In article
,
(Mizter T) wrote:

On Jul 18, 10:11*pm, wrote:

In article ,
(Basil Jet) wrote:

On 18/07/2010 13:10, Tom Anderson wrote:

On Sun, 18 Jul 2010, David Walters wrote:

The payment station takes credit cards, and keys,

But not Oyster?

Maybe the deposit is more than anyone has on their Oyster card.

What deposits? How will the enforce the excess charges?

Card pre-authorisation.

Makes sense. Another detail not (yet) on the web site, though.

--
Colin Rosenstiel

On Jul 18, 11:34*pm, :

(Mizter T) wrote:

On Jul 18, 10:11*pm, wrote:
[snip]
What deposits? How will the enforce the excess charges?

Card pre-authorisation.

Makes sense. Another detail not (yet) on the web site, though.

The scheme hasn't launched yet, so the webpages don't cover all the
details and I don't think that's unreasonable either.

The requirement for a deposit of sorts, via card pre-authorisation,
can be inferred by the "Other charges" that feature on the website -
£300 for a non-return charge, "up to £300" for damage. And some sort
of deposit is needed (others can feel free to argue against this but
it's the only way such a scheme will work) - AIUI this is how most
other similar schemes operate in other cities.

What's not clear is whether or not a potential user will need £300 (or
£150 or whatever) in available funds in their account (via their
credit/debit card) to be able to rent a bike - i.e. those at the edge
of their overdraft or credit card credit limit, or those without an
overdraft and only a small bit of money in their account, will they be
able to access the scheme?

Also it's not clear how it'll work for those with annual membership -
will there be a card pre-authorisation requirement for them, or will
they provide adequate proof of their identity so that TfL (well,
actually Serco, the operators of the scheme) can track them down if
there's an issue such as a missing or damaged bike?

The answers to the above will of course become clear shortly.

Incidentally, FWIW I can imagine that one might only be able to apply
for membership from the date the scheme actually launches, or possibly
even later than that if the membership back-office infrastructure is
not yet fully sorted out - if there's a priority then it'll be
launching the scheme on the prescribed day (30 July) - getting the
bikes out there, making sure they pay stations work etc - and other
things might have to wait. Should this occur I can imagine the write
ups decrying the scheme as being an instant and dismal failure!

On Jul 19, 12:13*pm, Mizter T wrote:
[snip]
Incidentally, FWIW I can imagine that one might only be able to apply
for membership from the date the scheme actually launches, or possibly
even later than that if the membership back-office infrastructure is
not yet fully sorted out - if there's a priority then it'll be
launching the scheme on the prescribed day (30 July) - getting the
bikes out there, making sure they pay stations work etc - and other
things might have to wait. Should this occur I can imagine the write
ups decrying the scheme as being an instant and dismal failure!

Well, I got that completely wrong then (as per usual)! As David
Walters post upthread recounts, it turns out that for the first month
the scheme will only be available for those with an annual membership,
so "occasional users" (i.e. those wanting 24-hour or 7-day access)
will have to wait - meanwhile sign-up for annual membership opens on
the 23 July, that's this coming Friday.

In message
,
Mizter T writes

What's not clear is whether or not a potential user will need £300 (or
£150 or whatever) in available funds in their account (via their
credit/debit card) to be able to rent a bike

I suspect they will. According to a rather old BBC article on the scheme
....

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...00/8293273.stm

.... "You'll use credit cards to place an automatic refundable deposit on
the bike".

In other words, pax won't be able to hire the bike (even for the free 30
minutes) unless they have enough credit to pay the deposit. Once the
bike is returned, the deposit is then refunded to the card by means of a
charge back.

Those with limited funds might therefore be disappointed if hiring a
bike to go on a shopping trip
--
Paul Terry

On Jul 19, 6:10*pm, Paul Terry wrote:

Mizter T wrote:

What's not clear is whether or not a potential user will need £300 (or
£150 or whatever) in available funds in their account (via their
credit/debit card) to be able to rent a bike

I suspect they will. According to a rather old BBC article on the scheme
...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/local/london/h...id_8293000/829...

... "You'll use credit cards to place an automatic refundable deposit on
the bike".

In other words, pax won't be able to hire the bike (even for the free 30
minutes) unless they have enough credit to pay the deposit. Once the
bike is returned, the deposit is then refunded to the card by means of a
charge back.

Yes, I can't quite see how it'd work otherwise using card pre-
authorisation.


Those with limited funds might therefore be disappointed if hiring a
bike to go on a shopping trip

"But I know I've got enough in my account to buy this engagement
ring... it's a spontaneous thing, you see..."

That said, the scheme (and charging regime) is designed to steer
people towards returning bikes to docking stations after they've
finished their journey, rather than locking them up and keeping them
for themselves - I understand one of the bits of advice that London
(in the form of TfL) got from the Paris Velib scheme was not to
include an integral lock in the bike - the lock on the Paris bikes is
apparently a bit on the puny side, and fairly easily overcome, so
hirers who locked their bikes up were coming back to find them gone.
So the logic being employed in the London scheme is that it's better
from both a security and also a circulation and availability of hire
cycle standpoint that bikes are returned back to docking stations, not
locked up and idle for however long.

And given all that, our hero in search of the engagement ring will in
all likelihood have returned his bike to a docking station before
heading into Graff's or along Hatton Garden - his problem may then
come when he tries to hire a bike to race back to his hopeful
prospect, who may be cooling on him as the seconds pass.

That said, I realise the flaw in my proposition - the card pre-
authorisation would likely be levied at the same time as the 24-hour
or 7-day access fee was taken, so the reserved amount would then not
become available until that period had expired. In which case, our
groom might have got not further than the docking station outside the
palatial self-appointed two-star Pimlico hotel before having to resort
to slower means of moving, leaving our bride to be rather too much
time to ponder the passion-numbing subject of just how long it's been
since a Hoover has seen the carpet under the hotel bed...