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Electric black cabs
I've seen them on the streets for a while up until now from a distance. Today
I saw one up close - they're pretty big brutes. Bigger than a current diesel cab and bigger , though lower , than a range rover I suspect. I'm sure thats nice for the cabbie and the passengers but it can't help the range much dragging that much mass about. |
Electric black cabs
John Williamson wrote:
On 03/07/2018 12:42, wrote: I've seen them on the streets for a while up until now from a distance. Today I saw one up close - they're pretty big brutes. Bigger than a current diesel cab and bigger , though lower , than a range rover I suspect. I'm sure thats nice for the cabbie and the passengers but it can't help the range much dragging that much mass about. As it's a six seater, it's more of a replacement for the Mercedes van conversions than the TX4, so the passengers get the same space each if fully loaded, as there has to be space for the built in wheelchair ramp. It is also built using fibreglass panels cladding an aluminium frame, so even adding the battery weight, it weighs, according to LEVC, less than the current cabs. https://www.levc.com/technology/body-structure/ Yes, LEVC seems to have used some of the lightweight body construction techniques of sister company Lotus. And the engine comes from Volvo, another sister company. |
Electric black cabs
On 03/07/2018 16:42, Recliner wrote:
Yes, LEVC seems to have used some of the lightweight body construction techniques of sister company Lotus. And the engine comes from Volvo, another sister company. Wonders what Lode Lane in Solihull would have come up with. -- Tciao for Now! John. |
Electric black cabs
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 16:20:19 +0100
John Williamson wrote: On 03/07/2018 12:42, wrote: I've seen them on the streets for a while up until now from a distance. Today I saw one up close - they're pretty big brutes. Bigger than a current diesel cab and bigger , though lower , than a range rover I suspect. I'm sure thats nice for the cabbie and the passengers but it can't help the range much dragging that much mass about. As it's a six seater, it's more of a replacement for the Mercedes van conversions than the TX4, so the passengers get the same space each if fully loaded, as there has to be space for the built in wheelchair ramp. It is also built using fibreglass panels cladding an aluminium frame, so even adding the battery weight, it weighs, according to LEVC, less than the current cabs. https://www.levc.com/technology/body-structure/ Interesting. Browsing the site it seems these cars have a petrol engine range extender too. If they have to use that I can imagine the cabbies will be able to here the sound of the money being sucked from their wallets. Unfortunaley there are few specifics on the site and I'm not giving all my details just to download a pdf. Pity. |
Electric black cabs
On 03/07/2018 16:56, wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 16:20:19 +0100 John Williamson wrote: On 03/07/2018 12:42, wrote: I've seen them on the streets for a while up until now from a distance. Today I saw one up close - they're pretty big brutes. Bigger than a current diesel cab and bigger , though lower , than a range rover I suspect. I'm sure thats nice for the cabbie and the passengers but it can't help the range much dragging that much mass about. As it's a six seater, it's more of a replacement for the Mercedes van conversions than the TX4, so the passengers get the same space each if fully loaded, as there has to be space for the built in wheelchair ramp. It is also built using fibreglass panels cladding an aluminium frame, so even adding the battery weight, it weighs, according to LEVC, less than the current cabs. https://www.levc.com/technology/body-structure/ Interesting. Browsing the site it seems these cars have a petrol engine range extender too. If they have to use that I can imagine the cabbies will be able to here the sound of the money being sucked from their wallets. Unfortunaley there are few specifics on the site and I'm not giving all my details just to download a pdf. Pity. I do wonder as and when we move to primarily electric vehicles whether that will change the desirability of a large chunk of London housing which is close to major roads - if the noise reduces dramatically and the pollution pretty much disappears... |
Electric black cabs
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 17:28:16 +0100
Someone Somewhere wrote: On 03/07/2018 16:56, wrote: Interesting. Browsing the site it seems these cars have a petrol engine range extender too. If they have to use that I can imagine the cabbies will be able to here the sound of the money being sucked from their wallets. Unfortunaley there are few specifics on the site and I'm not giving all my details just to download a pdf. Pity. I do wonder as and when we move to primarily electric vehicles whether that will change the desirability of a large chunk of London housing which is close to major roads - if the noise reduces dramatically and the pollution pretty much disappears... I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. |
Electric black cabs
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Electric black cabs
On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote:
On Tue, 3 Jul 2018 17:28:16 +0100 Someone Somewhere wrote: On 03/07/2018 16:56, wrote: Interesting. Browsing the site it seems these cars have a petrol engine range extender too. If they have to use that I can imagine the cabbies will be able to here the sound of the money being sucked from their wallets. Unfortunaley there are few specifics on the site and I'm not giving all my details just to download a pdf. Pity. I do wonder as and when we move to primarily electric vehicles whether that will change the desirability of a large chunk of London housing which is close to major roads - if the noise reduces dramatically and the pollution pretty much disappears... I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 10:41:36 +0100
John Williamson wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. In a number of residential areas, they are now installing kerbside fast chargers for residents to use. The obvious problem with those is some kids coming along late at night and finding it hilarious to unplug all the cars in a road so no one has charge in the morning. Unless they factor in the human element with secure locking systems it just won't work. to ensure they can get a charge (Unless they are Tesla drivers, in which case, they can only use Tesla chargers...(Are Tesla the Apple of the electric car world?)). Their car interiors certainly give that impression. All a bit minimalist with a nice looking but not very usable dashboard. Putting every single function into a touchscreen is just idiotic - I don't want to have to pull over just to change the feckin aircon setting, never mind the radio. |
Electric black cabs
On Tue, Jul 03, 2018 at 05:28:16PM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote:
I do wonder as and when we move to primarily electric vehicles whether that will change the desirability of a large chunk of London housing which is close to major roads - if the noise reduces dramatically and the pollution pretty much disappears... See the chart on page 8 of this: http://www.ukna.org.uk/uploads/4/1/4...ffic_noise.pdf In summary, at 30mph and higher most traffic noise is not coming from the engine. For newer vehicles (including internal combustion vehicles, not just electrics) tyre noise predominates at lower speeds. -- David Cantrell | Minister for Arbitrary Justice I think the most difficult moment that anyone could face is seeing their domestic servants, whether maid or drivers, run away -- Abdul Rahman Al-Sheikh, writing on 25 Jan 2004 at http://www.arabnews.com/node/243486 |
Electric black cabs
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Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 12:16:39 +0100
Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 09:07:25 on Wed, 4 Jul 2018, remarked: Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway Nor for many of them, a mains supply rated at 60A+ to feed a charger, if more than about one in ten houses has such a charger. and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. You appear to made a significant lifestyle choice in the characteristics of your residence. Eh? With houses you buy what you can afford, which isn't necessarily the ideal. If I could have afforded a 5 bed in Esher I'd have bought one. |
Electric black cabs
On 04/07/2018 12:16, Roland Perry wrote:
You appear to made a significant lifestyle choice in the characteristics of your residence. Such as not earning enough, you mean? In Central London, unless you have a million or more to spare, all you get is a flat or terraced house, and while there may be a car park under the block, installing a charger in "your" parking slot is likely to be forbidden. Of course, housing is cheaper in Birmingham or Manchester, but then again, wages are much lower, so most of us will have the same problem there. -- Tciao for Now! John. |
Electric black cabs
John Williamson wrote:
On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. In a number of residential areas, they are now installing kerbside fast chargers for residents to use. The other side of it is that where there used to be a single charging system, with connectors for all cars available and a single payment method, which was academic, as they were mostly free, increased popularity has led to queueing for charging points, and a number of incompatible systems to pay for the charge, with Visa not being an option, so electric car drivers now need to have a number of accounts to ensure they can get a charge (Unless they are Tesla drivers, in which case, they can only use Tesla chargers...(Are Tesla the Apple of the electric car world?)). That’s what Tesla wants to be, but there’s one minor problem: while Apple is hugely profitable and generates billions in free cash, Tesla is hugely loss-making, and consumes billions of cash. Apple outsources its manufacturing to highly competent low cost suppliers in Asia; Tesla makes its cars itself, very inefficiently, in expensive California. A number of major manufacturers have now formed a consortium to roll out a standard, high speed charging network. Most EVs are likely to be compatible with it. https://qz.com/1119770/german-carmakers-and-ford-launch-ionity-joint-venture-to-set-up-a-european-network-of-ultra-fast-ev-charging-stations/ http://www.21stcentech.com/shell-acquires-ev-charging-provider-joins-car-consortium-build-ev-station-network-europe/ http://nissaninsider.co.uk/nissan-leading-consortium-planning-network-of-rapid-chargers/ |
Electric black cabs
wrote:
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 10:41:36 +0100 John Williamson wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. In a number of residential areas, they are now installing kerbside fast chargers for residents to use. The obvious problem with those is some kids coming along late at night and finding it hilarious to unplug all the cars in a road so no one has charge in the morning. Unless they factor in the human element with secure locking systems it just won't work. to ensure they can get a charge (Unless they are Tesla drivers, in which case, they can only use Tesla chargers...(Are Tesla the Apple of the electric car world?)). Their car interiors certainly give that impression. All a bit minimalist with a nice looking but not very usable dashboard. Putting every single function into a touchscreen is just idiotic - I don't want to have to pull over just to change the feckin aircon setting, never mind the radio. That's only the "low cost" [ie, not really] Model 3. |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 09:07:25 +0000 (UTC), wrote:
Seems to me the range and performance of electric vehicles is now good enough for most people. The problem is charging. Along with probably the majority of people in this country I don't have a driveway and trailing a cable out into the street across the pavement simply isn't an option, nor is sitting at a service station for 2 hours. The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) or other off street parking (26%). https://assets.publishing.service.go...48/2173483.pdf English Housing Survey HOMES 2010 2.33 I agree it's a problem for a third of homes though. What I haven't seen is the figures further broken down by car ownership. 23% of households don't have cars which might overlap with the 34% without off-road parking. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 12:37:52 on Wed, 4 Jul
2018, John Williamson remarked: You appear to made a significant lifestyle choice in the characteristics of your residence. Such as not earning enough, you mean? In Central London, unless you have a million or more to spare, all you get is a flat or terraced house, and while there may be a car park under the block, installing a charger in "your" parking slot is likely to be forbidden. Of course, housing is cheaper in Birmingham or Manchester, but then again, wages are much lower, so most of us will have the same problem there. There's plenty of places in between, where people have made the lifestyle choice of a reasonable house, plus perhaps a 1hr each way commute to London. -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 12:37:52 +0100, John Williamson wrote:
In Central London, unless you have a million or more to spare, all you get is a flat or terraced house, and while there may be a car park under the block, installing a charger in "your" parking slot is likely to be forbidden. That will change. Property management companies will soon spot the opportunity to install one using their approved installers at a healthy margin and then bill you for the additional electricity supply too. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 17:34:43 on
Wed, 4 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: In Central London, unless you have a million or more to spare, all you get is a flat or terraced house, and while there may be a car park under the block, installing a charger in "your" parking slot is likely to be forbidden. That will change. Property management companies will soon spot the opportunity to install one using their approved installers at a healthy margin and then bill you for the additional electricity supply too. What ?!?! The electricity to charge an electric car isn't free? Another myth exploded. -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 17:26:50 on
Wed, 4 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) Of which perhaps a half are too narrow to accommodate a car with side-impact doors, and most of the rest are used as a shed. -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 17:29:47 +0100
Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 12:37:52 on Wed, 4 Jul 2018, John Williamson remarked: You appear to made a significant lifestyle choice in the characteristics of your residence. Such as not earning enough, you mean? In Central London, unless you have a million or more to spare, all you get is a flat or terraced house, and while there may be a car park under the block, installing a charger in "your" parking slot is likely to be forbidden. Of course, housing is cheaper in Birmingham or Manchester, but then again, wages are much lower, so most of us will have the same problem there. There's plenty of places in between, where people have made the lifestyle choice of a reasonable house, plus perhaps a 1hr each way commute to London. Or at least thats what they thought. Then they started using Thameslink. |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, 4 Jul 2018 18:23:08 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 17:26:50 on Wed, 4 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) Of which perhaps a half are too narrow to accommodate a car with side-impact doors, and most of the rest are used as a shed. There is often hard standing in front of the garage so even if the car isn't under cover it is off the street and can be charged. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 11:26:13 on
Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) Of which perhaps a half are too narrow to accommodate a car with side-impact doors, and most of the rest are used as a shed. There is often hard standing in front of the garage so even if the car isn't under cover it is off the street and can be charged. That depends when the house was constructed. There was a trend perhaps 10-15 years ago for planners to restrict the hard-standing to less than a car-length (generally by having really short front 'gardens') in order to dissuade people from multiple car ownership. And didn't that work out well? -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 11:49:27 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:26:13 on Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) Of which perhaps a half are too narrow to accommodate a car with side-impact doors, and most of the rest are used as a shed. There is often hard standing in front of the garage so even if the car isn't under cover it is off the street and can be charged. That depends when the house was constructed. There was a trend perhaps 10-15 years ago for planners to restrict the hard-standing to less than a car-length (generally by having really short front 'gardens') There are also semi-detached houses that share a drive with the unattached next door, have garages behind the house and the gap between the houses is too narrow and lots of other examples which will be awkward or impossible for an EV charger to be be usable but it's probably still possible to install an EV charger at the majority of homes. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 12:49:54 on
Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 11:49:27 +0100, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 11:26:13 on Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: The majority of homes (in England) have a garage (40%) Of which perhaps a half are too narrow to accommodate a car with side-impact doors, and most of the rest are used as a shed. There is often hard standing in front of the garage so even if the car isn't under cover it is off the street and can be charged. That depends when the house was constructed. There was a trend perhaps 10-15 years ago for planners to restrict the hard-standing to less than a car-length (generally by having really short front 'gardens') There are also semi-detached houses that share a drive with the unattached next door, have garages behind the house and the gap between the houses is too narrow and lots of other examples which will be awkward or impossible for an EV charger to be be usable but it's probably still possible to install an EV charger at the majority of homes. In fact "installing chargers" isn't the main problem. It's upgrading the local electricity supply infrastructure to be able to cope with the extra load (even assuming central generating has the capacity). -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 13:38:09 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
In fact "installing chargers" isn't the main problem. boltar stated "the majority of people in this country ... don't have a driveway" which is what I was questioning. It's upgrading the local electricity supply infrastructure to be able to cope with the extra load (even assuming central generating has the capacity). I don't really know about that. I've seen some people claim smart chargers which know how busy the local grid is will save the day. If I had an EV I'd plug it in almost every time I parked at home but it wouldn't need anything like a full charge most of the time. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 14:35:10 on
Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 13:38:09 +0100, Roland Perry wrote: In fact "installing chargers" isn't the main problem. boltar stated "the majority of people in this country ... don't have a driveway" which is what I was questioning. Neither garages nor "other off street parking" equate to "driveways". Houses (and increasing so in new developments) have garages in blocks some distance away. Again, often due to planning fashion, trying to hide them away from view. Or older properties with garages at the end of their garden reached by a narrow lane down the backs of the houses. A bit of everything here https://goo.gl/maps/Wnf3zaaVXW82 including houses with no front drives on the road, a block of garages at the end, and round the corner to the right a row of maisonettes towards the lake, with only pedestrian access. It's upgrading the local electricity supply infrastructure to be able to cope with the extra load (even assuming central generating has the capacity). I don't really know about that. I've seen some people claim smart chargers which know how busy the local grid is will save the day. If I had an EV I'd plug it in almost every time I parked at home but it wouldn't need anything like a full charge most of the time. The National Grid has done extensive studies of this and has concluded there are many homes which have little prospect of supporting EV charging in the foreseeable future because the local supply is only sized at about 2kW per property (and most of that will be used up by existing consumption patterns). They have predicted that overall generating and supply capacity would be saturated at about 20% EV penetration, and that's if they spend the next decade putting some remediation measures in place. And if every possible smart/off-peak etc tuning is done. -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On 05/07/2018 14:35, David Walters wrote:
I don't really know about that. I've seen some people claim smart chargers which know how busy the local grid is will save the day. If I had an EV I'd plug it in almost every time I parked at home but it wouldn't need anything like a full charge most of the time. Although if the Powers That Be have their way, if it had charge in it when you plugged it in, it would be used as reserve grid capacity for any peaks, and so would need something approaching a full recharge before you disconnected it. Sort of a mobile version of the Tesla Power Wall. Admittedly, this charge could be done off peak, but it could be a pain if you need the car late at night before it had time to refill itself. -- Tciao for Now! John. |
Electric black cabs
On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 15:06:50 +0100, Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 14:35:10 on Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 13:38:09 +0100, Roland Perry wrote: In fact "installing chargers" isn't the main problem. boltar stated "the majority of people in this country ... don't have a driveway" which is what I was questioning. Neither garages nor "other off street parking" equate to "driveways". Houses (and increasing so in new developments) have garages in blocks some distance away. Again, often due to planning fashion, trying to hide them away from view. Or older properties with garages at the end of their garden reached by a narrow lane down the backs of the houses. I think we should agree to disagree on how difficult this will be. I know people who have installed EV chargers in places that weren't next to their home and it was complicated but achievable and they were the first to do it. I think it will get easier, there will be local installers to take away the hassle etc. It's upgrading the local electricity supply infrastructure to be able to cope with the extra load (even assuming central generating has the capacity). I don't really know about that. I've seen some people claim smart chargers which know how busy the local grid is will save the day. If I had an EV I'd plug it in almost every time I parked at home but it wouldn't need anything like a full charge most of the time. The National Grid has done extensive studies of this and has concluded there are many homes which have little prospect of supporting EV charging in the foreseeable future because the local supply is only sized at about 2kW per property (and most of that will be used up by existing consumption patterns). They have predicted that overall generating and supply capacity would be saturated at about 20% EV penetration, and that's if they spend the next decade putting some remediation measures in place. And if every possible smart/off-peak etc tuning is done. I can't find that study, do you have a link to it? I found https://www.nationalgrid.com/uk/arti...ams-future-evs which is more than a little vague. |
Electric black cabs
In message , at 16:31:03 on
Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 15:06:50 +0100, Roland Perry wrote: In message , at 14:35:10 on Thu, 5 Jul 2018, David Walters remarked: On Thu, 5 Jul 2018 13:38:09 +0100, Roland Perry wrote: In fact "installing chargers" isn't the main problem. boltar stated "the majority of people in this country ... don't have a driveway" which is what I was questioning. Neither garages nor "other off street parking" equate to "driveways". Houses (and increasing so in new developments) have garages in blocks some distance away. Again, often due to planning fashion, trying to hide them away from view. Or older properties with garages at the end of their garden reached by a narrow lane down the backs of the houses. I think we should agree to disagree on how difficult this will be. I know people who have installed EV chargers in places that weren't next to their home and it was complicated but achievable and they were the first to do it. Early adopters will pay vastly more than the economic payback for fashion statements like that. I think it will get easier, there will be local installers to take away the hassle etc. Digging 2ft deep trenches in the road (there's one near me this week for a brown-field new house) is neither trivial nor cheap. And as I've said, there's little point in connecting yourself to a local distribution network that's simply not sized to accommodate EV chargers. It's upgrading the local electricity supply infrastructure to be able to cope with the extra load (even assuming central generating has the capacity). I don't really know about that. I've seen some people claim smart chargers which know how busy the local grid is will save the day. If I had an EV I'd plug it in almost every time I parked at home but it wouldn't need anything like a full charge most of the time. The National Grid has done extensive studies of this and has concluded there are many homes which have little prospect of supporting EV charging in the foreseeable future because the local supply is only sized at about 2kW per property (and most of that will be used up by existing consumption patterns). They have predicted that overall generating and supply capacity would be saturated at about 20% EV penetration, and that's if they spend the next decade putting some remediation measures in place. And if every possible smart/off-peak etc tuning is done. I can't find that study, do you have a link to it? I found https://www.nationalgrid.com/uk/arti...ams-future-evs which is more than a little vague. Try "Electric vehicles, energy demand, future energy scenarios" -- Roland Perry |
Electric black cabs
On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote:
On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. -- David Cantrell | Nth greatest programmer in the world What is the difference between hearing aliens through the fillings in your teeth and hearing Jesus in your heart? |
Electric black cabs
On 06/07/2018 13:34, David Cantrell wrote:
On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. Please cite evidence because this is just not my experience for the large majority of roads in London that I travel on and/or have seen. Yes - sections of arterial road and the north circular etc may well do, but that's not the vast majority of London, and I would challenge anyone outside of those roads to even do 15 miles in an hour, let alone 30. |
Electric black cabs
On 06/07/2018 13:34, David Cantrell wrote:
On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. Which, presumably, explains why the average speed of traffic in London is about 8mph. -- Graeme Wall This account not read. |
Electric black cabs
Graeme Wall wrote:
On 06/07/2018 13:34, David Cantrell wrote: On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. Which, presumably, explains why the average speed of traffic in London is about 8mph. I suspect different definitions of “London” are being used. I would guess the 8 mph is central London, which is not where the majority of “Londoners” live. Robin |
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Electric black cabs
On 06/07/2018 13:34, David Cantrell wrote:
On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. On the major arterial routes, outside the rush hour, you may be right. During the rush hour, average speed from Heathrow to Hyde Park corner can take well over an hour, for an average speed of 10 mph. Since Boris gave us the Cycle Superhighways, one coach company based near Tower Bridge has seen a reduction in average speeds of their coaches from 11 mph to 5.5 mph on all routes. According to TfL figures, on the cycle superhighway from the Tower to Westminster, journey times for motor vehicles have increased by 6 minutes on average , and for cyclists by a minute or so. (They have also massively increased on the Highway, due to the choke point introduced at the Tower of London.) -- Tciao for Now! John. |
Electric black cabs
On Sat, 7 Jul 2018 07:00:14 +0100
John Williamson wrote: Since Boris gave us the Cycle Superhighways, one coach company based near Tower Bridge has seen a reduction in average speeds of their coaches from 11 mph to 5.5 mph on all routes. According to TfL figures, on the cycle superhighway from the Tower to Westminster, journey times for motor vehicles have increased by 6 minutes on average , and for cyclists by a minute or so. (They have also massively increased on the Highway, due to the choke point introduced at the Tower of London.) Which they almost certainly knew would happen beforehand. IMO the cycle highway was simply a convenient cover for restricting traffic flow to try and keep it out of central london. |
Electric black cabs
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Electric black cabs
On 07/07/2018 07:00, John Williamson wrote:
On 06/07/2018 13:34, David Cantrell wrote: On Wed, Jul 04, 2018 at 10:49:07AM +0100, Someone Somewhere wrote: On 04/07/2018 10:07, wrote: I can't remember the exact speed, but at something very roughly around 30mph most vehicle noises comes from the tyres anyway so on high speed roads it won't make much difference noise wise. On rows with slow moving traffic OTOH it could improve residents lives immensely. So, London then? Traffic flows just fine in the vast majority of London, where the vast majority of Londoners live, at about 30mph. On the major arterial routes, outside the rush hour, you may be right. During the rush hour, average speed from Heathrow to Hyde Park corner can take well over an hour, for an average speed of 10 mph. Since Boris gave us the Cycle Superhighways, one coach company based near Tower Bridge has seen a reduction in average speeds of their coaches from 11 mph to 5.5 mph on all routes. According to TfL figures, on the cycle superhighway from the Tower to Westminster, journey times for motor vehicles have increased by 6 minutes on average , and for cyclists by a minute or so. (They have also massively* increased on the Highway, due to the choke point introduced at the Tower of London.) Which has also massively increased rat running on local residential streets, increasing pollution for people who didn't suffer massively from it before. Nice one TfL. |
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