tim... wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
So, yet another all 'business class' (closer to premium economy) service
between a secondary London airport and New York has folded:

http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...ight-canceled/

This must be at least the fourth or fifth all 'business' class service to
New York from Luton or Stansted to fail.

It's a business model that just can't work

there isn't enough customers to support 4 or 5 flights a day

and business people, mined to pay business class fares, aren't keen to fly
on an airline that has one flight a day (or less) because if it gets
cancelled they have a very expensive lost day.

The attraction with these services is that they're much cheaper than normal
business class flights. But there's really no other benefit. They're not as
good as proper business class, no frequent flyer programme, only one route,
with only one flight a day, etc.

But it also shows that the business market from London is primarily from
Heathrow, with a limited amount from Gatwick.

On 20.09.16 16:55, Recliner wrote:
tim... wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
So, yet another all 'business class' (closer to premium economy) service
between a secondary London airport and New York has folded:

http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...ight-canceled/

This must be at least the fourth or fifth all 'business' class service to
New York from Luton or Stansted to fail.

It's a business model that just can't work

there isn't enough customers to support 4 or 5 flights a day

and business people, mined to pay business class fares, aren't keen to fly
on an airline that has one flight a day (or less) because if it gets
cancelled they have a very expensive lost day.

The attraction with these services is that they're much cheaper than normal
business class flights. But there's really no other benefit. They're not as
good as proper business class, no frequent flyer programme, only one route,
with only one flight a day, etc.

But it also shows that the business market from London is primarily from
Heathrow, with a limited amount from Gatwick.

Well, that route is sort of going from Q to Z, when indeed you needed A
to B. Luton is a ways out, and Newark is not the closest to Manhattan.

Well, that route is sort of going from Q to Z, when indeed you needed A
to B. Luton is a ways out, and Newark is not the closest to Manhattan.

Actually, Newark airport is closer to midtown than JFK is, and the bus
and train options work fine. La Guardia is even closer but it doesn't
handle international flights other than precleared ones from nearby
Canada.

I think the problem with these airlines is that they're chasing the
market of people who want a better than coach seat on an international
flight, but fly so infrequently that they don't care about the lack of
onwards connections or a frequent flyer program. That doesn't sound
like a very big market.

Also, if you want something better than coach on the relatively short
flights from the UK to the eastern US or Canada, several airlines
have a premium coach that is OK.

wrote:
On 20.09.16 16:55, Recliner wrote:
tim... wrote:

"Recliner" wrote in message
...
So, yet another all 'business class' (closer to premium economy) service
between a secondary London airport and New York has folded:

http://onemileatatime.boardingarea.c...ight-canceled/

This must be at least the fourth or fifth all 'business' class service to
New York from Luton or Stansted to fail.

It's a business model that just can't work

there isn't enough customers to support 4 or 5 flights a day

and business people, mined to pay business class fares, aren't keen to fly
on an airline that has one flight a day (or less) because if it gets
cancelled they have a very expensive lost day.

The attraction with these services is that they're much cheaper than normal
business class flights. But there's really no other benefit. They're not as
good as proper business class, no frequent flyer programme, only one route,
with only one flight a day, etc.

But it also shows that the business market from London is primarily from
Heathrow, with a limited amount from Gatwick.

Well, that route is sort of going from Q to Z, when indeed you needed A
to B. Luton is a ways out, and Newark is not the closest to Manhattan.

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.

On 20/09/2016 23:07, Recliner wrote:

wrote:

Well, that route is sort of going from Q to Z, when indeed you needed A
to B. Luton is a ways out, and Newark is not the closest to Manhattan.

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.


Indeed. A friend who does this with some regularity prefers a Newark
arrival over JFK.

On 2016-09-20 22:11:44 +0000, Mizter T said:

Indeed. A friend who does this with some regularity prefers a Newark
arrival over JFK.

And Luton is better connected to the City than Heathrow. Though the
perception of "rubbish charter airport" is hard to kill, particularly
at present as due to expansion work it is quite rubbish (be nice when
it's done though).

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On 20.09.16 23:11, Mizter T wrote:

On 20/09/2016 23:07, Recliner wrote:

wrote:

Well, that route is sort of going from Q to Z, when indeed you needed A
to B. Luton is a ways out, and Newark is not the closest to Manhattan.

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.


Indeed. A friend who does this with some regularity prefers a Newark
arrival over JFK.
I stand corrected.

On 2016-09-20 22:07:54 +0000, Recliner said:

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.

A lot of people are put off Luton by the bus connection, sufficiently
so that LBC are looking at building some kind of rail shuttle thing.
Which is actually counterintuitive, as to some gates at Gatwick you
walk almost as far as the bus goes (well, probably not quite, but it
feels like it), there's the inter-terminal train, and at Luton bags are
returned far, far quicker than any other significantly sized airport
(the reason for which is the simplicity of the baggage system - it just
involves two blokes and a flatbed Transit).

Neil
--
Neil Williams
Put my first name before the @ to reply.

On Wed, 21 Sep 2016 08:35:52 +0100
Neil Williams wrote:
On 2016-09-20 22:07:54 +0000, Recliner said:

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.

A lot of people are put off Luton by the bus connection, sufficiently
so that LBC are looking at building some kind of rail shuttle thing.

LBC? Wow, Global Radio really are expanding their remit

Not sure how a rail shuttle would work unless its a cog railway given how
much higher the airport is compared to the MML.

feels like it), there's the inter-terminal train, and at Luton bags are
returned far, far quicker than any other significantly sized airport
(the reason for which is the simplicity of the baggage system - it just
involves two blokes and a flatbed Transit).

Last time I used Luton was 2013 and it seemed pretty well managed on the
way out. On the way back was a different story however - a mile long walk to
security up and down stairs from the gate, followed by no information at
baggage collection for about 15 mins followed by bags coming out in dribs and
drabs for the next 20 mins. And this IIRC was in April, hardly peak holiday
season.

--
Spud

wrote:
On Wed, 21 Sep 2016 08:35:52 +0100
Neil Williams wrote:
On 2016-09-20 22:07:54 +0000, Recliner said:

Huh? Luton is hardly any further out than Gatwick, and Newark is the
nearest trans-Atlantic airport to Manhattan.

A lot of people are put off Luton by the bus connection, sufficiently
so that LBC are looking at building some kind of rail shuttle thing.

LBC? Wow, Global Radio really are expanding their remit

Not sure how a rail shuttle would work unless its a cog railway given how
much higher the airport is compared to the MML.

https://www.theguardian.com/business...rack-rail-link