islington (also Canonbury) for Clapham
Junction in opposite directions; some are at identical departure times
(so you can choose the wrong platform rather than the wrong station).

They take pretty well the same time, don't they?

--
Colin Rosenstiel