To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

I hope you find it helpful - perhaps people can see why capping has been
a complex thing to get in place.

-------------------------------------
Bus / Tram Capping - Cap is £3.00

Trip Time Pre Pay Cumulative Notes
Fare Charge
1 06.15 80p 80p
2 10.30 80p £1.60
3 12.00 80p £2.40
4 13.15 60p £3.00

System only deducts 60p to reach the Bus Cap. Total charge for the day
is £3.
------------------------
Day Travelcard (Peak) Capping.
Bus Cap £3.00, Z12 Peak £6, Off Peak £4.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Pk OP Bus
1 Bus 06.15 80p 80p 80p
2 Z2-1 08.45 2.10 2.90 80p
3 Z1-1 13.00 1.70 4.60 1.70 80p
4 Z1-1 15.00 1.40 6.00 3.10 80p Pk Cap

The system only deducts £1.40 to reach the Z12 peak cap. Total charge is
£6.
---------------------------
Day Travelcard (Off Peak) Capping - Z12 OP cap is £4.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Charge
1 Z2-1 9.45 2.10 2.10
2 Z1-1 11.00 1.70 3.80
3 Z1-1 12.30 0.90 4.70 Z12 Cap
4 Z1-1 15.00 0 4.70
5 Z1-2 16.30 0 4.70

The system only deducts 90p to reach Z12 off peak cap. Total charge
£4.70
----------------------------
Peak Travel with Off Peak Capping.
Z12 OP Cap £4.70, Z16 caps peak £12, off peak £5.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Pk OP
1 Z6-1 8.30 3.50 3.50
2 Z1-2 9.35 2.10 5.60 2.10
3 Z2-1 13.00 2.10 7.70 4.20
4 Z1-1 15.00 0.50 8.20 4.70 Z12 Cap

System only deducts 50p to reach off peak cap of £4.70. Total charge for
the day is £8.20 - (£4.70 off peak cap value plus standard pre pay fare
of £3.50) which is less than the Z16 cap of £12.
-------------------------------

Peak Travel with Off Peak Capping.
Z12 OP Cap £4.70, Z16 caps peak £12, off peak £5.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Pk OP
1 Z6-1 8.30 3.50 3.50
2 Z1-2 9.35 2.10 5.60 2.10
3 Z2-1 13.00 2.10 7.70 4.20
4 Z1-1 15.00 0.50 8.20 4.70 Z12 Cap
5 Z1-6 17.30 1.00 9.20 5.70 Z16 Cap

System only deducts £1 to reach the next off peak cap of £5.70. Total
charge for the day is £9.20 - (£5.70 off peak cap value plus standard
pre pay fare of £3.50) which is less than the Z16 peak cap of £12.
----------------------------------

Peak Travel with Peak Capping.
Z16 caps peak £12, off peak £5.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Pk OP
1 Z6-1 7.15 3.50 3.50
2 Z1-2 8.20 2.10 5.60
3 Z2-1 13.00 2.10 7.70 2.10
4 Z1-1 15.00 1.70 9.40 3.80
5 Z1-6 17.30 2.60 12.00 6.40 Z16 Cap

Note that trip 2 is in the peak so its value does not count towards the
off peak cap.

Both peak and off peak caps are reached on trip 5 so the system
calculates whether peak cap is cheaper than off peak cap plus cumulative
peak pre-pay fares

5 Z1-6 17.30 1.90 11.30 5.70 Z16 OP Cap

Total charge for the day is £11.30 (£5.70 Z16 off peak cap plus £5.60
peak pre-pay charges.

-------------------------------------

Mixed Travelcard and Pre Pay capping (Z1 travelcard)

Customer has Z1 travelcard and prepay. Off peak Z26 cap is £4.00

Trip Zone time Ext Cum Notes
Fare Charge

1 Z1-6 09.45 1.80* 1.80 Z26 ext price
2 Z6-3 15.00 1.80 3.60
3 Z3-1 18.30 0.40 4.00 Z26 cap

System only deducts 40p top reach Z26 off peak cap.
* fares deducted exclude Z1. Total charge for the day £4.00

---------------------------------------

What happens if passenger does not touch out? (unresolved jny)

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Charge
1 Z2-1 09.45 2.10 2.10
2 Z1-1 15.00 1.70 3.80
3 Z1-? 18.30 1.70 5.50

Customer fails to validate on exit. As a consequence an incomplete
journey charge is made. Total charge for day is £5.50 as the incomplete
journey does not count towards the cap.

----------------------------------------

What happens if the journey is resolved?
Z12 cap is £4.70

Trip Zone time Fare Cum Notes
Charge
1 Z2-1 09.45 2.10 2.10
2 Z1-1 15.00 1.70 3.80
3 Z1-2 19.15 2.10 5.90 Resolved fare
4 Z2-2 21.30 0 5.90 Z12 cap

Nothing is deducted as Z12 cap is reached. total charge for the day is
£5.90. Customer pays £1/20 more than they should as a result of the
incomplete journey. This amount will count towards any subsequent cap.
------------------------------------------


Please note that the above is a straight copy of the slides I have. I
will readily admit I don't fully understand the unresolved journey
examples and I can see why people may have a "reaction" to this. Please
don't "have a go" at me for posting this - I don't make the policy and
as I don't understand the logic for having it set like this - other than
to provide an incentive to touch in and out - then I cannot be expected
to take any crap for it.

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Paul Corfield wrote to uk.transport.london on Sun, 13 Feb 2005:

To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

I hope you find it helpful - perhaps people can see why capping has been
a complex thing to get in place.

-------------------------------------
Bus / Tram Capping - Cap is £3.00

Trip Time Pre Pay Cumulative Notes
Fare Charge
1 06.15 80p 80p
2 10.30 80p £1.60
3 12.00 80p £2.40
4 13.15 60p £3.00

System only deducts 60p to reach the Bus Cap. Total charge for the day
is £3.

So they are doing a Bus Cap?! Oh *good* - so I'll renew my bus pass on
Tuesday, and by the time it expires again, it will probably be worth
just using capping! Brilliant.
--
"Mrs Redboots"
http://www.amsmyth.demon.co.uk/
Website updated 23 January 2005 with new photos

Paul Corfield wrote:
To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

Do you happen to know why it's necessary to have a zero entry level for
Prepay? It's causing a few problems for people with expired season
tickets who don't understand why their Oysters worked fine on the way to
work and won't work on the way home....
--
Kat

On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:36:28 +0000, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Please note that the above is a straight copy of the slides I have. I
will readily admit I don't fully understand the unresolved journey
examples and I can see why people may have a "reaction" to this. Please
don't "have a go" at me for posting this - I don't make the policy and
as I don't understand the logic for having it set like this - other than
to provide an incentive to touch in and out - then I cannot be expected
to take any crap for it.

Thanks for that, Paul.

Aquestion tat immediately springs to mind is:

What happens if the passenger reaches the bus cap, then takes a couple of
Tube journeys? Will the system know to count the bus cap towards the
Travelcard cap?

Paul Corfield ) gurgled happily, sounding much like
they were saying :

To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

idle conjecture
What happens if you hit the ODTC cap every day for a week - will it do a
7DTC cap, too?

On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 19:01:09 -0000, "James Farrar"
wrote:

On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:36:28 +0000, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Please note that the above is a straight copy of the slides I have. I
will readily admit I don't fully understand the unresolved journey
examples and I can see why people may have a "reaction" to this. Please
don't "have a go" at me for posting this - I don't make the policy and
as I don't understand the logic for having it set like this - other than
to provide an incentive to touch in and out - then I cannot be expected
to take any crap for it.

Thanks for that, Paul.

Aquestion tat immediately springs to mind is:

What happens if the passenger reaches the bus cap, then takes a couple of
Tube journeys? Will the system know to count the bus cap towards the
Travelcard cap?

As I warned above I don't *know* the definitive answers not having had
the training or the opportunity to ask zillions of complicated
questions. However if you look at the logic of the examples it is that
all journeys count towards the most appropriate cap - example 2 has
something close to your question where the money deducted for the bus
does count towards both peak and off peak running totals..

If you imagine in the bus example that there were subsequent off peak
tube trips in Z12 added to the £3 then the Z12 off peak t/card cap would
come into play at £4.70. In other words the first Z12 tube trip would
cost £1.70 to reach £4.70 rather than cost £2.10. The next tube trips
would be free unless you went beyond zones 1 and 2 when a higher cap
could be triggered (Z14 off pk T/Card).

The aspects to keep in mind are mode, time and zones. If you stay on the
buses all day you'll be capped at £3. If you are bus, tube and DLR then
you'll be capped at the appropriate one day off peak travelcard. If you
travel in the peak and use tube and DLR then you may be capped at either
the peak one day travelcard or else some combination of your peak travel
costs PLUS the appropriate one day off peak travelcard for the zones
travelled through OFF PEAK.

HTH somehow!

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

James Farrar wrote:
On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:36:28 +0000, Paul Corfield
wrote:

Please note that the above is a straight copy of the slides I have. I
will readily admit I don't fully understand the unresolved journey
examples and I can see why people may have a "reaction" to this. Please
don't "have a go" at me for posting this - I don't make the policy and
as I don't understand the logic for having it set like this - other than
to provide an incentive to touch in and out - then I cannot be expected
to take any crap for it.

Thanks for that, Paul.

Aquestion tat immediately springs to mind is:

What happens if the passenger reaches the bus cap, then takes a couple
of Tube journeys? Will the system know to count the bus cap towards
the Travelcard cap?

As I understand it, it will.
The only journey which will be charged at the full price and not be
added to the cap would be an incomplete journey.
--
Kat

On Sun, 13 Feb 2005 18:50:10 +0000, Mrs Redboots
wrote:

Paul Corfield wrote to uk.transport.london on Sun, 13 Feb 2005:

To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

I hope you find it helpful - perhaps people can see why capping has been
a complex thing to get in place.

-------------------------------------
Bus / Tram Capping - Cap is £3.00

Trip Time Pre Pay Cumulative Notes
Fare Charge
1 06.15 80p 80p
2 10.30 80p £1.60
3 12.00 80p £2.40
4 13.15 60p £3.00

System only deducts 60p to reach the Bus Cap. Total charge for the day
is £3.

So they are doing a Bus Cap?! Oh *good* - so I'll renew my bus pass on
Tuesday, and by the time it expires again, it will probably be worth
just using capping! Brilliant.

But be careful - if you travel every day by bus then it will be better
to retain the bus pass (£11) or else you will simply get capped at £3
every day thus making your costs £21 a week. The system only caps at
daily values - it does not do subsequent counts to weekly or period
values. This may be a latter stage but I don't know for certain if that
is part of the design.

--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

Adrian wrote:
Paul Corfield ) gurgled happily, sounding much like
they were saying :

To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

idle conjecture
What happens if you hit the ODTC cap every day for a week - will it do a
7DTC cap, too?

No... I've no idea if this may happen in the future.
--
Kat

Paul Corfield wrote:

To help people understand I thought I'd type up the examples of how
capping will work from the LU training slides. Please note that the
fare values are for now - not post 27 Feb 2005.

If you ask questions I can't guarantee to answer them properly as I've
not had the training!

I hope you find it helpful - perhaps people can see why capping has been
a complex thing to get in place.

Since no-one else has said it:

Thank you very much for taking the time to post this useful stuff.

Colin McKenzie