d wrote:
Had to get the tube to work today for obvious reasons. Nice to see a 2.80
fare has gone up to 3.10. And for that extra 30p I get a 15 minute delay
on the central line due to some signal failure or other. Oh what a surprise.

No, that's just expensive. A rip-off would be something like a return
journey Local--KX, a 13 min turnaround and return KX-Local. Rip-off,
because I got charged £4 on (return) entry at KX and again at Local
station. Then spend 20min on hold + 10m in conversation at 5p/min to
get a refund sent to the wrong station gates (hence I'll have to get it
re-setup somehow). I'm sure there used to be a "call-back" option,
but maybe that didn't produce enough revenue.

And where can I find out about the time-out or whatever at KX that
deliberately and unfairly overcharged me (twice!) for a completely
unremarkable journey. where I touched in/out just fine? Nowhere that
I can see.

#Paul

wrote in message

d wrote:
Had to get the tube to work today for obvious reasons. Nice to see a
2.80 fare has gone up to 3.10. And for that extra 30p I get a 15
minute delay
on the central line due to some signal failure or other. Oh what a
surprise.

No, that's just expensive. A rip-off would be something like a return
journey Local--KX, a 13 min turnaround and return KX-Local. Rip-off,
because I got charged £4 on (return) entry at KX and again at Local
station. Then spend 20min on hold + 10m in conversation at 5p/min to
get a refund sent to the wrong station gates (hence I'll have to get
it re-setup somehow). I'm sure there used to be a "call-back" option,
but maybe that didn't produce enough revenue.

And where can I find out about the time-out or whatever at KX that
deliberately and unfairly overcharged me (twice!) for a completely
unremarkable journey. where I touched in/out just fine? Nowhere that
I can see.

That's one of the less obvious downsides of OSI.

wrote

No, that's just expensive. A rip-off would be something like a
return
journey Local--KX, a 13 min turnaround and return KX-Local. Rip-off,
because I got charged £4 on (return) entry at KX and again at Local
station. Then spend 20min on hold + 10m in conversation at 5p/min to

And where can I find out about the time-out or whatever at KX that
deliberately and unfairly overcharged me (twice!) for a completely
unremarkable journey. where I touched in/out just fine? Nowhere that
I can see.

Surely you read this NG as well as posting to it (VBG) ?

Kings Cross has always been a OSI (Out of station interchange), as
discussed here, with from 15 to 40 minutes allowed to pass another
gateline as part of the same journey. So with a "13 min turnaround" it
seems likely that you were trapped by the maximum journey time rule and
charged for two incomplete journeys

To check needs the zone of "Local" since this changed from the old
fixed 2.5 hours to formulas like (M-F) 70 minutes plus 10 minutes per
zone and IIRC this has just been amended a bit.

One poster showed that touching in on a bus would terminate a journey !

Too much for one booklet ?

$$ there will be a series of "Oyster customer guides" (4 in total) to
$$ replace the traditional fares booklet (deemed to be too complicated
for
$$ passengers to understand). The guides should be available at LU
stations
$$ from (4/Jan/10).

Given the vastly increased OSIs (with the extension of Oyster PAYG to
National Rail) and the changes in the maximum journey time rule more
people are going to be caught and charged £8 /OR/, if lucky, charged
half price.

ps, there are several Oyster Helpline numbers, another leaflet is
needed to select the cheapest for your circumstances, time of day etc.
but 0845 could be 2p/min or less from a BT landline when I last checked
http://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/


--
Mike D

"Michael R N Dolbear" wrote in message
news:01ca8ecc$a067a4e0$LocalHost@default
wrote

No, that's just expensive. A rip-off would be something like a
return journey Local--KX, a 13 min turnaround and return KX-Local.
Rip-off, because I got charged £4 on (return) entry at KX and again
at Local station. Then spend 20min on hold + 10m in conversation at
5p/min to

And where can I find out about the time-out or whatever at KX that
deliberately and unfairly overcharged me (twice!) for a completely
unremarkable journey. where I touched in/out just fine? Nowhere that
I can see.

Surely you read this NG as well as posting to it (VBG) ?

Kings Cross has always been a OSI (Out of station interchange), as
discussed here, with from 15 to 40 minutes allowed to pass another
gateline as part of the same journey. So with a "13 min turnaround" it
seems likely that you were trapped by the maximum journey time rule
and charged for two incomplete journeys

Wouldn't simply returning to the original station have the same effect?
But, if Paul had returned to a station one stop away, within the now
very complicated maximum time rules, he might have had a bargain
instead.

Recliner wrote
....
"Michael R N Dolbear" wrote

Kings Cross has always been a OSI (Out of station interchange), as
discussed here, with from 15 to 40 minutes allowed to pass another
gateline as part of the same journey. So with a "13 min turnaround"
it
seems likely that you were trapped by the maximum journey time rule
and charged for two incomplete journeys

Wouldn't simply returning to the original station have the same
effect?
But, if Paul had returned to a station one stop away, within the now
very complicated maximum time rules, he might have had a bargain
instead.

Not sure, lacking experimental data, but provided you took at least 15
minutes I thought you were just charged for a 1 zone excepyt that if
the OSI made it a continuous journey the logic for the pink route
validators may have noted a journey via zone 1, hee !

Various people have done a touch in/out just to collect, variously, a
online top-up, set up auto top-up or go home to collect something so
maybe the 15 minutes is for the second entry as an anti-passback
measure ?

--
Mike D

ps, there are several Oyster Helpline numbers, another leaflet is
needed to select the cheapest for your circumstances, time of day etc.
but 0845 could be 2p/min or less from a BT landline when I last checkedhttp://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/

--
Mike D


PPS saynoto0870 is your friend here

Phil

wrote


ps, there are several Oyster Helpline numbers, another leaflet is
needed to select the cheapest for your circumstances, time of day
etc.
but 0845 could be 2p/min or less from a BT landline when I last
checkedhttp://www.telecom-tariffs.co.uk/

PPS saynoto0870 is your friend here

As noted in my other post there is now only one geographical
suggestion.

SN http://www.saynoto0870.com suggests
SN ring 020 7222 5600 (-main TfL Switchboard - ask for Oystercard
SN Ticketing & Refunds -Available Monday-Friday 8am to 6pm only)

http://www.saynoto0870.com/cgi-bin/f...num=1229787187
== quote
New Oyster Helpline! (TfL)
Reply #10 - Dec 28th, 2009, 9:05am Hi there!
I was trying to get through to the Oyster helpline the other day and
found out that the number provided here (020-7227-7891 - a
non-geographical alternative [...]) now just redirects to a
message telling me to "please put down the handset and call
08453309876". [...]
== end quote

--
Mike D

Paul Corfield wrote:
Well yes but OSIs have "sides" that are logically paired. If you
re-enter the same side that you exited from it should not continue the
original journey. More detail on precisely what the OP did would
confirm whether the OSI acted properly or not.

Exitted old Northern line (etc) gateline; back through the
new one just to see what it was like (eg any more accessible
with luggage etc). Local station was Canada Water.

#Paul