Roland Perry wrote:
In message

, at 09:07:00 on Tue, 26 Mar 2019, Jeremy Double
remarked:

There's probably around a thousand trains without toilets in and around
London.

I know but it's becoming obvious that this is unsatisfactory.

I’m not sure where you’d put toilets on tube stock without
obstructing the
emergency exit to the next carriage; as you can’t walk through the train,
would you want a toilet in each carriage?

The point is made in the RAIB report that in the event of a train being
unable to move, underground trains behind it are held at stations, so the
problem that arose at Lewisham wouldn’t arise. This seems a very
reasonable approach on a metro-style railway where the trains are not
provided with toilets.

That still leaves the train which is 'broken down' in the tunnel, and I
don't believe the minimum block length on the Underground is fully from
one station to the next, so there could be a train in the tunnel behind
a broken down one.

Actually it's worse than that, because if a train manages to limp to a
station, or breaks down at a station, there's almost inevitably a least
one train at a stand in the tunnel behind it.

Yes, that's probably true on the busier lines with trains every two
minutes.

I think the train behind is then instructed to proceed slowly and couple to
the stalled train ahead.

Alternatively, it can be instructed to reverse to the previous station. If
the platform is already occupied, the reversing train will either couple up
to it, or the other train will also reverse a short distance, so that one
passenger door of the first train can get to the platform.

Obviously, this only happens once they have given up on moving the stalled
train any time soon.

On Tue 26/03/2019 10:19, Recliner wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message

, at 09:07:00 on Tue, 26 Mar 2019, Jeremy Double
remarked:

There's probably around a thousand trains without toilets in and around
London.

I know but it's becoming obvious that this is unsatisfactory.

I’m not sure where you’d put toilets on tube stock without
obstructing the
emergency exit to the next carriage; as you can’t walk through the train,
would you want a toilet in each carriage?

The point is made in the RAIB report that in the event of a train being
unable to move, underground trains behind it are held at stations, so the
problem that arose at Lewisham wouldn’t arise. This seems a very
reasonable approach on a metro-style railway where the trains are not
provided with toilets.

There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

On Tue, 26 Mar 2019 17:26:06 +0000, MissRiaElaine wrote:
On Tue 26/03/2019 10:19, Recliner wrote:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message

, at 09:07:00 on Tue, 26 Mar 2019, Jeremy Double
remarked:

There's probably around a thousand trains without toilets in and around
London.

I know but it's becoming obvious that this is unsatisfactory.

I’m not sure where you’d put toilets on tube stock without
obstructing the
emergency exit to the next carriage; as you can’t walk through the train,
would you want a toilet in each carriage?

The point is made in the RAIB report that in the event of a train being
unable to move, underground trains behind it are held at stations, so the
problem that arose at Lewisham wouldn’t arise. This seems a very
reasonable approach on a metro-style railway where the trains are not
provided with toilets.

There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

There are quite a few. On your journey 8 of the 12 stations travelled
through have toilets. There are fewer toilets on the deep bored sections.

http://content.tfl.gov.uk/toilets-map.pdf

On 27/03/2019 09:14, David Walters wrote:

There are quite a few. On your journey 8 of the 12 stations travelled
through have toilets. There are fewer toilets on the deep bored sections.


Any chance the SuperSewer will improve this situation?

On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 09:22:33 +0000, Someone Somewhere
wrote:

On 27/03/2019 09:14, David Walters wrote:

There are quite a few. On your journey 8 of the 12 stations travelled
through have toilets. There are fewer toilets on the deep bored sections.


Any chance the SuperSewer will improve this situation?

It could produce some spectacular backing up.

On 27/03/2019 18:51, Charles Ellson wrote:
On Wed, 27 Mar 2019 09:22:33 +0000, Someone Somewhere
wrote:

On 27/03/2019 09:14, David Walters wrote:

There are quite a few. On your journey 8 of the 12 stations travelled
through have toilets. There are fewer toilets on the deep bored sections.


Any chance the SuperSewer will improve this situation?

It could produce some spectacular backing up.

I was more suggesting (although half joking) that given the super sewer
will somewhat guarantee for the first time that the sewer was lower than
the drains in even deep level tubes it might make installing bogs easier.

But then again, toilets don't drive revenue so adding new ones is
presumably off the bottom of whatever today's priority list is.

In article ,
MissRiaElaine wrote:
There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

More than you'd think:

http://content.tfl.gov.uk/toilets-map.pdf

--
Natalie Amery. +---------+ ________________ _________________
##### |Cambridge| |# [] ## ## [] # | | # [] ## ## [] #|
#######__o +-+-----+-+ | [] [] | | [] [] |
#######'/ ----------+-----+--------- \-oo----------oo-/+\-oo----------oo-/

In message , at 16:51:27 on Wed,
27 Mar 2019, Natalie Amery remarked:

There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

More than you'd think:

http://content.tfl.gov.uk/toilets-map.pdf

That's not toilets at TfL stations, it's largely toilets somewhere near
TfL stations. The clue being the black lozenge "outside the gateline".

With a side order of "Dagger": not managed by TfL.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:51:27 on Wed,
27 Mar 2019, Natalie Amery remarked:

There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

More than you'd think:

http://content.tfl.gov.uk/toilets-map.pdf

That's not toilets at TfL stations, it's largely toilets somewhere near
TfL stations. The clue being the black lozenge "outside the gateline".

With a side order of "Dagger": not managed by TfL.

Only the dagger means it’s not toilets at TfL stations (and not necessarily
even then; red-with-dagger ie not TfL managed but still inside the gateline
features on the map).

Most stations on the map aren’t marked with the dagger.

If you wish to claim that toilets outside the gateline, but in the station
building and managed by the station operator aren’t "at" the station, then
surely many NR stations with toilets also "don’t" have them (eg Paddington,
Bristol Parkway, Swansea).


Anna Noyd-Dryver

In message , at 11:24:52 on Thu, 28 Mar
2019, Anna Noyd-Dryver remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 16:51:27 on Wed,
27 Mar 2019, Natalie Amery remarked:

There aren't all that many Underground stations with public toilets,
either. The only one that springs to mind immediately is Barons Court,
we'd just travelled from Hounslow West and my other half was absolutely
bursting by the time we got there.

More than you'd think:

http://content.tfl.gov.uk/toilets-map.pdf

That's not toilets at TfL stations, it's largely toilets somewhere near
TfL stations. The clue being the black lozenge "outside the gateline".

With a side order of "Dagger": not managed by TfL.

Only the dagger means it’s not toilets at TfL stations (and not necessarily
even then; red-with-dagger ie not TfL managed but still inside the gateline
features on the map).

There's three situations:

Inside the gateline (and probably inevitably managed by TfL, but
no doubt someone can find a counter-example)

Outside the gateline but managed by TfL (and probably therefore
quite close to the gateline/ticket office but no doubt someone
can find a counter-example)

Situated and managed by "someone else".

Most stations on the map aren’t marked with the dagger.

I can't see any in Z1 which aren't.

If you wish to claim that toilets outside the gateline, but in the station
building and managed by the station operator aren’t "at" the station, then
surely many NR stations with toilets also "don’t" have them (eg Paddington,
Bristol Parkway, Swansea).

"Station operator" - see above for whether that's TfL or National Rail.
So yes, a toilet at say Kings Cross sited and managed by the NR operator
(in that case Network Rail) isn't in the tube station.
--
Roland Perry