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A406 upgrades
The Transport for London business plan for 2005 - 2012 includes "Schemes to
relieve traffic congestion and improve the local environment at Coulsden, Bounds Green and Thames Road, Bexley" I think this may be the minor improvemets planned and not the D3 grade separated route. There are details of the minor improvements at http://www.londontransport.co.uk/str...20Bounds%20Gre en.pdf |
A406 upgrades
Kelly Lee wrote:
The Transport for London business plan for 2005 - 2012 includes "Schemes to relieve traffic congestion and improve the local environment at Coulsden, Bounds Green and Thames Road, Bexley" I think this may be the minor improvemets planned and not the D3 grade separated route. There are details of the minor improvements at http://www.londontransport.co.uk/str...20Bounds%20Gre en.pdf It was decided that the grade-separated route was too expensive, at a cost of £900m for all the improvements (Henleys Corner, Bounds Green, Green Lanes). So instead TfL are progressing a smaller £24m set of improvements and they'll see how it goes. -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
A406 upgrades
"Kelly Lee" wrote in message
... The Transport for London business plan for 2005 - 2012 includes "Schemes to relieve traffic congestion and improve the local environment at Coulsden, Bounds Green and Thames Road, Bexley" I think this may be the minor improvemets planned and not the D3 grade separated route. There are details of the minor improvements at http://www.londontransport.co.uk/str...20Bounds%20Gre en.pdf It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Some sections are OK (up to 5 lanes each way with underpasses and slip roads) but other sections have just one lane each way and traffic lights at busy junctions. |
A406 upgrades
"RW" wrote in message
... It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Is it? How can you justify completing the grade separation of the North Circular, when the South Circular has not a single grade separated junction and few dual carriageway sections? -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
A406 upgrades
"John Rowland" wrote in message
... "RW" wrote in message ... It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Is it? How can you justify completing the grade separation of the North Circular, when the South Circular has not a single grade separated junction and few dual carriageway sections? -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes ....because I never use the South Circular ;) |
A406 upgrades
RW wrote:
It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Some sections are OK (up to 5 lanes each way with underpasses and slip roads) but other sections have just one lane each way and traffic lights at busy junctions. It is long overdue. The frustrating thing is that most of the ground work has been done; houses have been bought and demolished and in the case of the Bounds Green - Green Lanes stretch there are already extra bridge 'arches' for the extra lanes to go. The main problem is Henlys Corner, especially westbound. To have 2 major road merge in and out like that is just ridiculous. either side is dual carriageway, surely even a basic 4 lane flyover would relieve things immensely. |
A406 upgrades
Stuart wrote:
RW wrote: It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Some sections are OK (up to 5 lanes each way with underpasses and slip roads) but other sections have just one lane each way and traffic lights at busy junctions. It is long overdue. The frustrating thing is that most of the ground work has been done; houses have been bought and demolished and in the case of the Bounds Green - Green Lanes stretch there are already extra bridge 'arches' for the extra lanes to go. The main problem is Henlys Corner, especially westbound. To have 2 major road merge in and out like that is just ridiculous. either side is dual carriageway, surely even a basic 4 lane flyover would relieve things immensely. Building a flyover harks back to the 60s when it was considered acceptable to plonk concrete megaliths in the middle of residential areas because car traffic was much more important than everything else. See the Westway. It's interesting to watch the cityscape as you're going along it, but it's probably not so nice the look out of your house at the Westway. The Government-approved scheme which was scrapped recently was to build a tunnel at Henlys Corner. Although much better for local residents than a flyover, it would have been extremely expensive and that's why the Mayor dropped it when he published his Transport Strategy in 2001. Rather than making improvements just for car users, it seems more appropriate to improve safety for motorists and pedestrians at the junction (given that the current footbridges are virtually unused as pedestrians don't like being relegated to bridges and tunnels). -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
A406 upgrades
"Stuart" wrote in message . uk... RW wrote: It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Some sections are OK (up to 5 lanes each way with underpasses and slip roads) but other sections have just one lane each way and traffic lights at busy junctions. It is long overdue. The frustrating thing is that most of the ground work has been done; houses have been bought and demolished and in the case of the Bounds Green - Green Lanes stretch there are already extra bridge 'arches' for the extra lanes to go. The main problem is Henlys Corner, especially westbound. To have 2 major road merge in and out like that is just ridiculous. either side is dual carriageway, surely even a basic 4 lane flyover would relieve things immensely. Even if all 3 of the schemes did go ahead (Bounds Green - Green Lanes, Henlys Corner and Golders Green Road) there would still not be a grade separated route from the A40 to the A406, there is an at grade signal controlled junction at IKEA (Drury Way/Brentfield Road) and there have been no plans to upgrade this. |
A406 upgrades
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
... The Government-approved scheme which was scrapped recently was to build a tunnel at Henlys Corner. Although much better for local residents than a flyover, it would have been extremely expensive and that's why the Mayor dropped it when he published his Transport Strategy in 2001. Rather than making improvements just for car users, it seems more appropriate to improve safety for motorists and pedestrians at the junction (given that the current footbridges are virtually unused as pedestrians don't like being relegated to bridges and tunnels). Where are the footbridges at Henlys? Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. It's easy - all it needs is two perpendicular bridges and one somewhat skew bridge to give both the A1 and the A406 a straight run through. All turns would be allowed, including A1 w/b to A406 e/b, which is currently banned. Land take would be small, and gradients would be easy. Whether it could cope with the traffic flows is another question. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
A406 upgrades
John Rowland wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message ... The Government-approved scheme which was scrapped recently was to build a tunnel at Henlys Corner. Although much better for local residents than a flyover, it would have been extremely expensive and that's why the Mayor dropped it when he published his Transport Strategy in 2001. Rather than making improvements just for car users, it seems more appropriate to improve safety for motorists and pedestrians at the junction (given that the current footbridges are virtually unused as pedestrians don't like being relegated to bridges and tunnels). Where are the footbridges at Henlys? Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. It's easy - all it needs is two perpendicular bridges and one somewhat skew bridge to give both the A1 and the A406 a straight run through. All turns would be allowed, including A1 w/b to A406 e/b, which is currently banned. Land take would be small, and gradients would be easy. Whether it could cope with the traffic flows is another question. Have you taken into account the topography and the geology? |
A406 upgrades
"Brimstone" wrote in message
... John Rowland wrote: Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. Have you taken into account the topography No problem, the envelope wasn't that crumpled. and the geology? No, why, should I have? I'm only talking about a few road bridges, not the Petronas Towers. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
A406 upgrades
John Rowland wrote:
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message ... The Government-approved scheme which was scrapped recently was to build a tunnel at Henlys Corner. Although much better for local residents than a flyover, it would have been extremely expensive and that's why the Mayor dropped it when he published his Transport Strategy in 2001. Rather than making improvements just for car users, it seems more appropriate to improve safety for motorists and pedestrians at the junction (given that the current footbridges are virtually unused as pedestrians don't like being relegated to bridges and tunnels). Where are the footbridges at Henlys? Sorry, it's not at Henlys Corner itself but it's included within the same scheme. It's down the road at the Brent St & Golders Green Rd crossroads. Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. It's easy - all it needs is two perpendicular bridges and one somewhat skew bridge to give both the A1 and the A406 a straight run through. All turns would be allowed, including A1 w/b to A406 e/b, which is currently banned. Land take would be small, and gradients would be easy. Whether it could cope with the traffic flows is another question. I sense problems involved with Mutton Brook which runs directly alongside the site. If you sink a foundation, won't it just fill up with water there? (Bearing in mind I know nothing about engineering). -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
A406 upgrades
"John Rowland" wrote in message ... "Brimstone" wrote in message ... John Rowland wrote: Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. Have you taken into account the topography No problem, the envelope wasn't that crumpled. and the geology? No, why, should I have? I'm only talking about a few road bridges, not the Petronas Towers. Because if the geology isn't suitable the bridge will fall down, and a lot of people will want to blame someone. |
A406 upgrades
Dave Arquati typed
Where are the footbridges at Henlys? Sorry, it's not at Henlys Corner itself but it's included within the same scheme. It's down the road at the Brent St & Golders Green Rd crossroads. 9/10 of a mile down the A406, actually. Very convenient for a pedestrian, NOT! The footbridge is on the side of the A502 I tend not to use, (west, I think) so that I have to cross it twice to use the footbridge. (Parents live south of A406 and east of A502, brother lives north of A406 and east of A502). Foot bridge entails walk about EIGHT times as long as walk across A406. (There is a subway-type crossing by the Mutton Brook about halfway between Finchley Road and Golders Green Road at Courtleigh Gardens/Bridge Lane though) Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. It's easy - all it needs is two perpendicular bridges and one somewhat skew bridge to give both the A1 and the A406 a straight run through. All turns would be allowed, including A1 w/b to A406 e/b, which is currently banned. Land take would be small, and gradients would be easy. Whether it could cope with the traffic flows is another question. I sense problems involved with Mutton Brook which runs directly alongside the site. If you sink a foundation, won't it just fill up with water there? (Bearing in mind I know nothing about engineering). The A406 is parallel to the river Brent and *never* gets flooded ;-)... -- Helen D. Vecht: Edgware. |
A406 upgrades
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
... John Rowland wrote: Where are the footbridges at Henlys? It's down the road at the Brent St & Golders Green Rd crossroads. I wouldn't call that virtually unused - there always seem to be at least one person on it. Incidentally, I have just designed a grade separated junction for Henlys on the back of an envelope. It's easy - all it needs is two perpendicular bridges and one somewhat skew bridge to give both the A1 and the A406 a straight run through. I sense problems involved with Mutton Brook which runs directly alongside the site. If you sink a foundation, won't it just fill up with water there? (Bearing in mind I know nothing about engineering). Neither do I, but if you look at the infrastructure a little further down at Brent Cross and Staples Corner, I don't see why there would be insurmountable problems. The official plan for Henlys involved two forked tunnels each about a kilometre long, so I can't see three bridges, which are in effect very short tunnels, being a show-stopper. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
A406 upgrades
"John Rowland" wrote in message ... [snip] I sense problems involved with Mutton Brook which runs directly alongside the site. If you sink a foundation, won't it just fill up with water there? (Bearing in mind I know nothing about engineering). Neither do I, but if you look at the infrastructure a little further down at Brent Cross and Staples Corner, I don't see why there would be insurmountable problems. [snip] Talking of bridges across the North Circular Rd, there's a plan, which may well happen, for part of the London Cycle Network in that area, which is well worth taking note of, even if you only walk The original planned bike route was up the Edgware Road, but that seems a dead loss. Going up the Edgware Road with a bike you can either go over the North Circular on the flyover, or round the roundabout underneath. While you get nice views from the flyovers, and surfing roundabouts is quite fun if you are a competent cyclist, nobody wants to make either of two alternatives an official bike route, except to the extent that every street and road in the area, except for the M1, automatically is an offical bike route already, just as they are official car routes as well. The new plan, devised by a friend of Helen Vecht's actually, would cross the North Circular Road a bit west of the Edgware Road, and aim at the Welsh Harp dam, to cross the Welsh Harp/River Brent on the dam. It would be pretty scenic. Besides the Welsh Harp environs there are a surprising number of other parks for the route to go through, such as Gladstone Park and Roe Green Park It looks as if the route even will be cheaper than the original plans. The bureaucrats seem to think its ok, although they don't exactly welcome it, because, from their perspective, all it does is complicate their lives, putting timetables into the wrong financial year, and suchlike. Thus a groundswell of popular support would be welcome. Jeremy Parker |
A406 upgrades
"Jeremy Parker" wrote in message
... The original planned bike route was up the Edgware Road, but that seems a dead loss. Going up the Edgware Road with a bike you can either go over under! the North Circular on the flyover, or round the roundabout underneath. The new plan, devised by a friend of Helen Vecht's actually, would cross the North Circular Road a bit west of the Edgware Road, and aim at the Welsh Harp dam, to cross the Welsh Harp/River Brent on the dam. It would be pretty scenic. Excellent! I'd love to be able to get on top of the dam. I've always thought of it as a minor tourist attraction which wasn't being exploited. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
Cycle tracks/lanes - was A406 upgrades
I'm a cyclist myself but I think far too much money and effort is being
spent on cycle lanes upon which a cyclist is hardly ever seen. The cost per cyclist per mile must be astronomical - rather like the expense involved with making all public buildings, particularly stations, wheelchair accessible. The sentiments are admirable bit the cost per actual user is out of all proportion. I do realise that what I've said is so politically incorrect that I'll probably receive all manner of abuse and I shall understand the reasons. Baz |
Cycle tracks/lanes - was A406 upgrades
Marratxi wrote:
I do realise that what I've said is so politically incorrect that I'll probably receive all manner of abuse and I shall understand the reasons. Nah, you're safe. Surely it's politically incorrect to be abusive? |
A406 upgrades
John Rowland wrote:
"RW" wrote in message ... It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Is it? How can you justify completing the grade separation of the North Circular, when the South Circular has not a single grade separated junction and few dual carriageway sections? The South Circular mostly does not even exist. That's the problem -- Nick H (UK) |
A406 upgrades
Dave Arquati wrote:
Building a flyover harks back to the 60s when it was considered acceptable to plonk concrete megaliths in the middle of residential areas because car traffic was much more important than everything else. See the Westway. It's interesting to watch the cityscape as you're going along it, but it's probably not so nice the look out of your house at the Westway. Yes, but Henleys corner doesn't have any houses on one side and perhaps those on the other side would rather that than not be able to go anywhere because teh traffic is gridlocked? |
A406 upgrades
Stuart wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote: Building a flyover harks back to the 60s when it was considered acceptable to plonk concrete megaliths in the middle of residential areas because car traffic was much more important than everything else. See the Westway. It's interesting to watch the cityscape as you're going along it, but it's probably not so nice the look out of your house at the Westway. Yes, but Henleys corner doesn't have any houses on one side and perhaps those on the other side would rather that than not be able to go anywhere because teh traffic is gridlocked? The people in those houses have probably been suffering from blight for the last 20 years and are waiting for *any* work to proceed just so they can get their houses valued and move out if possible! A flyover would spread out ~50mph traffic noise nicely over a much wider area. I imagine the Westway can be heard from quite a distance away. -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
A406 upgrades
"Dave Arquati" wrote in message
... Stuart wrote: Henleys corner doesn't have any houses on one side and perhaps those on the other side would rather that than not be able to go anywhere because teh traffic is gridlocked? Getting away from Henlys is easy in any direction. Getting to Henlys is easy from any direction if you know the small roads, which the locals would. The people in those houses have probably been suffering from blight for the last 20 years and are waiting for *any* work to proceed just so they can get their houses valued and move out if possible! A flyover would spread out ~50mph traffic noise nicely over a much wider area. A flyover would create moving 50mph traffic where there is now a permanent traffic jam. The large size of the buildings on the north side would probably prevent the sound from spreading. There would also be an increase in traffic, both from local traffic which currently avoids the area, and also from longer distance traffic which currently uses the M25 because Henlys is so bad. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
A406 upgrades
On Mon, 25 Oct 2004, Nick H (UK) wrote:
John Rowland wrote: "RW" wrote in message ... It is about time they did something about the A406. It is absolutely ridiculous that such a strategic trunk road linking east/north/west London has so many bottlenecks, resulting in absurdly long journey times and frayed nerves. Is it? How can you justify completing the grade separation of the North Circular, when the South Circular has not a single grade separated junction and few dual carriageway sections? The South Circular mostly does not even exist. That's the problem It is - you need a PhD in applied existentialism just to bloody use it. Still, keeps the traffic down. tom -- OBEY GIANT |
A406 upgrades
Stuart wrote:
Dave Arquati wrote: Building a flyover harks back to the 60s when it was considered acceptable to plonk concrete megaliths in the middle of residential areas because car traffic was much more important than everything else. See the Westway. It's interesting to watch the cityscape as you're going along it, but it's probably not so nice the look out of your house at the Westway. Yes, but Henleys corner doesn't have any houses on one side and perhaps those on the other side would rather that than not be able to go anywhere because teh traffic is gridlocked? Why are 'residents' supposed to prefer traffic jams to flowing traffic? This just seems to me to be one of the modern road-dogma stupidities. My local council has done a very good job of creating congestion. I don't like it any more when I'm out on foot shopping than I do when I'm trying to drive through it. Does anyone? -- Nick H (UK) |
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