Morning all,

The branch line from Hayes and Harlington to Heathrow Airport is being, or
has been, extended to Terminal 5, right?

Now, warm-up question, what's that line called? I have a map calling the
tracks 'up airport' and 'down airport', so is it the 'Great Western
airport line'? That sounds absurd clunky. But if i just call it the
Heathrow line, people might think i mean a bit of the Picc. Anyway.

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5 is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

Oh, and how are the railway and the Piccadilly line disposed at T5? Will
they be at the same level or what?

Are there diagrams of this somewhere that i can look at?

tom

--
Subvert the paradigm!

"Tom Anderson" wrote in message
h.li...
Morning all,

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5 is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.


T5 has space for 6 tracks and 6 platforms, 2 for HEx, 2 for Picc, and 2 for
Airtrack but those for Airtrack will be partitioned off until required. I
believe the Piccadilly line to T5 will operate as separate arrival and
departure platforms, with a headshunt for trains, but HEx will operate to
either of its two platforms, with a crossover on the upside of the platforms

Paul

On Wed, 19 Sep 2007 10:37:58 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote:

Morning all,

The branch line from Hayes and Harlington to Heathrow Airport is being, or
has been, extended to Terminal 5, right?

Correct.

Now, warm-up question, what's that line called? I have a map calling the
tracks 'up airport' and 'down airport', so is it the 'Great Western
airport line'? That sounds absurd clunky. But if i just call it the
Heathrow line, people might think i mean a bit of the Picc. Anyway.

Don't know the name.

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5 is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

I thought the HEX tunnel was dual track but I may be wrong.

The station at T5 is big enough for 6 tracks - 4 for HEX / BAA and two
for LU Piccadilly Line.

Oh, and how are the railway and the Piccadilly line disposed at T5? Will
they be at the same level or what?

They are all on the same level as I understand it. The plan I have seen
certainly shows it that way.

Are there diagrams of this somewhere that i can look at?

Unfortunately the plans of the station I have seen are on our meeting
room wall at Broadway and I'm on my hols at present so I can't really
take you there ;-)

http://www.baa.com/assets/B2CPortal/...il_tunnels.pdf

might help with a bit more info.
--
Paul C


Admits to working for London Underground!

On Sep 19, 11:00 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"Tom Anderson" wrote in message

h.li...

Morning all,

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5 is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

T5 has space for 6 tracks and 6 platforms, 2 for HEx, 2 for Picc, and 2 for
Airtrack but those for Airtrack will be partitioned off until required. I
believe the Piccadilly line to T5 will operate as separate arrival and
departure platforms, with a headshunt for trains, but HEx will operate to
either of its two platforms, with a crossover on the upside of the platforms

Paul

That is correct, Picc line trains will arrive at platform 5, detrain,
then reverse via one of the two sidings, re-entering service at
platform 6.
The platforms are connected via lifts and escalators, to some sort of
circulating area/lobby above the rail lines. The Heathrow Express
platforms also have those flash blue lights under the platform edge!
Each railway is partitioned off, but at the west end of the platforms,
they have changed it to glass.

On Sep 19, 10:37 am, Tom Anderson wrote:
Now, warm-up question, what's that line called? I have a map calling the
tracks 'up airport' and 'down airport', so is it the 'Great Western
airport line'? That sounds absurd clunky. But if i just call it the
Heathrow line, people might think i mean a bit of the Picc. Anyway.

The branch itself is usually just called the Heathrow Airport spur or
similar.

I think the names "Up Airport" and "Down Airport" exist mainly to
differentiate them from th main/relief lines during the section where
the GWML has 6 tracks.

T5 to T123 won't mix well.
So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true?

AFIAK the route to T4 is double track throughout, but it has an
unusual platform crossover that essentially acts as a short single
track section. The route to T5 is also double track, though the
junction might be single lead.

Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch from

I assume since AirTrack has its own platforms at T5, it will terminate
there rather than running through to Central.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

"chunky munky" wrote in message
oups.com...
On Sep 19, 11:00 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"Tom Anderson" wrote in message

h.li...

Morning all,

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down
for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5
is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch
from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

T5 has space for 6 tracks and 6 platforms, 2 for HEx, 2 for Picc, and 2
for
Airtrack but those for Airtrack will be partitioned off until required.
I
believe the Piccadilly line to T5 will operate as separate arrival and
departure platforms, with a headshunt for trains, but HEx will operate to
either of its two platforms, with a crossover on the upside of the
platforms

Paul

That is correct, Picc line trains will arrive at platform 5, detrain,
then reverse via one of the two sidings, re-entering service at
platform 6.
The platforms are connected via lifts and escalators, to some sort of
circulating area/lobby above the rail lines. The Heathrow Express
platforms also have those flash blue lights under the platform edge!
Each railway is partitioned off, but at the west end of the platforms,
they have changed it to glass.


Am I right in saying that the Picc platforms don't have edge doors like the
JLE either - which puts paid to that as being a compulsory 'safety
requirement' in all future underground stations...

Paul

On Sep 19, 11:42 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"chunky munky" wrote in message

oups.com...



On Sep 19, 11:00 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"Tom Anderson" wrote in message

rth.li...

Morning all,

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down
for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5
is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch
from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

T5 has space for 6 tracks and 6 platforms, 2 for HEx, 2 for Picc, and 2
for
Airtrack but those for Airtrack will be partitioned off until required.
I
believe the Piccadilly line to T5 will operate as separate arrival and
departure platforms, with a headshunt for trains, but HEx will operate to
either of its two platforms, with a crossover on the upside of the
platforms

Paul

That is correct, Picc line trains will arrive at platform 5, detrain,
then reverse via one of the two sidings, re-entering service at
platform 6.
The platforms are connected via lifts and escalators, to some sort of
circulating area/lobby above the rail lines. The Heathrow Express
platforms also have those flash blue lights under the platform edge!
Each railway is partitioned off, but at the west end of the platforms,
they have changed it to glass.

Am I right in saying that the Picc platforms don't have edge doors like the
JLE either - which puts paid to that as being a compulsory 'safety
requirement' in all future underground stations...

Paul

There are no Platform Edge Doors. The were installed on the JLE due to
the newer fire regulations/air circulation and to ventilate the
tunnels when needed, along with fans.

Of course they are handy at stopping people and litter ending up on
the track.

I did notice that the tunnels are much wider than normal, and you
could possibly stand in the "cess" and have a train pass, not that
this would be allowed!

On Sep 19, 12:25 pm, chunky munky
wrote:
On Sep 19, 11:42 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:



"chunky munky" wrote in message

roups.com...

On Sep 19, 11:00 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:
"Tom Anderson" wrote in message

rth.li...

Morning all,

So, that line is two-track to Heathrow Central, where it singles down
for
the bit to T4. This map i have also shows the extension to T5 as
single-track. Is that true? I have also read that the station box at T5
is
big enough for four tracks and four platforms; even with an eye to
building AirTrack in the future, that seems like overkill for a single
track line. Not to mention that AirTrack and a single-track stretch
from
T5 to T123 won't mix well.

T5 has space for 6 tracks and 6 platforms, 2 for HEx, 2 for Picc, and 2
for
Airtrack but those for Airtrack will be partitioned off until required.
I
believe the Piccadilly line to T5 will operate as separate arrival and
departure platforms, with a headshunt for trains, but HEx will operate to
either of its two platforms, with a crossover on the upside of the
platforms

Paul

That is correct, Picc line trains will arrive at platform 5, detrain,
then reverse via one of the two sidings, re-entering service at
platform 6.
The platforms are connected via lifts and escalators, to some sort of
circulating area/lobby above the rail lines. The Heathrow Express
platforms also have those flash blue lights under the platform edge!
Each railway is partitioned off, but at the west end of the platforms,
they have changed it to glass.

Am I right in saying that the Picc platforms don't have edge doors like the
JLE either - which puts paid to that as being a compulsory 'safety
requirement' in all future underground stations...

Paul

There are no Platform Edge Doors. The were installed on the JLE due to
the newer fire regulations/air circulation and to ventilate the
tunnels when needed, along with fans.

So why don't these regs apply to T5? As the OP says , the fact they're
not there means all that safety talk about them on the JLE was a load
of ********.

B2003

"Boltar" wrote in message
ups.com...
On Sep 19, 12:25 pm, chunky munky
wrote:
On Sep 19, 11:42 am, "Paul Scott"
wrote:

Am I right in saying that the Picc platforms don't have edge doors like
the
JLE either - which puts paid to that as being a compulsory 'safety
requirement' in all future underground stations...

Paul

There are no Platform Edge Doors. The were installed on the JLE due to
the newer fire regulations/air circulation and to ventilate the
tunnels when needed, along with fans.

So why don't these regs apply to T5? As the OP says , the fact they're
not there means all that safety talk about them on the JLE was a load
of ********.

Thats what I'd believed - IIRC other LU insiders have said before that they
are mainly to do with ventilation, and draughtproofing - the safety features
are just a bonus...

Paul

Boltar wrote:

So why don't these regs apply to T5? As the OP says , the fact they're
not there means all that safety talk about them on the JLE was a load
of ********.

The "official" explanation for the PEDs being installed on the JLE has
always been that they're for ventilation purposes. The enhanced safety
is an added bonus.

Primary reason being that if the HSE thought that safety was their
primary purpose, they'd make LU install them at all the other deep level
stations, which'd cost a fortune...Doubly so when/if the stock is
replaced if the doors don't line up with the PEDs.

Cheers,

Barry