On 02.04.17 16:52, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\04\02 15:57, Recliner wrote:
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\04\02 15:28, Recliner wrote:
David Walters wrote:
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 10:31:43 +0100, Clive Page wrote:
My own suggestion for a transport oddity would be London's only
funicular railway on the eastern side of the northern bank of the wobbly
(Millennium) bridge. One could call it a sloping lift, but it really is
a cable-hauled funicular, just a very short one. Best of all, it's free.

There is one at Greenford Station too.


That's not a funicular, just an inclined lift.


Having used them both, I can see no difference, except the Greenford one
is indoors, and the Blackfriars one is a shoddy embarrassment.

Shouldn't a funicular railway have two cars that (approximately) balance
each other, one going up while the other descends?

They both have counterweights which do that, between the tracks.

It's the yellow thing in Greenford.
https://youtu.be/sxScXvX1Dv4?t=1m21s

Light-coloured thing in Blackfriars
https://youtu.be/b72PyyrFeYI?t=17s

Yes, just like any lift. But I've always thought a funicular needed to have
two balanced cars, not just one car and a counterweight.

The inclined lift at Greenford doesn't purport to be anything other than a
normal lift, which just happens to run on an angled track.


They have them in New York as well as in Helsinki.

On 02.04.17 15:51, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\04\02 15:28, Recliner wrote:
David Walters wrote:
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 10:31:43 +0100, Clive Page wrote:
My own suggestion for a transport oddity would be London's only
funicular railway on the eastern side of the northern bank of the
wobbly
(Millennium) bridge. One could call it a sloping lift, but it
really is
a cable-hauled funicular, just a very short one. Best of all, it's
free.

There is one at Greenford Station too.


That's not a funicular, just an inclined lift.


Having used them both, I can see no difference, except the Greenford one
is indoors, and the Blackfriars one is a shoddy embarrassment.

Are you referring to the one at Millennium Bridge?

On 02.04.17 13:21, David Walters wrote:
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 10:31:43 +0100, Clive Page wrote:
My own suggestion for a transport oddity would be London's only
funicular railway on the eastern side of the northern bank of the wobbly
(Millennium) bridge. One could call it a sloping lift, but it really is
a cable-hauled funicular, just a very short one. Best of all, it's free.

There is one at Greenford Station too.

More likely to work.

On 02.04.17 22:26, John Levine wrote:
Speaking of peculiar, London has four places where trains switch between
overhead and third rail, namely Acton Central, Mitre Bridge, Drayton
Park and Farringdon/City Thameslink. I have no idea how common
pan-up-pan-down in service is globally. The 313 trains at Drayton Park
very noticeably go though a "turn-it-off-and-turn-it-back-on-again" moment.

I don't think it's that rare. In the US, the New York MTA New Haven
line commuter rail switches at Mt Vernon

They raise the pantographs when travelling east.

Changeover was just after the junction at Woodlawn (CP 112), where the
New Haven Line diverged from the Harlem Line, but they moved further
east to the Mt. Vernon-Pelham border in 1993.

This resulted in a small part of the New Haven Line becoming 3rd rail
territory.

There was consensus that they should have left the changeover just north
of Woodlawn as part of that line goes through a cut, thus making track
maintenance and power maintenance more difficult.

and the Boston MBTA transit
blue line switches near Logan Airport.

I think that changeover on the T happens when the train is berthed at
the station, whereas trains on the New Haven do it on the fly.

For added confusion, Penn Station in New York has both third rail and
OHLE, on different services but sometimes on the same tracks.

Yes, but 3rd rail at Penn is all overriding, whereas Metro-North has
only underriding.

There is a direct connection from the New Haven line into Penn via the
Harlem River Branch, which diverges just west of New Rochelle station.
Amtrak trains are now the only trains to run over that line, though the
MTA would eventually like to see New Haven trains running along it.
One of the potential difficulties for this prospect is that M-2 and M-8
EMU trains have only underriding shoes.

Having said that, the MTA have been discussing the prospect of New Haven
Line trains running down the Harlem River Branch for at least 25 years
-- if not longer.

I sometimes think that it is just talk and that this is not likely to
happen.

On 2017\04\03 00:27, wrote:
On 02.04.17 15:51, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\04\02 15:28, Recliner wrote:
David Walters wrote:
On Sun, 2 Apr 2017 10:31:43 +0100, Clive Page wrote:
My own suggestion for a transport oddity would be London's only
funicular railway on the eastern side of the northern bank of the
wobbly
(Millennium) bridge. One could call it a sloping lift, but it
really is
a cable-hauled funicular, just a very short one. Best of all, it's
free.

There is one at Greenford Station too.


That's not a funicular, just an inclined lift.


Having used them both, I can see no difference, except the Greenford one
is indoors, and the Blackfriars one is a shoddy embarrassment.

Are you referring to the one at Millennium Bridge?

Yes, as was mentioned in the the quoted material. It's only 200m from
Blackfriars station.

and the Boston MBTA transit
blue line switches near Logan Airport.

I think that changeover on the T happens when the train is berthed at
the station, whereas trains on the New Haven do it on the fly.

It's been a while since I've taken the train from the airport but I'm
pretty sure it's on the fly.

For added confusion, Penn Station in New York has both third rail and
OHLE, on different services but sometimes on the same tracks.

Yes, but 3rd rail at Penn is all overriding, whereas Metro-North has
only underriding.

There is a direct connection from the New Haven line into Penn via the
Harlem River Branch, which diverges just west of New Rochelle station.
Amtrak trains are now the only trains to run over that line, though the
MTA would eventually like to see New Haven trains running along it.
One of the potential difficulties for this prospect is that M-2 and M-8
EMU trains have only underriding shoes.

I don't see why that's a problem, since the OHLE runs into Penn
Station and beyond. There's an occasional MTA football special from
New Haven that runs through Penn Station to Secacus for the
Meadowlands stadium. Or are you saying the shoes would do bad things
with the LIRR's third rail?

There's also the Empire Connection, the former freight-only line down
the west side of Manhattan that allows Amtrak trains from Albany to
come into Penn Station. It's mostly unelectrified but there's a
little bit of third rail at the end that lets the trains run into Penn
Station.

On 02/04/2017 18:26, wrote:

Does that mean at the time of my visit it was no longer a funicular
but a very long inclined lift but now it is a funicular again?


Given those cars seem to be articulated as well, when does a funicular
become a funicular and stop being a cable hauled railway?

In article , () wrote:

On 02.04.17 18:06, Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\04\02 17:16, Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:

Two mates commented, on different occations, that the GOBLIN train
felt different than others they had been on. I have investigated and
172 has different bogies than other Turbostars and mechanical
transmission rather than hydraulic - gear changes can be distinctly
heard as the trains accelerate and decelerate (Wikipedia). One mate
said it felt like a bus.

I wonder why they built them like that?

Speaking of peculiar, London has four places where trains switch between
overhead and third rail, namely Acton Central, Mitre Bridge, Drayton
Park and Farringdon/City Thameslink. I have no idea how common
pan-up-pan-down in service is globally. The 313 trains at Drayton Park
very noticeably go though a "turn-it-off-and-turn-it-back-on-again"
moment.

It also happens at City Thameslink northbound on 377s. I would not
call it "turn-it-off-and-turn-it-back-on-again," so much as changing
modes. It's actually not that easy to turn a train on or off.

But is it simpler than for the 319s? Their technology is closer to that of
the 313s than the 377s.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

Someone Somewhere wrote:
On 02/04/2017 18:26, wrote:

Does that mean at the time of my visit it was no longer a funicular
but a very long inclined lift but now it is a funicular again?


Given those cars seem to be articulated as well, when does a funicular
become a funicular and stop being a cable hauled railway?


The cars aren't articulated in a conventional sense. They seem to have a
variable tilt mechanism (covered by the bellows) to keep the floor
horizontal, as the angle of the funicular varies markedly. Perhaps that had
failed in the missing car, and it was off being repaired. Rather than shut
the funicular altogether, they ingeniously kept it running with just one
car, using perhaps the undercarriage of the missing car with added weights
for balance?

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 18:19:32 +0100
BirchangerKen wrote:
On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 14:09:35 +0000 (UTC), d wrote:

On Fri, 31 Mar 2017 15:04:22 +0100
Basil Jet wrote:
On 2017\03\31 12:49, Jarle Hammen Knudsen wrote:

Regarding the Overground, you should experience the peculiar DMU on
the GOBLIN before it dissapears.

There's nothing peculiar about the Goblin trains. There are quite a few
other diesel trains in London: in particular, the Uckfield trains to and
from London Bridge, which are not going to be got rid of any time soon,

Why on earth don't they just electrify that branch and be done with it. What
on earth is the logic for still running diesel to a london commuter town?

It does seem odd. I was at London Bridge quite early one morning
wanting to get to East Croydon and was surprised when a 2-car 171 was
on offer. Seems a bit provincial somehow.

Indeed. The cost of electrifying that small branch line is probably miniscule
compared to the other projects going on right now and Crowbridge and Uckfield
arn't exactly small villages so I wouldn't imagine a longer faster train
service would be welcomed.

--
Spud