From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.

John Rowland wrote:

From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.

You might have a point - that said, doing it this way creates
uniformity and clarity.

One thing that I was never sure about was whether it would be possible
to get on the Westway from Edgware Road without going into the zone -
thankfully I see this can be done by going via Praed Street -
Eastbourne Terrace - Bishops Bridge Road etc.

Mizter T wrote:
John Rowland wrote:

From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western
extension will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the
inside of the cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street,
Redfield Lane, Lawrence Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this
hard to understand. How much does each camera cost? Since Childs
Street contains nothing but houses, all of whose residents will
qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will take the Childs
Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay for
itself.

You might have a point - that said, doing it this way creates
uniformity and clarity.

One thing that I was never sure about was whether it would be possible
to get on the Westway from Edgware Road without going into the zone -
thankfully I see this can be done by going via Praed Street -
Eastbourne Terrace - Bishops Bridge Road etc.

It is shorter via Harrow Road and Bishops Bridge.

I'm not sure why Eastbourne Terrace and Praed St are outside the zone.

John Rowland wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
John Rowland wrote:

From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western
extension will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the
inside of the cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street,
Redfield Lane, Lawrence Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this
hard to understand. How much does each camera cost? Since Childs
Street contains nothing but houses, all of whose residents will
qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will take the Childs
Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay for
itself.

You might have a point - that said, doing it this way creates
uniformity and clarity.

One thing that I was never sure about was whether it would be possible
to get on the Westway from Edgware Road without going into the zone -
thankfully I see this can be done by going via Praed Street -
Eastbourne Terrace - Bishops Bridge Road etc.

It is shorter via Harrow Road and Bishops Bridge.

I'm not sure why Eastbourne Terrace and Praed St are outside the zone.

Good point, hadn't thought of that (not used to the Bridge being open
again!). Possibly those streets are exempt to allow 'free' access to
Paddington station and St. Mary's hospital.

John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.

Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car parks ?
Wll they be fitted with cameras or just visited occasionally by a
warden ?

Jon

Jon wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.

Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car parks ?

If they're off the *inside* of the cordon, probably not.


--

Stephen

That is enigmatic. That - that is - that is textbook enigmatic.

Stephen Farrow wrote:

Jon wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.

Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car parks ?

If they're off the *inside* of the cordon, probably not.


Not sure exactly what you mean by that Stephen. The roads in question
are within the zone, but are cul-de-sacs where the only means of access
is from the boundary of the zone, not from anywhere within the zone -
i.e. by driving up one you'd hit a dead end, and wouldn't get any
further into the zone. John's point is whether it's worth including
these in the zone as the costs of enforcement (putting up statc camers)
would be too great.

Mizter T wrote:
Stephen Farrow wrote:

Jon wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.
Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car parks ?
If they're off the *inside* of the cordon, probably not.


Not sure exactly what you mean by that Stephen.

If access to the cul-de-sacs in question is from inside the zone, which
the original message suggested it was ("off the inside of the cordon",
as opposed to, say, "cul-de-sacs/dead-end streets extending into the
congestion zone"), then the reason for installing cameras on those
streets would be unlikely to be to stop people from using the streets as
free edge-of-zone parking, since they'd have to drive into the zone to
get to those streets anyway.

--

Stephen

If I believed in fairy tales I never would have dropped out of kindergarten.

Stephen Farrow wrote:
Mizter T wrote:
Stephen Farrow wrote:

Jon wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the
western extension will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and
similar, off the inside of the cordon, for instance Blantyre
Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence Street,
Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How
much does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains
nothing but houses, all of whose residents will qualify for the
exemption, I wonder how long it will take the Childs Street
camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay for
itself.
Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car
parks ?
If they're off the *inside* of the cordon, probably not.


Not sure exactly what you mean by that Stephen.

If access to the cul-de-sacs in question is from inside the zone,
which the original message suggested it was ("off the inside of the
cordon", as opposed to, say, "cul-de-sacs/dead-end streets extending
into the congestion zone"), then the reason for installing cameras on
those streets would be unlikely to be to stop
people from using the streets as free edge-of-zone parking, since
they'd have to drive into the zone to get to those streets anyway.

You don't seem to realise that the "cordon" itself is outside the zone,
the boundary being on its inner edge. So the cul-de-sacs can only be
entered from outside the zone, but are themselves within it.
--
Richard J.
(to e-mail me, swap uk and yon in address)

Stephen Farrow wrote:

Mizter T wrote:
Stephen Farrow wrote:

Jon wrote:
John Rowland wrote:
From the maps on the cclondon website, it looks like the western extension
will include a number of cul-de-sacs, and similar, off the inside of the
cordon, for instance Blantyre Street, Childs Street, Redfield Lane, Lawrence
Street, Embankment Gardens etc. I find this hard to understand. How much
does each camera cost? Since Childs Street contains nothing but houses, all
of whose residents will qualify for the exemption, I wonder how long it will
take the Childs Street camera to pay for itself, or whether it will ever pay
for itself.
Could it be to stop people using these roads as zone-edge car parks ?
If they're off the *inside* of the cordon, probably not.


Not sure exactly what you mean by that Stephen.

If access to the cul-de-sacs in question is from inside the zone, which
the original message suggested it was ("off the inside of the cordon",
as opposed to, say, "cul-de-sacs/dead-end streets extending into the
congestion zone"), then the reason for installing cameras on those
streets would be unlikely to be to stop people from using the streets as
free edge-of-zone parking, since they'd have to drive into the zone to
get to those streets anyway.


The OP was referring to cul-de-sacs that ingress into the zone from
uncharged boundary roads. I'm not going to get into quibbles about the
terminology used! To be honest I had a fair idea of what he was on
about but on reading his post I immediately looked those examples up on
a map so I had an explicit understanding of his point.

See Childs Street for yourself via Multiimap
http://tinyurl.com/y3azr5 and all will be clear.