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The best non-interchange interchanges
Courtesy of the era of Victoria railway competition (and too much time
on my hands) I give you the list of the best non-interchange interchanges in London. Here are some lesser known ways to change between lines in the capital that aren't marked as interchanges on the London Connections map or the Tube map as they involve a small(ish) walk between stations. I've used some of them (and found them very useful), with some I've just put one and one together from some knwoledge of the area, some I've just deduced from the A-Z Thankfully some of the really close stations do now appear as interchanges on maps, for example Clapham High Street (South London Line) to Clapham North (Northern Line). But for those who are able bodied, not carrying heavy luggage, a bit more adventurous and perhaps have some idea of the timetable then there's time to be saved and useful connections to be made, and possibly congested interchanges that can be avoided. I've probably missed a few too, National Rail stations are indicated with an NR after the station name. (Names of lines are indicated in brackets after the station name.) ------- Central ------- London Bridge NR to Monument/Bank - walk over the river on London Bridge. The District and Circle at Monument are particularly close. Good route for those heading East on the District and vice versa. Moorgate to Liverpool Street NR - for changing from the Northern Line and FCC's Great Northern Line. St Pauls (Central Line) to City Thameslink NR. Aldgate to Aldgate East - for changing between the Circle, District, H&C and Met. Potentially useful if one of the lines is up the spout. ----- South ----- Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Battersea Park NR (Southern) to Queenstown Road Battersea NR (SWT) - for changing from the South London Line (Victoria - London Bridge) to SWT Windsor Line trains (to Clapham Junction, Richmond and beyond). Penge West NR (Southern) to Penge East NR (Southeastern) South Wimbledon (Northern Line) to Morden Road or Merton Park Tramlink tram stops ----- North ----- Camden Town (Northern Line) to Camden Road NR (North London Line) Kentish Town NR (Thameslink) to Kentish Town West NR (North London Line) - though most passengers would be better off changing at West Hampstead. Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Bowes Park NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Bounds Green (Piccadilly Line) Alexandra Palace NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Wood Green (Piccadilly Line). ---------- North West ---------- Northwick Park (Metropolitan Line) to Kenton (Bakerloo Line and NR Silverlink Metro Watford-Euston) Kilburn (jubilee Line) to Brondesbury NR (North London Line) - though for most journeys changing at West Hampstead would be more convenient. Swiss Cottage (Jubilee Line) to South Hampstead NR - though for the journeys I can think of passengers would be better off changing elsewhere. ---- West ---- Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) to Shepherd's Bush (Hammersmith and City Line) or Goldhawk Road (H&C line). Kensington Olympia NR to Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) North Ealing (Picadilly Line) to West Acton (Central Line) ---- East ---- Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Walthamstow Central (NR 'one' Chingford Line & Victoria Line) to Walthamstow Queens Road NR (GOBLIN) Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Mizter T wrote:
Moorgate to Liverpool Street NR - for changing from the Northern Line and FCC's Great Northern Line. How easy is this to follow if you don't know the area? When there have been problems on the Met at Liverpool Street/Aldgate I've found it difficult to easily walk due to poor signage. St Pauls (Central Line) to City Thameslink NR. Isn't Chancery Lane closer to City Thameslink? Camden Town (Northern Line) to Camden Road NR (North London Line) Kentish Town NR (Thameslink) to Kentish Town West NR (North London Line) - though most passengers would be better off changing at West Hampstead. Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Quite a few examples of the mess on the North London Line and the GOBLIN. The latter seems to have only one intermediate interchange - and that's a relatively modern addition. Is there any prospect of any of these being added to the maps and made valid for interchanges? Orbirail will be messy given the limited interchanges with a number of roots. ---- East ---- Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Bethnal Green tube is even closer to the NR station isn't it? Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Indeed - so close they're on the same road. Just why isn't interchange allowed between the two? Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) Very close - the end of the High Road platform (although not the section currently in use) is above the Central Line tracks. Could a passageway/ramp be put in here? |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Tim Roll-Pickering wrote:
Mizter T wrote: Moorgate to Liverpool Street NR - for changing from the Northern Line and FCC's Great Northern Line. How easy is this to follow if you don't know the area? When there have been problems on the Met at Liverpool Street/Aldgate I've found it difficult to easily walk due to poor signage. It's an easy change when you know the way. I'd walk through Finsbury Circus or along South Place, Eldon Street and Liverpool Street. See this map... http://tinyurl.com/nfxt6 St Pauls (Central Line) to City Thameslink NR. Isn't Chancery Lane closer to City Thameslink? If you come out of City Thameslink at the Holborn Viaduct exit then I think St Pauls just pips it. Of course you could head to one or the other dependent on whether you were heading east or west. Camden Town (Northern Line) to Camden Road NR (North London Line) Kentish Town NR (Thameslink) to Kentish Town West NR (North London Line) - though most passengers would be better off changing at West Hampstead. Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Quite a few examples of the mess on the North London Line and the GOBLIN. The latter seems to have only one intermediate interchange - and that's a relatively modern addition. Is there any prospect of any of these being added to the maps and made valid for interchanges? Orbirail will be messy given the limited interchanges with a number of roots. Some of these do involve a short walk, which perhaps negates them being called an interchange. I guess there's the clarity of the maps to consider as well before slapping distant interchanges all over them. But perhaps some could be indicated on line maps. One thing to say is that TfL has funded a lot of improvements to street signage for pedestrians near both Tube and NR stations as well as providing local street map displays and local bus spider maps, all of which are very welcome improvements IMO. ---- East ---- Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Bethnal Green tube is even closer to the NR station isn't it? Yes, perhaps I should've included that. I was thinking more of the south-east to north-east link that changing here provides, it's a great way to get from New Cross to Hackney, though if you're going further north then you need to be on top of the train times. It also avoids zone 1. Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Indeed - so close they're on the same road. Just why isn't interchange allowed between the two? Er, nothing bans you changing there, I've done it! If you mean why isn't it on the maps, then that's a fair enough point. Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) Very close - the end of the High Road platform (although not the section currently in use) is above the Central Line tracks. Could a passageway/ramp be put in here? That's one I've never done. What you suggest is similar to the proposed Walthamstow Central to Walthamstow Queens Road bridge as detailed he http://www.alwaystouchout.com/project/69 |
The best non-interchange interchanges
On Thu, 29 Jun 2006 16:52:25 +0100, Tim Roll-Pickering wrote:
South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Quite a few examples of the mess on the North London Line and the GOBLIN. The latter seems to have only one intermediate interchange - and that's a relatively modern addition. ISTR reading that there used to be an interchange at Walthamstow, but it was closed. Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Bethnal Green tube is even closer to the NR station isn't it? Yes, but rather awkward to get to from the ELL... There's also Hackney Downs to Hackney Central. Although not shown as an interchange on maps, there are still tickets available that are specifically routed via these two stations (e.g. Camden Road to Liverpool Street); this is a hangover from when the through service from the NLL to Liverpool Street ceased. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
asdf wrote:
(snip) Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Bethnal Green tube is even closer to the NR station isn't it? Yes, but rather awkward to get to from the ELL... Stupidly I hadn't really considered the idea of walking from Whitechapel ELL to Bethnal Green Central Line. It's certainly further than Bethnal Green NR station, but I'd say it's easy enough - just walk north up Cambridge Heath Road. There's also Hackney Downs to Hackney Central. Although not shown as an interchange on maps, there are still tickets available that are specifically routed via these two stations (e.g. Camden Road to Liverpool Street); this is a hangover from when the through service from the NLL to Liverpool Street ceased. When I wrote my original post I wasn't thinking about through ticketing, but that's an interesting new dimension. With Travelcards I guess such tickets are becoming a forgotten backwater - but they could possibly come in very handy for some. And I'd straight forgotten about the useful Hackney Downs to Hackney Central interchange, which perhaps should be on the maps. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Mizter T wrote:
Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Indeed - so close they're on the same road. Just why isn't interchange allowed between the two? Er, nothing bans you changing there, I've done it! If you mean why isn't it on the maps, then that's a fair enough point. Erm I actually meant why isn't it allowed on a through ticket. This isn't a frivilous point as some c2c services do divert via to GOBLIN to run from Liverpool Street to Barking etc. and vice versa. Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) Very close - the end of the High Road platform (although not the section currently in use) is above the Central Line tracks. Could a passageway/ramp be put in here? That's one I've never done. What you suggest is similar to the proposed Walthamstow Central to Walthamstow Queens Road bridge as detailed he http://www.alwaystouchout.com/project/69 I can't access it at the moment. But generally I reckon that making the Silverlink lines more interchange friendly - even if it's just a case of allowing some of the close stations to have interchange on a through ticket (e.g. Forest Gate & Wanstead Park) - would improve perimeter routes no end and perhaps make it easier to get investment. The Orbirail project at the moment seems to cross the following without interchanging: *The Ealing/Richmond branch of the District Line *The Picadilly Line in the west *The Hammersmith & City Line in the west * NR into Paddington *Chiltern Railways *The Metropolitan Line - but how tricky would it be to reinstate services at West Hampstead? *The Edgware branch of the Northern Line *The High Barnet branch of the Northern Line - could the Kentish Towns be synced for interchange? I can't see additional pressure being added to Camden Town. *NR out of St Pancras *NR out of King's Cross *The Picadilly Line in the north *NR out of Liverpool Street (unless Shoreditch High Street can work as an interchange) *The Central Line in the east *NR out of Fenchuch Street *NR services from South East London and Kent *NR services from Norwood Junction and Cyrstal Palace - though the interchange is obvious *The Thameslink loop Plus the GOBLIN lacks formal interchange with: *The High Barnet branch of the Northern Line *NR out of St Pancras *NR out of King's Cross *NR out of Moorgate *The Picadilly Line in the north *All the NR lines out of Liverpool Street via Bethnal Green *The Central Line in the east - see my other post for a possible way to build an interchange * NR services from Stratford to Ilford |
The best non-interchange interchanges
In article om,
Mizter T wrote: North Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Upper Holloway (goblin) - Archway (Northern Line). About a 5 minute walk; seems to be a popular change. -- I don't play The Game - it's for five-year-olds with delusions of adulthood. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Mizter T wrote: Courtesy of the era of Victoria railway competition (and too much time on my hands) I give you the list of the best non-interchange interchanges in London. Here are some lesser known ways to change between lines in the capital that aren't marked as interchanges on the London Connections map or the Tube map as they involve a small(ish) walk between stations. I've used some of them (and found them very useful), with some I've just put one and one together from some knwoledge of the area, some I've just deduced from the A-Z Thankfully some of the really close stations do now appear as interchanges on maps, for example Clapham High Street (South London Line) to Clapham North (Northern Line). But for those who are able bodied, not carrying heavy luggage, a bit more adventurous and perhaps have some idea of the timetable then there's time to be saved and useful connections to be made, and possibly congested interchanges that can be avoided. I've probably missed a few too, National Rail stations are indicated with an NR after the station name. (Names of lines are indicated in brackets after the station name.) ------- Central ------- London Bridge NR to Monument/Bank - walk over the river on London Bridge. The District and Circle at Monument are particularly close. Good route for those heading East on the District and vice versa. Moorgate to Liverpool Street NR - for changing from the Northern Line and FCC's Great Northern Line. St Pauls (Central Line) to City Thameslink NR. Aldgate to Aldgate East - for changing between the Circle, District, H&C and Met. Potentially useful if one of the lines is up the spout. Cannon Street (NR and LU) is nearer to Bank than Monument is. Much easier from South East to go along the Central Line than going North from Charing Cross and changing again. Probably as near as Charing Cross (NR) to Charing Cross Bakerloo. Great Portland Street to Regent Street, similarly close. ----- South ----- Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Battersea Park NR (Southern) to Queenstown Road Battersea NR (SWT) - for changing from the South London Line (Victoria - London Bridge) to SWT Windsor Line trains (to Clapham Junction, Richmond and beyond). Penge West NR (Southern) to Penge East NR (Southeastern) South Wimbledon (Northern Line) to Morden Road or Merton Park Tramlink tram stops ----- North ----- Camden Town (Northern Line) to Camden Road NR (North London Line) Kentish Town NR (Thameslink) to Kentish Town West NR (North London Line) - though most passengers would be better off changing at West Hampstead. Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Bowes Park NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Bounds Green (Piccadilly Line) Alexandra Palace NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Wood Green (Piccadilly Line). ---------- North West ---------- Northwick Park (Metropolitan Line) to Kenton (Bakerloo Line and NR Silverlink Metro Watford-Euston) Kilburn (jubilee Line) to Brondesbury NR (North London Line) - though for most journeys changing at West Hampstead would be more convenient. Swiss Cottage (Jubilee Line) to South Hampstead NR - though for the journeys I can think of passengers would be better off changing elsewhere. ---- West ---- Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) to Shepherd's Bush (Hammersmith and City Line) or Goldhawk Road (H&C line). Kensington Olympia NR to Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) North Ealing (Picadilly Line) to West Acton (Central Line) I think Hanger Lane (Central Line) to Park Royal (Piccadilly Line). ---- East ---- Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Walthamstow Central (NR 'one' Chingford Line & Victoria Line) to Walthamstow Queens Road NR (GOBLIN) Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) |
The best non-interchange interchanges
MIG wrote: Great Portland Street to Regent Street, similarly close. It is Regent's Park. Marylebone Road/Euston Road needs some subway station rationalization. There are so many missed interchange opportunities. One interchange that was, and maybe yet to come back is Primrose Hill and Chalk Farm. In fact they were so close it is a wonder they were never made into and interchange. Adrian. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
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The best non-interchange interchanges
wrote: MIG wrote: Great Portland Street to Regent Street, similarly close. It is Regent's Park. Marylebone Road/Euston Road needs some subway station rationalization. There are so many missed interchange opportunities. One interchange that was, and maybe yet to come back is Primrose Hill and Chalk Farm. In fact they were so close it is a wonder they were never made into and interchange. Adrian. Wow, you've crossposted this to the dizzy heights of uk.railway *and* misc.transport.urban-transit! Though perhaps without enough of an explaination. For those who're a bit lost coming in late then I refer you to the original thread entitled "The best non-interchange interchanges" on uk.transport.london [1]. In reply to the above comments, Regents Park (Bakerloo line) and Great Portland Street (Met/Circle/H&C lines) are exceedingly close, but given there's a direct interchange between all theselines a mere one station west at Baker Street there'd be little justification for spending money combining these stations. Just possibly the out-of-station 'distant interchange' walk between Regents Park and Gt Portland St might be useful to rush hour commuters looking to avoid the scrum, but I think it'd take longer. [1] For those who don't detest Google Groups, a direct link: http://tinyurl.com/rshje |
The best non-interchange interchanges
MIG wrote: Mizter T wrote: (snip) London Bridge NR to Monument/Bank - walk over the river on London Bridge. The District and Circle at Monument are particularly close. Good route for those heading East on the District and vice versa. (snip) Cannon Street (NR and LU) is nearer to Bank than Monument is. Much easier from South East to go along the Central Line than going North from Charing Cross and changing again. Probably as near as Charing Cross (NR) to Charing Cross Bakerloo. Good one, I hadn't thought of the possibilities from Cannon Street. Basically any wily traveller arriving from points south or southeast into London Bridge, Cannon Street or Charing Cross and heading onwards on the Underground would be wise to consider their options before heading down the first hole with a roundel above it! Obviously arrivals at Charing Cross should head to Embankment for the District and Circle (as indicated on maps already), and could consider a walk up to Leicester Square if they wanted the Piccadilly to points north. Great Portland Street to Regent Street, similarly close. Great Portland Street to Regents Park is I'm sure what you meant! Given Baker Street is one stop west from both stations and provides a proper interchange this would only possibly be useful to those wishing to avoid the crush there. And those wishing to perambulate in Regents Park, which is a treat however often you go there. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
On 29 Jun 2006 15:20:41 -0700, Mizter T wrote:
In reply to the above comments, Regents Park (Bakerloo line) and Great Portland Street (Met/Circle/H&C lines) are exceedingly close, but given there's a direct interchange between all theselines a mere one station west at Baker Street there'd be little justification for spending money combining these stations. Regent's Park is closing for a year for lift replacement. One thing that struck me as odd is that although it's practically across the road from Great Portland Street, TfL are advising passengers to use Baker Street (700m away) as an alternative during the closure. (Though they do also mention GPS, almost as an afterthought.) |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Mizter T wrote:
[1] For those who don't detest Google Groups, a direct link: http://tinyurl.com/rshje Or even better a link back to the original post of that thread: http://tinyurl.com/r54jz Apols for all this incompetence related usenet disturbance. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Mizter T wrote: wrote: MIG wrote: Great Portland Street to Regent Street, similarly close. It is Regent's Park. Marylebone Road/Euston Road needs some subway station rationalization. There are so many missed interchange opportunities. One interchange that was, and maybe yet to come back is Primrose Hill and Chalk Farm. In fact they were so close it is a wonder they were never made into an interchange. Adrian. Wow, you've crossposted this to the dizzy heights of uk.railway *and* misc.transport.urban-transit! Though perhaps without enough of an explaination. For those who're a bit lost coming in late then I refer you to the original thread entitled "The best non-interchange interchanges" on uk.transport.london [1]. Is the original question related to rail in the UK? Is the original question related to urban transit? And, why is London so poorly represented on misc.transport.urban-transit compared with other metropolitan regions, especialy those in English speaking countries? Is it so hard to follow a thread back to its source? |
The best non-interchange interchanges
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The best non-interchange interchanges
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The best non-interchange interchanges
Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article om, (Mizter T) wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Battersea Park NR (Southern) to Queenstown Road Battersea NR (SWT) - for changing from the South London Line (Victoria - London Bridge) to SWT Windsor Line trains (to Clapham Junction, Richmond and beyond). Remember it well. My father taught dentistry at King's in Camberwell when I was brought up in Putney so this was one of the ways I got to the dentist's. And it's probably a shorter walk, if going to Victoria, than the supposed interchange at Clapham Junction. I was on a train that got stuck with a signal failure at Queenstown Road recently and everyone seemed to know to pile down to Battersea Park. It's not just the London Bridge trains that stop there, it's nearly all Southern stopping stuff to/from Victoria. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
How about Lancaster Gate to Paddington? I used to use it regularly if
coming from the Central Line; saves the change at Oxford Circus. "Mizter T" wrote in message ps.com... Courtesy of the era of Victoria railway competition (and too much time on my hands) I give you the list of the best non-interchange interchanges in London. Here are some lesser known ways to change between lines in the capital that aren't marked as interchanges on the London Connections map or the Tube map as they involve a small(ish) walk between stations. I've used some of them (and found them very useful), with some I've just put one and one together from some knwoledge of the area, some I've just deduced from the A-Z Thankfully some of the really close stations do now appear as interchanges on maps, for example Clapham High Street (South London Line) to Clapham North (Northern Line). But for those who are able bodied, not carrying heavy luggage, a bit more adventurous and perhaps have some idea of the timetable then there's time to be saved and useful connections to be made, and possibly congested interchanges that can be avoided. I've probably missed a few too, National Rail stations are indicated with an NR after the station name. (Names of lines are indicated in brackets after the station name.) ------- Central ------- London Bridge NR to Monument/Bank - walk over the river on London Bridge. The District and Circle at Monument are particularly close. Good route for those heading East on the District and vice versa. Moorgate to Liverpool Street NR - for changing from the Northern Line and FCC's Great Northern Line. St Pauls (Central Line) to City Thameslink NR. Aldgate to Aldgate East - for changing between the Circle, District, H&C and Met. Potentially useful if one of the lines is up the spout. ----- South ----- Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Battersea Park NR (Southern) to Queenstown Road Battersea NR (SWT) - for changing from the South London Line (Victoria - London Bridge) to SWT Windsor Line trains (to Clapham Junction, Richmond and beyond). Penge West NR (Southern) to Penge East NR (Southeastern) South Wimbledon (Northern Line) to Morden Road or Merton Park Tramlink tram stops ----- North ----- Camden Town (Northern Line) to Camden Road NR (North London Line) Kentish Town NR (Thameslink) to Kentish Town West NR (North London Line) - though most passengers would be better off changing at West Hampstead. Haringay Green Lanes NR (GOBLIN) to Manor House (Piccadilly Line) South Tottenham (GOBLIN) to Seven Sisters (NR and Victoria Line) Bowes Park NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Bounds Green (Piccadilly Line) Alexandra Palace NR (FCC Great Northern Line) to Wood Green (Piccadilly Line). ---------- North West ---------- Northwick Park (Metropolitan Line) to Kenton (Bakerloo Line and NR Silverlink Metro Watford-Euston) Kilburn (jubilee Line) to Brondesbury NR (North London Line) - though for most journeys changing at West Hampstead would be more convenient. Swiss Cottage (Jubilee Line) to South Hampstead NR - though for the journeys I can think of passengers would be better off changing elsewhere. ---- West ---- Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) to Shepherd's Bush (Hammersmith and City Line) or Goldhawk Road (H&C line). Kensington Olympia NR to Shepherd's Bush (Central Line) North Ealing (Picadilly Line) to West Acton (Central Line) ---- East ---- Whitechapel to Bethnal Green NR - for changing from the East London Line to Enfield/Chingford Town bound trains & vice versa. Forest Gate NR ('one' Great Eastern line) to Wanstead Park NR (GOBLIN) - for changing from the GOBLIN from points West to Great Eastern line to points East or vice versa. Walthamstow Central (NR 'one' Chingford Line & Victoria Line) to Walthamstow Queens Road NR (GOBLIN) Leytonstone High Road NR (GOBLIN) to Leytonstone (Central Line) |
The best non-interchange interchanges
["Followup-To:" header set to misc.transport.urban-transit.]
wrote: [...] And, why is London so poorly represented on misc.transport.urban-transit compared with other metropolitan regions, especialy those in English speaking countries? While I don't know the answer for certain, I suspect that it has at least something to do with the group uk.transport.london, in that at least some of those who are specifically interested in London post to that group, rather than more generally. This may also be something of a holdover from the old days of Usenet, when users were directed always to post to the most specific gruop available -- that is: if one is specifically discussing London or NYC, then one should do so in the London or NYC groups, and not in the general groups. -- greg byshenk - - Leiden, NL |
The best non-interchange interchanges
"asdf" wrote in message . Regent's Park is closing for a year for lift replacement. One thing that struck me as odd is that although it's practically across the road from Great Portland Street, TfL are advising passengers to use Baker Street (700m away) as an alternative during the closure. (Though they do also mention GPS, almost as an afterthought.) The reason they are advertising BS (rather than GPS) as an alternative to Regent's Park is that BS is served by the bakerloo line whereas GPS is not. If you wanted to go from Regent's Park to, say, Waterloo, and RP was closed, going to GPS and making your way to Waterloo from there would be painful. Richard [in SG19] -- Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com |
The best non-interchange interchanges
On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 15:03:21 +0100, "Richard M Willis"
wrote: "asdf" wrote in message . Regent's Park is closing for a year for lift replacement. One thing that struck me as odd is that although it's practically across the road from Great Portland Street, TfL are advising passengers to use Baker Street (700m away) as an alternative during the closure. (Though they do also mention GPS, almost as an afterthought.) The reason they are advertising BS (rather than GPS) as an alternative to Regent's Park is that BS is served by the bakerloo line whereas GPS is not. If you wanted to go from Regent's Park to, say, Waterloo, and RP was closed, going to GPS and making your way to Waterloo from there would be painful. Baker Street also provides a greater number of platforms (10) than Great Portland Street (2) around which the displaced RP passengers can be dispersed. While regulars are likely to use G.P.St. if it is appropriate to them, Baker Street would seem to be the better place to send those who are likely to be more navigationally challenged (e.g. tourists and infrequent travellers). -- _______ +---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //| | Charles Ellson: | | \\ // | +---------------------------------------------------+ | | | // \\ | Alba gu brath |//___\\| |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Charles Ellson wrote: On Fri, 30 Jun 2006 15:03:21 +0100, "Richard M Willis" wrote: "asdf" wrote in message . Regent's Park is closing for a year for lift replacement. One thing that struck me as odd is that although it's practically across the road from Great Portland Street, TfL are advising passengers to use Baker Street (700m away) as an alternative during the closure. (Though they do also mention GPS, almost as an afterthought.) The reason they are advertising BS (rather than GPS) as an alternative to Regent's Park is that BS is served by the bakerloo line whereas GPS is not. If you wanted to go from Regent's Park to, say, Waterloo, and RP was closed, going to GPS and making your way to Waterloo from there would be painful. Baker Street also provides a greater number of platforms (10) than Great Portland Street (2) around which the displaced RP passengers can be dispersed. While regulars are likely to use G.P.St. if it is appropriate to them, Baker Street would seem to be the better place to send those who are likely to be more navigationally challenged (e.g. tourists and infrequent travellers). I wonder if we should also have had a thread on the worst interchange non-interchanges, like Charing Cross/Trafalgar Square, Canary Whart, Waterloo, London Bridge ... Actually, Baker Street is an awful interchange as well if you want to get from the Circle to the Bakerloo. Bank is awful unless you disobey all signs. For example, the DLR is two levels below the Central, and yet they direct you to walk up stairs to get to it from the Central. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Colin Rosenstiel wrote:
In article om, (Mizter T) wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Local journeys from points west on SWT to places on the District branch - e.g. Twickenham to Fulham Broadway? I'd probably opt for the bus from Putney NR instead in that case, but some people prefer a Tube/train option. -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
The best non-interchange interchanges
(snip original post on nearby unconnected stations)
Graham Harrison wrote: How about Lancaster Gate to Paddington? I used to use it regularly if coming from the Central Line; saves the change at Oxford Circus. Same here, but coming from the west to avoid the change at Notting Hill Gate. However, the new White City interchange with the H&C might be more convenient when it's finished. -- Dave Arquati Imperial College, SW7 www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Dave Arquati wrote:
Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article om, (Mizter T) wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Local journeys from points west on SWT to places on the District branch - e.g. Twickenham to Fulham Broadway? I'd probably opt for the bus from Putney NR instead in that case, but some people prefer a Tube/train option. Perhaps it's a journey that might be quicker on rails compared to bus during the rush hour, I don't know. Similarly the Putney-East Putney change could be used for a Mortlake to Wimbledon journey, for example. Perhaps it's quicker to stay on SWT changing at Clapham Junction, perhaps the time difference is negligable though, and changing at Putney would avoid zone 2 so could work out cheaper for season ticket holders (and in the future presumably cheaper for Oyster Pre-Pay users once NR starts fully accepting it). Which takes me back to Colin's original point - IMO the stations are pretty close, a ten minute walk at the most. Many of the other "non-interchanges" I've included on the list are the same sort of distance apart. I guess it's up to personal preference, but I'd have no problem walking between any of them, as long as I had some idea where which way to go - one use of the very welcome TfL locality maps at stations. Anyway I enjoy walking a lot, as I do cycling, and both are important modes of transport on my books, perhaps somewhat underlooked on this newsgroup. I'm glad that catering for them seem to be being taken more and more seriously by TfL. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
On 2 Jul 2006 16:01:55 -0700, Mizter T wrote:
Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Local journeys from points west on SWT to places on the District branch - e.g. Twickenham to Fulham Broadway? I'd probably opt for the bus from Putney NR instead in that case, but some people prefer a Tube/train option. Perhaps it's a journey that might be quicker on rails compared to bus during the rush hour, I don't know. Similarly the Putney-East Putney change could be used for a Mortlake to Wimbledon journey, for example. Perhaps it's quicker to stay on SWT changing at Clapham Junction, perhaps the time difference is negligable though, and changing at Putney would avoid zone 2 so could work out cheaper for season ticket holders (and in the future presumably cheaper for Oyster Pre-Pay users once NR starts fully accepting it). No it wouldn't - you'd be charged for two journeys instead of one (unless they make it an "official" interchange, but there's no sign of them doing that with e.g. Northwick Park and Kenton which are in a similar situation). |
The best non-interchange interchanges
Dave Arquati wrote:
(snip original post on nearby unconnected stations) Graham Harrison wrote: How about Lancaster Gate to Paddington? I used to use it regularly if coming from the Central Line; saves the change at Oxford Circus. Same here, but coming from the west to avoid the change at Notting Hill Gate. However, the new White City interchange with the H&C might be more convenient when it's finished. That's a great interchange point Graham, it's on the list. Central Line to Paddington is not one I can remember doing in the past, but it looks like a useful change whether coming from either west or east. As you say Dave the White City interchange could be useful for this, but the lesser frequency on the H&C, the possibility (probability?) of a longer journey time and the chance of the H&C being up the spout might tip the balance in favour of staying on trhe Central Line if I was coming from the west. Slightly coincidentally I was on a bus coming from Notting Hill towards Marble Arch, and advised a couple of people who were headed to Paddington to get off at the at Lancaster Gate and walk round the corner. The bus driver had advised they get off at Marble Arch and change for a bus up the Edgware Road. Instead they took my advice, got off and from my vantage point on the top-deck I saw them head off in the completely wrong direction. I felt a little guilty. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
In article , (Dave
Arquati) wrote: Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article om, (Mizter T) wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Local journeys from points west on SWT to places on the District branch - e.g. Twickenham to Fulham Broadway? I'd probably opt for the bus from Putney NR instead in that case, but some people prefer a Tube/train option. FSVO "some" I suspect. I can't imagine the number doing the interchange is more than minuscule. -- Colin Rosenstiel |
The best non-interchange interchanges
asdf wrote:
On 2 Jul 2006 16:01:55 -0700, Mizter T wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) (snip) Similarly the Putney-East Putney change could be used for a Mortlake to Wimbledon journey, for example. Perhaps it's quicker to stay on SWT changing at Clapham Junction, perhaps the time difference is negligable though, and changing at Putney would avoid zone 2 so could work out cheaper for season ticket holders (and in the future presumably cheaper for Oyster Pre-Pay users once NR starts fully accepting it). No it wouldn't - you'd be charged for two journeys instead of one (unless they make it an "official" interchange, but there's no sign of them doing that with e.g. Northwick Park and Kenton which are in a similar situation). Changing at Putney would still save money for Pre-Pay users in some circumstances. We've no idea yet as to whether NR journeys will be charged at the same Pre-Pay fares as LU journeys, but let's presume they are (and I'll use the weekday daytime Pre-Pay fares here [1]). If the whole journey was from Richmond (zone 4) to Wimbledon (zone 3), then the fares would work out like this... (Peak return prices presume outbound journey made in the morning between 0430 and 0930) * via Clapham Junction Single Richmond/zone 4 to Clapham Junction/zone 2 - £1.80 Single Clapham Junction/zone 2 to Wimbledon/zone 3 - £1.00 Total for one-way journey - £2.80 Off-peak return - £3.80 with daily capping Peak return - £5.60 ....Peak daily capping wouldn't kick in until £6.30 is reached. * via Putney / East Putney Single Richmond/zone 4 to East Putney/zone 3 - £1.00 Single East Putney/zone 3 to Wimbledon/zone 3 - £1.00 Total for one-way journey - £2.00 Off-peak return - £3.80 with daily capping Peak return - £4.00 ....again peak daily capping wouldn't kick in. So for a single journey you pay 80p less. Not a great deal, but it's an off-peak bus fare, plus count the pennies etc. I'd certainly take that as motivation to at least consider walking the short distance in Putney. And if you're making a return journey setting out in the morning peak then it'd also be worth your while. There wouldn't be any saving for an off-peak return journey. However I'd be very wary of falling into the trap of assuming that all passengers want to make a return journey (or at least one by the same route as the outbound journey), as there are so many good reasons why people might not behave according to this assumption. [1] http://www.tfl.gov.uk/tfl/fares-tick.../tubedlr.shtml |
The best non-interchange interchanges
asdf wrote:
On 2 Jul 2006 17:09:17 -0700, Mizter T wrote: Changing at Putney would still save money for Pre-Pay users in some circumstances. [...] * via Clapham Junction Single Richmond/zone 4 to Clapham Junction/zone 2 - £1.80 Single Clapham Junction/zone 2 to Wimbledon/zone 3 - £1.00 Total for one-way journey - £2.80 I was assuming that Clapham Junction would be an "official" interchange, so you'd just be charged for a single Z234 journey (in the same way that currently, if you travel from Park Royal to Northwick Park using pre-pay, you don't get charged for separate Park Royal - Rayners Lane and Rayners Lane - Northwick Park journeys just because you changed trains there). Yes, what you say is a perfectly logical assumption, which for some reason I hadn't considered, and it (almost) completely destroys my argument! I must've been thinking that the change of direction (as it were) at Clapham Junction made a difference, but on re-thinking things, it wouldn't. So, as you say, the Richmond - Wimbledon Pre-Pay fare would (presumably) be a zones 2-4 single at £1.80. Thus the only way that the Putney to East Putney change would save money would be if it was designated an 'official interchange', which I guess is unlikely. And of course the change at Putney could mean season Travelcard holders could avoid having to buy zone 2 validity. |
The best non-interchange interchanges
DERWENT The best non-interchange interchanges
2 Jul 2006 17:35:38 -0700, "Mizter T" Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article , (Dave Arquati) wrote: Colin Rosenstiel wrote: In article om, (Mizter T) wrote: Putney NR to East Putney (District Line Wimbledon Branch) Ugh! They're not very close. What journey combination would it be useful for? Local journeys from points west on SWT to places on the District branch - e.g. Twickenham to Fulham Broadway? I'd probably opt for the bus from Putney NR instead in that case, but some people prefer a Tube/train option. FSVO "some" I suspect. I can't imagine the number doing the interchange is more than minuscule. My thread was perhaps misnamed. Whilst the list contains many really good 'non-interchange interchanges' (let's call them 'distant interchanges'), it's arguably more a list of stations that are in relative proximity to one another - a proximity which you often can't discern from the Tube/London Connections map - and speculation as to how useful some of these changes would be for various journeys (traffic flows in the planners parlance). http://www.hanzoweb.com/archive/20060313155845/http://rodcorp.typepad.com/rodcorp/2003/10/london_tube_map.html check out the line wrap first though. PRAR -- http://www.i.am/prar/ and http://prar.fotopic.net/ As long as people will accept crap, it will be financially profitable to dispense it. --Dick Cavett Please reply to the newsgroup. That is why it exists. NB Anti-spam measures in force - If you must email me use the Reply to address and not |
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