Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
London Transport (uk.transport.london) Discussion of all forms of transport in London. |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#10
|
|||
|
|||
378 move and GOB to be DC?
On Wed, 24 Sep 2008 00:36:19 +0100, Tom Anderson
wrote: On Tue, 23 Sep 2008, Paul Corfield wrote: On Tue, 23 Sep 2008 21:44:18 GMT, (Neil Williams) wrote: On Tue, 23 Sep 2008 13:56:18 -0700 (PDT), Rupert Candy wrote: Incidentally, why did they have to make a 'pretend Underground train' out of a watered-down suburban train with only 2 doors per side? Surely the future S stock would have made a much better base vehicle for this sort of application? The whole of LO appears to me to be an almighty expensive cop-out for a capital city. Look at Merseyrail for how it should be done (and without any new MUs), then try again. Tube-style trains are a compromise for the Tube. There is no need for a heavy-rail S-Bahn to be like that. That's an interesting comparison but I really don't see Overground being remotely like a German style S Bahn service. I suspect that if TfL had sought to construct Overground to the lavish specification that's typically used in Germany we'd have got precisely nowhere in terms of getting the lines improved. Hang on, hang on: what are the differences between what we're getting and what the Germans have got that are significant? I've never been to Germany or gone on any kind of bahn, so i don't know what they're like. They are like a mix of suburban train services with central area tunnel sections to distribute people into the central business district as well as providing a cross regional link. Not unlike Crossrail or the RER in some respects. Berlin has orbital services and I think the Rhine Ruhr does too but I don't see London Overground being remotely comparable to those sorts of networks. Is it seats vs standing space? Do S-bahnen have more? Isn't that because they're like a RER or Thameslink, and run from far out? Whereas the Goblin only runs for a few miles, so doesn't need to be all-seater, and since it's going to be two cars every fifteen minutes but will hopefully attract lots more people because of the rebranding, benefits from the extra standing capacity that comes with longitudinal seating. In my limited experience - I accept Neil will know more - the Germans have typically done a comprehensive rebuild and separation of S Bahn services from other services. Stations are rebuilt to a common standard, conflicting junctions are removed, signalling is redone, new fleets of trains are introduced and you usually get integrated ticketing. In some cases you also get underground sections through city centres to link up parts of the network and / or remove the problems of stub end terminals with all the reversing issues that arise. The service networks are often very extensive in their reach with pretty intensive service levels but I think some more recent schemes have been more modest in their scope to contain costs. We are getting new trains, tarted up stations (ignoring ELLX which is on a different scale), some signalling works and some limited segregation Highbury - Camden Road. We've also got Oyster ticketing which is partly integrated at the moment but obviously Overground is more to do with the rail network that say buses or DLR. Much of the infrastructure work is to try to accommodate ELLX reaching Highbury and to accommodate freight not segregate it! We've also just had yet more cost cutting at Camden Road which compromises the service offer and potentially service quality. I'm grateful we're getting the work done but a rebuild to S Bahn standards it is not - perhaps because the lines that constitute Overground could never really mirror what I see as a German S Bahn network. Still I'm sure we'll see Neil's response in due time and see what aspects he is critical of. Basically i don't get the use of 'tube-style trains' as a diss. Tube-style trains aren't a compromise, they're exactly what's needed on the tube. If it's the paucity of doors that's being criticised, then i'm with that. Given that none of us have travelled in a 378 or seen one in action yet I think it's too early to be critical. Having seen one or two busy NLL trains I can see why there is an emphasis on standing space rather than seats. Whether the design is correct internally we shall wait and see. I doubt it will prove impossible to rejig the interior if it is deemed not to "work" correctly. -- Paul C |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
GOB Class 172s | London Transport | |||
Class 378 in service | London Transport | |||
New platform markings for class 378 at Shepherd's Bush | London Transport | |||
OT - BA postpones long-haul move to T5 | London Transport | |||
Waterloo - KX post Eurostar move | London Transport |