Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

I've noticed, in the past few weeks, a decrease in courtesy when trains
actually wait for passengers to leave the arriving train across the
platform.

Sorry, that made no sense did it? I'm talking about things like Finchley
Road (Metropolitan to Jubilee) and Mile End (District to Central) and vice
versa.

In the past, if a train already on one platform gets there first, and the
train on the other platform is just pulling in, they used to wait for the
passengers on the second train to get out and run across the platform to
the waiting one.

Over the past month or two I've noticed that trains are closing their doors
on one just as the new train is opening its doors to let passengers off.

This has particularly been the case on the District/Central interchange at
Mile End.

Now, I don't mind if there's another train 1 minute behind, but this
morning, and last night, it was about 7 minutes when I went from Central to
District at Mile End, and about 4 minutes when I went from District to
Central this morning.

Have drivers been told no longer to wait? Has there been a general "don't
give a ****" increase among drivers or controllers? What's going on?

I must say though that the courtesy between DLR trains at Poplar (people
going from Canary Wharf to Beckton and changing at Poplar) is still alive
and well and trains indeed wait. But no such courtesy between District and
Central any more.

I've only witnessed this lack of courtesy at Finchley Road once, so perhaps
that was a one-off. And I don't use this interchange much. But I use the
Mile End one every day and it's getting increasingly on my goat.



BEFORE ANYONE LEAPS DOWN MY THROAT AND TALKS ABOUT HAVING TO STICK TO
TIMETABLES ETC - I just wanted to say that IN THE PAST they waited, they
don't now (or they're less likely to do so now). That's all.

Sorry for being so indistinct. Probably didn't make a lot of sense there.
:-))

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

On Mon, 22 Jan 2007 17:32:16 -0600, "Tristán White"
wrote:

I've noticed, in the past few weeks, a decrease in courtesy when trains
actually wait for passengers to leave the arriving train across the
platform.

Sorry, that made no sense did it? I'm talking about things like Finchley
Road (Metropolitan to Jubilee) and Mile End (District to Central) and vice
versa.

I've noticed this at Hammersmith/Barons Court, too.

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

Tristán White wrote:

I've noticed, in the past few weeks, a decrease in courtesy when trains
actually wait for passengers to leave the arriving train across the
platform.

Sorry, that made no sense did it? I'm talking about things like Finchley
Road (Metropolitan to Jubilee) and Mile End (District to Central) and vice
versa.

(snip)

I must say though that the courtesy between DLR trains at Poplar (people
going from Canary Wharf to Beckton and changing at Poplar) is still alive
and well and trains indeed wait. But no such courtesy between District and
Central any more.

The courtesy you speak of at Poplar is courtesy of the computer! The
DLR timetable is specifically designed to enable cross-platform
interchange between two trains at Poplar - if you observe what happens
there you'll see that two trains very often pull into the two faces of
the island platforms (i.e. facing each other across the island
platform) at the same time - this is no accident!

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

Tristán White wrote:
I've noticed, in the past few weeks, a decrease in courtesy when trains
actually wait for passengers to leave the arriving train across the
platform.

Sorry, that made no sense did it? I'm talking about things like Finchley
Road (Metropolitan to Jubilee) and Mile End (District to Central) and vice
versa.

In the past, if a train already on one platform gets there first, and the
train on the other platform is just pulling in, they used to wait for the
passengers on the second train to get out and run across the platform to
the waiting one.

Over the past month or two I've noticed that trains are closing their doors
on one just as the new train is opening its doors to let passengers off.

This has particularly been the case on the District/Central interchange at
Mile End.

Now, I don't mind if there's another train 1 minute behind, but this
morning, and last night, it was about 7 minutes when I went from Central to
District at Mile End, and about 4 minutes when I went from District to
Central this morning.

Have drivers been told no longer to wait? Has there been a general "don't
give a ****" increase among drivers or controllers? What's going on?

I must say though that the courtesy between DLR trains at Poplar (people
going from Canary Wharf to Beckton and changing at Poplar) is still alive
and well and trains indeed wait. But no such courtesy between District and
Central any more.

I've only witnessed this lack of courtesy at Finchley Road once, so perhaps
that was a one-off. And I don't use this interchange much. But I use the
Mile End one every day and it's getting increasingly on my goat.



BEFORE ANYONE LEAPS DOWN MY THROAT AND TALKS ABOUT HAVING TO STICK TO
TIMETABLES ETC - I just wanted to say that IN THE PAST they waited, they
don't now (or they're less likely to do so now). That's all.

Sorry for being so indistinct. Probably didn't make a lot of sense there.
:-))



I wouldn't be surprised, given that bus drivers are definitely
instructed not to stop at compulsory bus stops any more, unless someone
very forcefully requests it, and given that "target dwell times" at
each station are an instruction to shut doors on passengers (I've had
an admission of this in writing).

However, it occurs to me that there used to be signs addressed to the
guard at places like Mile End, asking them to wait. Now that there
aren't any guards, it's less practical for the driver to be keeping an
eye out for trains in a different platform, being only able to look in
mirror at their own train. Another benefit of reducing staff ...

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

MIG wrote:

Tristán White wrote:
I've noticed, in the past few weeks, a decrease in courtesy when trains
actually wait for passengers to leave the arriving train across the
platform.

(snip)


I wouldn't be surprised, given that bus drivers are definitely
instructed not to stop at compulsory bus stops any more, unless someone
very forcefully requests it, and given that "target dwell times" at
each station are an instruction to shut doors on passengers (I've had
an admission of this in writing).

I've not really noticed such problems at bus stops - what I have
noticed is people being lazy and not requesting their bus, expecting it
will stop because it always does. Though yes, on reflection, on a few
occasions at busy times when there's been a queue of buses at the stop
I have seen one of them sail by on the outside lane.


However, it occurs to me that there used to be signs addressed to the
guard at places like Mile End, asking them to wait. Now that there
aren't any guards, it's less practical for the driver to be keeping an
eye out for trains in a different platform, being only able to look in
mirror at their own train. Another benefit of reducing staff ...

I've seen such signs recently-ish, perhaps at Finchley Rd or Queens
Park (or both), so it's not something that vanished with the guards.
Perhaps it's a result of each lines punctuality drive - maybe they're
getting competitive between themselves?

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

Mizter T wrote:

I've not really noticed such problems at bus stops - what I have
noticed is people being lazy and not requesting their bus, expecting it
will stop because it always does.

Could some of them be foreign? I ask because in Germany it is not
necessary to signal a bus to stop - indeed, it is more usual to wave it
past if you do *not* want it. In the Netherlands it is usually not
necessary to signal.

Notably in Milton Keynes people often don't on even the hail and ride
routes - yet I've never noticed anyone appear to get missed as a
result. The drivers must be psychic...

Neil

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

Moving back to the tubes, I've noticed the same at Stockwell changing
from Northern to Victoria - in this case although the link between the
platforms is not open for the drivers to see, it's clear that when a
large group of passengers walk out onto the platform that a northern
line train has just emptied out, yet the driver will invariably close
the doors and pull out. While at peak times this is no great loss as
there won't be a long delay between VL services, off-peak it can mean
7-9 minutes wasted at times. What's more, in this case the VL train is
invariably empty having just left Brixton, so LU is basically wasting
not only the infrastructure of having the tube lines running parallel
but also the capacity! Can it be that hard to have a cctv feed from the
opposite platform for the driver to see??


Neil Williams wrote:

Mizter T wrote:

I've not really noticed such problems at bus stops - what I have
noticed is people being lazy and not requesting their bus, expecting it
will stop because it always does.

Could some of them be foreign? I ask because in Germany it is not
necessary to signal a bus to stop - indeed, it is more usual to wave it
past if you do *not* want it. In the Netherlands it is usually not
necessary to signal.

Notably in Milton Keynes people often don't on even the hail and ride
routes - yet I've never noticed anyone appear to get missed as a
result. The drivers must be psychic...

Neil

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

On 22 Jan 2007 23:26:02 -0800, Neil Williams wrote:

Could some of them be foreign? I ask because in Germany it is not
necessary to signal a bus to stop - indeed, it is more usual to wave it
past if you do *not* want it. In the Netherlands it is usually not
necessary to signal.

Also on stops served by more than one line? Here in Kristiansand, Norway
the custom is for buses to always stop on the part of the routes that are
not served by other lines, elsewhere you have to signal.

--
jhk

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

Neil Williams wrote:
Mizter T wrote:

I've not really noticed such problems at bus stops - what I have
noticed is people being lazy and not requesting their bus, expecting it
will stop because it always does.

Could some of them be foreign? I ask because in Germany it is not
necessary to signal a bus to stop - indeed, it is more usual to wave it
past if you do *not* want it. In the Netherlands it is usually not
necessary to signal.

I think maybe Mizter T means people *inside* the bus not requesting the
stop? Everywhere I have traveled by bus in Germany it has been necessary
to press a button to signal a stop.
--
Michael Hoffman

Trains no longer waiting for pulling-up train
 

"artemis99" wrote in message
oups.com...

Moving back to the tubes, I've noticed the same at Stockwell changing
from Northern to Victoria -

Absolutely. And changing from a Bank train cross-platform to a Charging
Cross train at Kennington.

They do it to wind the passengers up - there can't be any other reason.

Ian