I have found
Three Colts Bridge in Victoria Park
Three Colt Street in Limehouse
Three Colts Lane in Bethnal Green.

I have not come across any Three Colt references in any other part of London
(although this here interweb says that there is a Three Colts pub in
Buckhurst Hill). Does anyone know why Three Colts are so common in the East
End?

On Wed, 16 Jan 2008, John Rowland wrote:

I have found

Three Colts Bridge in Victoria Park
Three Colt Street in Limehouse
Three Colts Lane in Bethnal Green.

You have missed

Three Colts Corner in Shoreditch
Three Colts Alley in Bishopsgate, plus one in Wapping
Three Colts Court
Three Colts Yard, three of them: London Wall, Fenchurch Street and Mile End

Right, let's start with Three Colts Corner, as i like a good corner.
According to:

http://www.urban75.org/london/london-corners.html

It's the corner of Cheshire and Weaver streets, although according to a
current map, these streets don't have a corner, due to the Great Eastern
mainline running between them. In 1827, there was no railway:

http://users.bathspa.ac.uk/greenwood/map_c8u.html

But also no Weaver Street (the point is near the centre of the map - look
for a workhouse, which is a black square with a hole in; St Matthews
church is a useful fixed point here). There is a junction with a
now-disappeared Winchester Street, though, which could perhaps be the
corner in question.

For validation, according to:

http://www.taxiknowledge.co.uk/e1.html [1]

Three Colts Corner is on Cheshire Street, "on left from Vallance [Road]".
Three Colts Lane is of course not far from there, being a continuation of
Cheshire Street itself, but they seem to be different. Speaking of
continuations of Cheshire Street, i notice that where now Sclater Street
becomes Cheshire Street on crossing Brick Lane, in 1827, it became Hare
Street, and only became Cheshire Street around where i think Three Colts
Corner is.

This spot was filmed for The Avengers:

http://avengerland.theavengers.tv/spotting/spot20.htm

Although i think the naming is supplied by this alleged Stephen Carter.

Going back to the 1827 map, Three Colts Lane didn't exist then (look for
Bethnal Green Road on the west side of the image, which was then called
The Dog Row, and then find Bethnal Green itself beside it, and the gardens
to the south; Three Colts Lane today heads west from Bethnal Green Road
opposite the south end of the gardens):

http://users.bathspa.ac.uk/greenwood/map_c9u.html

As for the other places ...

Boyle's View of London, of 1799, mentions a number of three-colt places:

http://www.londonancestor.com/boyle/str-t.htm

Namely (copied and pasted, my notes in square brackets):

Three colts alley, Bishopsgate within
Three colts alley, Cinnamon street [Wapping]
Three colts court, Three colts street
Three colts corner, St. John's street [can't find a St John's St east of
the one that runs from Angel to Smithfield]
Three colts lane, Hare street, Spitalfields [see above on Hare Street]
Three colts street, Limehouse
Three colts yard, Crutched friars [runs under Fenchurch Street station]
Three colts yard, London wall
Three colts yard, Mile End

Which are all City or east.

There have been two Three Colt Courts, according to:

http://www.motco.com/Harben/5349.htm

One of which was off Crutched Friars, and so probably the same as one of
Boyle's Three Colts Yards, and one of which was also known as Three Colts
Alley and Lloyds Yard, and is now part of the GEML alignment. I can't work
out exactly where this was - could it have been where Three Colts Corner
seems to be?

John Strype wrote a survey of London:

http://www.hrionline.ac.uk/strype/Tr...page=book2_108

In which he describes Three Colts Alley (the Bishopsgate one, i think) as
"but small and ordinary".

I have not come across any Three Colt references in any other part of
London (although this here interweb says that there is a Three Colts pub
in Buckhurst Hill).

One in Stansted Mountfitchet, too. And, in 1840, in Sandwich, Kent:

http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb....dwich_&_c_.htm

In 1662, there's one at St Andrews Undershaft (the church on Leadenhall
that was named for the giant maypole which sat next to it until it was
burned as a heathen idol in 1549):

http://freepages.history.rootsweb.co.../HC1662/AB.htm

Here's a good one. There was such a pub (in the first half of the 18th
century, i think) in the hamlet of Grove Street, which was presumably
somewhere along what we now call Grove Road:

http://www.british-history.ac.uk/rep...x?compid=22704

That article has a map which shows it (right at the bottom); finding that
spot on the Greenwood map reveals the name again:

http://users.bathspa.ac.uk/greenwood/map_a9h.html

Correlating that with a modern map puts it at the bridge over the Hertford
Union Canal - which, surprise surprise, is the Three Colts Bridge you
found.

Does anyone know why Three Colts are so common in the East End?

My theory is that it was a common name for pubs, and the places picked
their names up from pubs, as is not unusual (particularly for corners,
courts, yards, alleys, etc). The Victoria Park case is a striking example
of this: you have a pub in 17xx, a placename in 1827, and a bridge today.

The really interesting question is why it was a common name for a pub. The
true secret behind the Elephant and Castle (anyone with a story about the
Infanta de Castille, get your coat now, you're leaving) is not that there
was a pub of that name there, but that it's the arms of the cutlers'
company, who owned the pub (or something). I'd guess that there's some
entity that has (or had) arms featuring three colts, and that this entity
was associated with Essex, given the places we've found. Could be a livery
company, a monastic order, a noble family, anything. I can't find any such
arms after a brief look, but that doesn't mean much. I've written to the
College of Arms to ask; i'll let you know if i hear back!

tom

PS It took me ages to dig up all that info. If Jelf pops up and posts the
answer off the top of his head, i'm going to wring his bloody neck!

[1] Offline right now, try Gogol's cache:

http://64.233.183.104/search?q=cache...o.u k/e1.html

--
It's amazing how often conversations with you have the imaginary sound
of human bones being crushed to rubble in the background. -- itchyfidget,
to snowking

Tom Anderson wrote:

Here's a good one. There was such a pub (in the first half of the 18th
century, i think) in the hamlet of Grove Street, which was presumably
somewhere along what we now call Grove Road:

http://www.british-history.ac.uk/rep...x?compid=22704

That article has a map which shows it (right at the bottom); finding
that spot on the Greenwood map reveals the name again:

http://users.bathspa.ac.uk/greenwood/map_a9h.html

Correlating that with a modern map puts it at the bridge over the
Hertford Union Canal - which, surprise surprise, is the Three Colts
Bridge you found.

Except the Three Colts Bridge is not in Grove Road - it's in Gunmakers Lane,
next to Gun Wharf. The Worshipful Company of Gunmakers logo is here
http://www.heraldicmedia.com/site/in...gunmakers.html , and
doesn't have three colts in it.

My theory is that it was a common name for pubs, and the places picked
their names up from pubs, as is not unusual (particularly for corners,
courts, yards, alleys, etc). The Victoria Park case is a striking
example of this: you have a pub in 17xx, a placename in 1827, and a
bridge today.
The really interesting question is why it was a common name for a
pub. The true secret behind the Elephant and Castle (anyone with a
story about the Infanta de Castille, get your coat now, you're
leaving) is not that there was a pub of that name there, but that
it's the arms of the cutlers' company, who owned the pub (or
something). I'd guess that there's some entity that has (or had) arms
featuring three colts, and that this entity was associated with
Essex,

Middlesex. Essex started at the Lea.

given the places we've found. Could be a livery company, a
monastic order, a noble family, anything. I can't find any such arms
after a brief look, but that doesn't mean much. I've written to the
College of Arms to ask; i'll let you know if i hear back!

Gosh. Thanks!

On 16 Jan, 23:23, Tom Anderson wrote:

(excellent & time consuming research callously snipped)

The really interesting question is why it was a common name for a pub. The
true secret behind the Elephant and Castle (anyone with a story about the
Infanta de Castille, get your coat now, you're leaving) [...]

.... but you have to admit, it's a great story, one that has been told
many a time in Newington Butts and beyond, and one that, in many ways,
I'm sad to see crushed under the weight of an enlightenment-driven
quest to rid the world of folk tales of dubious historical pedigree.

I have to say that I do tell people the Infanta story, carefully
prefixing it with my get out clause - "they say it's called the
Elephant & Castle because...". After giving it my best and allowing
for a pause for it to sink in, I normally proceed to recount the true
meaning behind the name. Though perhaps I've forgotten to get on to
that bit once or twice... or thrice... ;-)

Mizter T wrote:

I have to say that I do tell people the Infanta story, carefully
prefixing it with my get out clause - "they say it's called the
Elephant & Castle because...". After giving it my best and allowing
for a pause for it to sink in, I normally proceed to recount the true
meaning behind the name. Though perhaps I've forgotten to get on to
that bit once or twice... or thrice... ;-)

The internet seems a bit quiet on the connection between the Middlesex
Regiment and the numerous "The Case Is Altered" pubs in the Harrow area. I'm
wondering if that story is a myth too.

On 16 Jan, 23:23, Tom Anderson wrote:
Three Colts Corner is on Cheshire Street, "on left from Vallance [Road]".
Three Colts Lane is of course not far from there, being a continuation of
Cheshire Street itself, but they seem to be different. Speaking of
continuations of Cheshire Street, i notice that where now Sclater Street
becomes Cheshire Street on crossing Brick Lane, in 1827, it became Hare
Street, and only became Cheshire Street around where i think Three Colts
Corner is.

This spot was filmed for The Avengers:

http://avengerland.theavengers.tv/spotting/spot20.htm

Although i think the naming is supplied by this alleged Stephen Carter.

Funnily enough before this thread was posted I was looking at an East
London Line extension diagram (I do little else) and noticed the name.
It's the alley off Cheshire Street where the footbridge over the GEML
comes out. The south end of the footbridge is in Fleet Street Hill.
Turns out it's even on Google Maps:

http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?ll=51....68636&t=h&z=18

Another ELL diagram I have labels the road leading east of Brick Lane
as "Hare Street/Cheshire Street". Doesn't show where it ends.

U

--
http://londonconnections.blogspot.com/
A blog about transport projects in London

In message , Tom
Anderson writes

I'd guess that there's some entity that has (or had) arms featuring
three colts, and that this entity was associated with Essex, given the
places we've found. Could be a livery company, a monastic order, a
noble family, anything.

The three colts are the arms of the Colet family (colt=colet).

Sir Henry Colet was twice Lord Mayor of London and is buried in St
Dunstan's Stepney - he owned extensive property nearby, which passed to
his son, John Colet. The latter became vicar of Stepney and added
further property, and later became Dean of St Paul's, at which time he
used the income from the property to found St Paul's School, whose arms
still show the three colts to this day:

http://www.stpaulsschool.org.uk/page.aspx?id=8158

--
Paul Terry

Paul Terry wrote:
In message , Tom
Anderson writes

I'd guess that there's some entity that has (or had) arms featuring
three colts, and that this entity was associated with Essex, given
the places we've found. Could be a livery company, a monastic order,
a noble family, anything.

The three colts are the arms of the Colet family (colt=colet).

Sir Henry Colet was twice Lord Mayor of London and is buried in St
Dunstan's Stepney - he owned extensive property nearby, which passed
to his son, John Colet. The latter became vicar of Stepney and added
further property, and later became Dean of St Paul's, at which time he
used the income from the property to found St Paul's School, whose
arms still show the three colts to this day:

http://www.stpaulsschool.org.uk/page.aspx?id=8158

Gentlemen, we have a winner.

Thanks.