Charles Ellson wrote:

Or going in the other direction, the DLR stuff possibly doesn't need
much modification to tram standard for venturing out onto any local
tramways that might be built (oink, oink, flap, flap) which would
probably also be standard gauge.

....though the side-contact third rail system might not go down too well
in Piccadilly Gardens...

(Actually, I believe the original DLR stock which was sold on to Essen
has had pantographs installed without too much trouble, so I'm just
being facetious.)

Ian Jelf wrote:

Er actually I think it may have been! I believe that Stephenson's
Crich Mineral Railway in Derbyshire was the first recorded use of 1m
gauge track.

And the Malaysian state railway is both largely British-built and metre
gauge.

It even has Class 323-derived EMUs running around Kuala Lumpur.
Scarily familiar!

Neil

In article ,
Ian Jelf wrote:
In message , Tony Polson
writes
Because metre gauge was "not invented here".

Er actually I think it may have been! I believe that Stephenson's
Crich Mineral Railway in Derbyshire was the first recorded use of 1m
gauge track.

(That said, I can't find a reference on line and nor can I remember
where I learned this.)

And even before that, 3'3"-and-a-bit would be right in the middle
of the range of gauges used in Shropshire-type railways (see, for example,
M.J.T. Lewis' "Early wooden railways")..

--
Andy Breen ~ Not speaking on behalf of the University of Wales, Aberystwyth
Feng Shui: an ancient oriental art for extracting
money from the gullible (Martin Sinclair)

In message om, Rupert
Candy writes

...though the side-contact third rail system might not go down too well
in Piccadilly Gardens...

(Actually, I believe the original DLR stock which was sold on to Essen
has had pantographs installed without too much trouble, so I'm just
being facetious.)

It has indeed, and been fitted with 'proper' driving cabs and was
spotted a few months ago being driven down real streets on the U17.

http://www.g7kkh.co.uk/Stuff/DSCN1372.JPG

shows such a beast.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

Boltar wrote:

Charles Ellson wrote:
.. and would also make it difficult for any kind of mixed running on
or off the DLR which might occur in the future.

I can't see that ever happening. I doubt much if any standard mainline
stock
would be able to negotiate the sharp bends or steep inclines on the DLR
and the DLR stock uses a unique (in britain) 3rd rail system so it
couldn't run
under its own power anywhere else unless modified. And then theres the
good old HSE to factor in with mixed running rules etc....

I think the OP was thinking more in terms of DLR trains running on
Network Rail lines rather than vice versa (though you're probably still
right about the HSE). Of course if/when the Stratford International
extension happens, the DLR will be taking over Network Rail standard
infrastructure (i.e. the end of the North London Line) and converting
the electrical system from standard 3rd rail to side-contact.

Steve Fitzgerald wrote:

In message om, Rupert
Candy writes

...though the side-contact third rail system might not go down too well
in Piccadilly Gardens...

(Actually, I believe the original DLR stock which was sold on to Essen
has had pantographs installed without too much trouble, so I'm just
being facetious.)

It has indeed, and been fitted with 'proper' driving cabs and was
spotted a few months ago being driven down real streets on the U17.

I didn't know they did on-street running. Does that line have high
platforms, then? (Dragging us back on topic, that shows that the DLR
could, given pantographs, cope with street running extensions...)

On 31 Jul 2006 07:06:24 -0700, "Rupert Candy"
wrote:


Boltar wrote:

Charles Ellson wrote:
.. and would also make it difficult for any kind of mixed running on
or off the DLR which might occur in the future.

I can't see that ever happening. I doubt much if any standard mainline
stock
would be able to negotiate the sharp bends or steep inclines on the DLR
and the DLR stock uses a unique (in britain) 3rd rail system so it
couldn't run
under its own power anywhere else unless modified. And then theres the
good old HSE to factor in with mixed running rules etc....

I think the OP was thinking more in terms of DLR trains running on
Network Rail lines rather than vice versa (though you're probably still
right about the HSE). Of course if/when the Stratford International
extension happens, the DLR will be taking over Network Rail standard
infrastructure (i.e. the end of the North London Line) and converting
the electrical system from standard 3rd rail to side-contact.

Bearing in mind the coupled working of 508s and 313s, it might not be
impossible for future parts of DLR to use tramway-style power supplies
mixed (where necessary) with the existing system. The only thing that
might be difficult is dual-equipped stock if such stock was also
required to have retractable shoegear (i.e. the vehicles would need
the space for the gear to retract into) in the event of street-running
taking place.
--
_______
+---------------------------------------------------+ |\\ //|
| Charles Ellson: | | \\ // |
+---------------------------------------------------+ | |
| // \\ |
Alba gu brath |//___\\|

Rupert Candy wrote:
Steve Fitzgerald wrote:

In message om, Rupert
Candy writes

...though the side-contact third rail system might not go down too well
in Piccadilly Gardens...

(Actually, I believe the original DLR stock which was sold on to Essen
has had pantographs installed without too much trouble, so I'm just
being facetious.)
It has indeed, and been fitted with 'proper' driving cabs and was
spotted a few months ago being driven down real streets on the U17.

I didn't know they did on-street running. Does that line have high
platforms, then? (Dragging us back on topic, that shows that the DLR
could, given pantographs, cope with street running extensions...)

No - the DLR would have to be given driving cabs as well, with a
consequent change in the entire operation of the system (most likely for
the worse).

--
Dave Arquati
Imperial College, SW7
www.alwaystouchout.com - Transport projects in London

In message .com,
Rupert Candy writes

It has indeed, and been fitted with 'proper' driving cabs and was
spotted a few months ago being driven down real streets on the U17.

I didn't know they did on-street running. Does that line have high
platforms, then? (Dragging us back on topic, that shows that the DLR
could, given pantographs, cope with street running extensions...)

Yes it does - high platforms at every station.
--
Steve Fitzgerald has now left the building.
You will find him in London's Docklands, E16, UK
(please use the reply to address for email)

Dave Arquati wrote:

No - the DLR would have to be given driving cabs as well, with a
consequent change in the entire operation of the system (most likely for
the worse).

Why would there be a 'consequent change to the entire operation of the
system'?

It's would be quite feasible to operate in auto mode as far as the last
station on the segregated stretch, have a driver board, and switch to
manual for the remainder of the journey.