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On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 20:51:49 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote: I was amazed to hear the PA system used while riding on an 8 near Holborn on Sunday morning. I couldn't actually understand what the driver was saying (!) but he seemed to be using it to announce a stop for someone who must have asked. Back over in Germany, before the displays came along (and on the few buses that probably remain now without them) the driver announces every stop. I don't think I've ever heard one in use over here. Drivers tend to prefer, if they really need to talk to the passengers, to turn around and shout. Neil -- Neil Williams in Milton Keynes, UK When replying please use neil at the above domain 'wensleydale' is a spam trap and is not read. |
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On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 19:59:35 +0100, Ian Jelf
wrote: In message , Paul Corfield writes My recent trip to Berlin uncovered a range of extremely detailed booklets covering the Berlin regional fare system. As with many such systems it is a complex structure but at least information is readily available. Much of this was also covered in a superb Berlin Atlas that shows all the transport routes overlaid on a very clear street atlas complete with schematic diagrams and frequency guides for every bus, tram and U Bahn line. This is very common in Germany. A lot of the area ADAC (German AA/RAC) area street atlases have such information. For various reasons, though, service revisions are pretty unco0ommon by comparison with the UK! Well the Berlin Atlas had an excellent supplement that detailed all the changes that had taken place since publication including revised U Bahn and Metrobus / Metrotram networks where these applied. The U Bahn service structure has changed quite considerably since my last visit and has changed a fair bit even this year as has the S Bahn - there is still loads of work going on. They also had good quality leaflets about works on the tram routes for October in the trams and an in house magazine available free on the buses. There was also good information on S Bahn service alterations - again with revised network maps - which my limited German skills allowed me to broadly understand. All a bt of a step up in quality from London practice although I accept tube information about planned works is pretty good these days. Bus service information - especially about changes - is dire unless you rely on the Internet. -- Paul C Admits to working for London Underground! |
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In message , Neil Williams
writes On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 20:51:49 +0100, Ian Jelf wrote: I was amazed to hear the PA system used while riding on an 8 near Holborn on Sunday morning. I couldn't actually understand what the driver was saying (!) but he seemed to be using it to announce a stop for someone who must have asked. Back over in Germany, before the displays came along (and on the few buses that probably remain now without them) the driver announces every stop. I remember one in Berlin being (uncharacteristically for Prussian officialdom) being very funny with his announcements on the 100. At the height of the rebuilding of the Freidrichsplatz area a few years ago he would say "Grosse Baustelle" [1] for that particular stop! I don't think I've ever heard one in use over here. Drivers tend to prefer, if they really need to talk to the passengers, to turn around and shout. I've only heard it used once here, on the 205. For that reason it really made me jump when it suddenly boomed into life on Sunday morning with the speaker right above my head. (Interestingly I recently needed to get the use of a PA-equipped double decker here in the West Midlands for a tour I was doing for a private group of Birmingham's famous "Outer Circle" 11 bus route. It proved very difficult! Travel West Midlands no longer have any such equipped buses, although the "Timesaver" Metrobuses used to have them in the 1980s. Claribel's, a small but very smart independent in East Birmingham actually installed one to their solitary double decker just for the purpose!) [1] Big Building site for non-German speakers, which I know won't apply to Neil! -- Ian Jelf, MITG Birmingham, UK Registered Blue Badge Tourist Guide for London and the Heart of England http://www.bluebadge.demon.co.uk |
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"Paul Corfield" wrote in message
... Much of this was also covered in a superb Berlin Atlas that shows all the transport routes overlaid on a very clear street atlas complete with schematic diagrams and frequency guides for every bus, tram and U Bahn line. First and last times are included together with times between every stop and what routes you can interchange to at each stop. Their stop specific information is also a model of clarity. Please can we have this for London !!!!!! Have you considered how large it would be? Berlin is a tiny city by comparison with London, and yet the Berlin atlas is too large already. -- John Rowland - Spamtrapped Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001 http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood. That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line - It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes |
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Neil Williams wrote:
On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 20:51:49 +0100, Ian Jelf wrote: I was amazed to hear the PA system used while riding on an 8 near Holborn on Sunday morning. I couldn't actually understand what the driver was saying (!) but he seemed to be using it to announce a stop for someone who must have asked. Back over in Germany, before the displays came along (and on the few buses that probably remain now without them) the driver announces every stop. I don't think I've ever heard one in use over here. Drivers tend to prefer, if they really need to talk to the passengers, to turn around and shout. I've only ever heard it used once[1]. N73. Walthamstow. I was the only person on the bus. Asleep in the luggage rack. (Look, the bus was packed when I got on!) So why he didn't just turn round and shout, I don't know. Luckily, I did actually live in Walthamstow at the time :-) But I am surprised they aren't used more. [1] Oh, there was one other time too. |
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Neil Williams wrote:
On Tue, 11 Oct 2005 19:49:56 +0100, Paul Terry wrote: But in London, I suspect that strangers are reluctant to use buses because, even when given the route number, they worry about where to get off because they don't know the visual clues and can't (in these days of one-man driver and articulated buses) rely on someone to tell them. I agree. There's nothing worse than being on a bus going to somewhere you're not familiar with. You have to hope there is a shop sign or road name that will give a clue to the location. Indeed. However, the technology exists, and has existed for ages, to name stops and provide a display inside the bus showing the next stop and other relevant information, either operated by the driver or (preferably) by GPS. Hamburg has had this on its buses for years, London has (or had) on the RV1, and Manchester does on at least some of the Metroshuttle free buses. Yet it is pretty much 100% absent on other buses in the UK, even those with electronic outside displays. Why, I wonder? It is such an obvious (and relatively inexpensive, certainly in comparison with the price of a brand new bendy) solution to this fairly big problem. It amazes me that London in particular has not implemented it. If Mr. Peddle of MK Metro is reading, it'd be especially suitable for Milton Keynes, where most of the main road stops look the same! Makes perfect sense to me! Surely with the bus tracking systems we already have it wouldn't be hard for the bus to 'know' where it currently is? -- Paul |
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On Wed, 12 Oct 2005 11:00:48 +0100, Paul
wrote: I agree. There's nothing worse than being on a bus going to somewhere you're not familiar with. Yes there is. Try sitting through "Woman In White" :-) |
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