Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end signs at both ends
but are not dead ends at all. For instance in North Pinner, Barrow Point
Avenue/Lane has dead end signs at the junctions with Avenue Road and Oakhill
Avenue, but the road between them is a through road. The condition and age
of the tarmac suggest that if a barrier has been removed, it has not
happened recently.

This road is not a useful shortcut for any journey that doesn't start or end
within a few yards of it, so it is hard to know what purpose the deceiving
signs could serve. I would also like to know whether there are any
councillors living on it, since it seems to be the roads which contain a
councillor or two which are generally deemed to be too precious to be used
by the Hoi Poloi.

In the long term a policy of deceptive road signs will be counter
productive, because people will stop trusting them.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 22:16:20 +0100, "John Rowland"
wrote:

Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end signs at both ends
but are not dead ends at all. For instance in North Pinner, Barrow Point
Avenue/Lane has dead end signs at the junctions with Avenue Road and Oakhill
Avenue, but the road between them is a through road. The condition and age
of the tarmac suggest that if a barrier has been removed, it has not
happened recently.

[snip]

How old are the "no through road" signs?

Rob.
--
rob at robertwoolley dot co dot uk

"Robert Woolley" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 22:16:20 +0100, "John Rowland"
wrote:

Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end
signs at both ends but are not dead ends at all. For instance
in North Pinner, Barrow Point Avenue/Lane

How old are the "no through road" signs?

I don't think they were new, in this case.

--
John Rowland - Spamtrapped
Transport Plans for the London Area, updated 2001
http://www.geocities.com/Athens/Acro...69/tpftla.html
A man's vehicle is a symbol of his manhood.
That's why my vehicle's the Piccadilly Line -
It's the size of a county and it comes every two and a half minutes

On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 23:10:53 +0100, "John Rowland"
wrote:

"Robert Woolley" wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 8 Sep 2003 22:16:20 +0100, "John Rowland"
wrote:

Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end
signs at both ends but are not dead ends at all. For instance
in North Pinner, Barrow Point Avenue/Lane

How old are the "no through road" signs?

I don't think they were new, in this case.

The reason I ask, is whether at _some stage_ the roads were dead ends.

In the event of cock-up or conspiracy, start with the presumption of
cock-up.....


Rob.
--
rob at robertwoolley dot co dot uk

Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end
signs at both ends but are not dead ends at all. For instance
in North Pinner, Barrow Point Avenue/Lane

How old are the "no through road" signs?

I don't think they were new, in this case.

The reason I ask, is whether at _some stage_ the roads were dead ends.

In the event of cock-up or conspiracy, start with the presumption of
cock-up.....


Rob.

There used to be a similar sign in Beechwood Avenue, N3, and
Bartholomew shows it on their map as a no-through-road but in fact you
can use it to reach the North Circular (NE-bound only) and is useful
when there is too much traffic turning right from Finchley Road (A598)
because you can go straight ahead and turn right into Beechwood Avenue
to reach the North Circular.

I think there were originally plans to close off the link to the North
Circular when the by-pass was still planned.

John Rowland wrote:
Hi all,

I have recently found several roads which have dead-end signs at
both
ends but are not dead ends at all. For instance in North Pinner,
Barrow Point Avenue/Lane has dead end signs at the junctions with
Avenue Road and Oakhill Avenue, but the road between them is a
through road. The condition and age of the tarmac suggest that if a
barrier has been removed, it has not happened recently.

This road is not a useful shortcut for any journey that doesn't
start
or end within a few yards of it, so it is hard to know what purpose
the deceiving signs could serve. I would also like to know whether
there are any councillors living on it, since it seems to be the
roads which contain a councillor or two which are generally deemed
to
be too precious to be used by the Hoi Poloi.

In the long term a policy of deceptive road signs will be counter
productive, because people will stop trusting them.

I live in such a road. On most maps (A-Z, Street Finder, etc.) it
looks as though my road goes into the docks near Canary Wharf. In
reality there is only a pedestrian access to Mill Harbour and the
road goes through two 90 lefts and comes back on itself but vehicles
were virtually queuing up to ask locals how to get into the Docks.
The worst thing was that 40 foot trucks would get to the end, find no
exit and were too long to get round the corners to get out so they
would reverse the whole length of the road with a couple of inches to
spare from the residents' cars either side. Several kids got injured
and there were many more near misses!

I wrote to the Council (Tower Hamlets) several times but got no reply
so, when I had a chance to speak to the head of Highways at a public
meeting, I suggested that they put up signs saying "No Access to
Docklands". This was duly done but because the signs were only
2-foot square black on white nobody noticed them. After further
consultation the Council finally put up proper 'No Through Road'
signs and the problem was solved.

The road isn't a rat-run as it just comes out near where it comes in
but it does get busy with kids and adults going to the Leisure
Centre/Swimming Pool opposite me and the extra traffic and reversing
lorries had made it a nightmare.

BTW I am *not* a councillor, just one of the peasants who found his
voice and used it :-)

--

Phil ,,,^.".^,,,


---
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I live in such a road. On most maps (A-Z, Street Finder, etc.) it
looks as though my road goes into the docks near Canary Wharf. In
reality there is only a pedestrian access to Mill Harbour and the
road goes through two 90 lefts and comes back on itself but vehicles
were virtually queuing up to ask locals how to get into the Docks.
The worst thing was that 40 foot trucks would get to the end, find no
exit and were too long to get round the corners to get out so they
would reverse the whole length of the road with a couple of inches to
spare from the residents' cars either side. Several kids got injured
and there were many more near misses!

I wrote to the Council (Tower Hamlets) several times but got no reply
so, when I had a chance to speak to the head of Highways at a public
meeting, I suggested that they put up signs saying "No Access to
Docklands". This was duly done but because the signs were only
2-foot square black on white nobody noticed them. After further
consultation the Council finally put up proper 'No Through Road'
signs and the problem was solved.

The road isn't a rat-run as it just comes out near where it comes in
but it does get busy with kids and adults going to the Leisure
Centre/Swimming Pool opposite me and the extra traffic and reversing
lorries had made it a nightmare.

BTW I am *not* a councillor, just one of the peasants who found his
voice and used it :-)

--

Phil ,,,^.".^,,,

That seems to be the opposite - we are talking about roads that are
shown as dead-ends but really are through roads.

An example in Hampstead is Gayton Road off Hampstead High Street. It
has a sign "environmental area, no through route" but in fact will
take you through to Well Walk and East Heath Road where you can turn
left and rejoin the A502 at Hampstead Pond.

In fact you have many other chances to take this "rat-run", the first
one being a right-turn into Parkhill Road then a forced left into
Fleet Road which becomes South End Road and then East Heath Road.

Be warned though - there can be long tailbacks down East Heath Road up
to the pond (which is nowhere near Pond Street, by the way).