"Jack Taylor" wrote in message
...
wrote:

They might well put up platform protection for staff working on the
station - but I would imagine that the normal 5mph limit through the
station will apply. Allowing trains to pass through faster would cause
chaos with the timetables, not som much on the central section where all
trains are doing the same but on the branches where other services
interface.

I did not think that there was much interface with service on other
branches, really. Can you give some examples, out of curiosity?

On Mar 14, 1:42*pm, wrote:
"Jack Taylor" wrote in message

...

wrote:

They might well put up platform protection for staff working on the
station - but I would imagine that the normal 5mph limit through the
station will apply. Allowing trains to pass through faster would cause
chaos with the timetables, not som much on the central section where all
trains are doing the same but on the branches where other services
interface.

I did not think that there was much interface with service on other
branches, really. Can you give some examples, out of curiosity?

Hammersmith and City from Aldgate East, Piccadilly Line at Acton Town
- Ealing Common (and from Hammersmith occasionally), North London Line
Gunnersbury - Richmond, ECS South West Trains Wimbledon - Putney. I
think that the killer spot would be Aldgate East, arriving early there
would cause the most problems.

wrote in message
...

:Hammersmith and City from Aldgate East, Piccadilly Line at Acton Town
- Ealing Common (and from Hammersmith occasionally), North London Line
Gunnersbury - Richmond, ECS South West Trains Wimbledon - Putney. I
think that the killer spot would be Aldgate East, arriving early there
would cause the most problems.

So, it would be just too much work and upset for a situation that is going
to be temporary, regardless of the extended length of time it will be out of
service?

On Mar 14, 2:22*pm, wrote:
wrote in message

...

:Hammersmith and City from Aldgate East, Piccadilly Line at Acton Town
- Ealing Common (and from Hammersmith occasionally), North London Line
Gunnersbury - Richmond, ECS South West Trains Wimbledon - Putney. I
think that the killer spot would be Aldgate East, arriving early there
would cause the most problems.

So, it would be just too much work and upset for a situation that is going
to be temporary, regardless of the extended length of time it will be out of
service?

I'd say so, trains are unlikely to be able to run past at speed for
all of the closure period, as there will be work on the platforms
towards the end of the rebuild. Of course, there will still be some
extra time, as most of the station stop time is the allowance for
doors opening, passengers getting on/off and doors closing. As
Blackfriars is only 600m from Mansion House and 760m from Temple
(according to Quail), line speeds will not be very high in the area.

On Mar 14, 2:07*pm, wrote:
On Mar 14, 1:42*pm, wrote:

"Jack Taylor" wrote in message

...

wrote:

They might well put up platform protection for staff working on the
station - but I would imagine that the normal 5mph limit through the
station will apply. Allowing trains to pass through faster would cause
chaos with the timetables, not som much on the central section where all
trains are doing the same but on the branches where other services
interface.

I did not think that there was much interface with service on other
branches, really. Can you give some examples, out of curiosity?

Hammersmith and City from Aldgate East, Piccadilly Line at Acton Town
- Ealing Common (and from Hammersmith occasionally), North London Line
Gunnersbury - Richmond, ECS South West Trains Wimbledon - Putney. I
think that the killer spot would be Aldgate East, arriving early there
would cause the most problems.

I find it hard to believe that the timing of the service is all that
precise in practice. My impression is that they always wait around
anyway, at Aldgate East, Earls Court and just about anywhere.

More likely, it would add a tiny bit of recovery potential to the line
if they could run through at greater speed.

On Mar 14, 2:39*pm, MIG wrote:
On Mar 14, 2:07*pm, wrote:





On Mar 14, 1:42*pm, wrote:

"Jack Taylor" wrote in message

...

wrote:

They might well put up platform protection for staff working on the
station - but I would imagine that the normal 5mph limit through the
station will apply. Allowing trains to pass through faster would cause
chaos with the timetables, not som much on the central section where all
trains are doing the same but on the branches where other services
interface.

I did not think that there was much interface with service on other
branches, really. Can you give some examples, out of curiosity?

Hammersmith and City from Aldgate East, Piccadilly Line at Acton Town
- Ealing Common (and from Hammersmith occasionally), North London Line
Gunnersbury - Richmond, ECS South West Trains Wimbledon - Putney. I
think that the killer spot would be Aldgate East, arriving early there
would cause the most problems.

I find it hard to believe that the timing of the service is all that
precise in practice. *My impression is that they always wait around
anyway, at Aldgate East, Earls Court and just about anywhere.


Underground working times are in half minute blocks and yes, the
timing are that precise for the working timetables. Of course,
individual trains won't all run exactly to the timings, but they
should be close. Trains hang about at the junctions partly because of
the slack in the timetables, allowing trains to run an extra minute
faster, means that this minute has to be lost before the junction or
the interacting service has to be retimed as well. The District line
is particularly hard to timetable, due to the interactions on the
branches and the knock on effects on the H&C and Met lines.

More likely, it would add a tiny bit of recovery potential to the line
if they could run through at greater speed.

But is it worth the cost of the alterations to the signalling? You get
more recovery time from not actually stopping and opening / closing
the doors than you can from increasing speed through the station from
the approach control speed to, say, 30 mph.

wrote:
On Mar 14, 2:39 pm, MIG wrote:

I find it hard to believe that the timing of the service is all that
precise in practice. My impression is that they always wait around
anyway, at Aldgate East, Earls Court and just about anywhere.

Underground working times are in half minute blocks and yes, the
timing are that precise for the working timetables. Of course,
individual trains won't all run exactly to the timings, but they
should be close.

I agree with MIG. My experience is that on the District the timings are
frequently NOT close to the WTT. It's partly because the Circle Line is
prone to delays that it can't recover from, but the District itself
often gets its trains out of sequence, as you can see any day at Earl's
Court westbound. In my view LU have done little over the last 30 years
to improve punctuality and frequency of the District. The WTT is a nice
theoretical exercise, but in practice I don't see much effort put into
making it a reality on a minute-by-minute basis.
--
Richard J.
(to email me, swap 'uk' and 'yon' in address)

On Mar 14, 10:35*pm, "Richard J." wrote:
wrote:
On Mar 14, 2:39 pm, MIG wrote:
I find it hard to believe that the timing of the service is all that
precise in practice. *My impression is that they always wait around
anyway, at Aldgate East, Earls Court and just about anywhere.
Underground working times are in half minute blocks and yes, the
timing are that precise for the working timetables. Of course,
individual trains won't all run exactly to the timings, but they
should be close.

I agree with MIG. *My experience is that on the District the timings are
frequently NOT close to the WTT. *It's partly because the Circle Line is
prone to delays that it can't recover from, but the District itself
often gets its trains out of sequence, as you can see any day at Earl's
Court westbound. *In my view LU have done little over the last 30 years
to improve punctuality and frequency of the District. The WTT is a nice
theoretical exercise, but in practice I don't see much effort put into
making it a reality on a minute-by-minute basis.

But the delays vary from day to day. You still need a working plan. I
agree that LUL have done little to vary the timetable, but I don't
know what they can do without reducing the current frequency. It will
be interesting to see if the Tea-Cup service helps, as it will remove
the Circle line delays.